[OP]
Contributor
I need to build bunch of drawers -- 25 or so in a closet and then a bunch in the workshop. Thus far every drawer I've built -- kitchen -- using half blind dovetails.
How big of a mistake would it be to just use butt joints and pocket hole screws. The screws would only be visible from the back. The front would have a false front attached.
Clearly not as strong but would they fail? They will alone riding on ball bearing drawer slides.
Bob C
Member
Pocket screws would work. Use glue.
This would be better. Not as quick as pocket screws.
Member
Pocket screws will work fine. I have done destructive testing on 3/4" plywood held together with pocket screws (no glue) similar to what you are proposing and they are more than strong enough. A recent project of mine was building a new router table (New Yankee Workshop style) with lots of super sturdy drawers and pocket screws worked out great. I didn't really worry that much about exposed fasteners. If you have a plan for dealing with appearance issues, then I say go for it.
Contributor
Are you making the drawers from plywood or solid lumber?
I use Leo's corner in plywood. It works very well. There's facegrain-to-facegrain glue area with plywood. I don't use it with solid lumber. The glue faces will all have endgrain faces.
Contributor
That is exactly what I did for my shop drawers. The pocket holes face out the front and the back of the drawer. The front is covered with the false front and the ones at the back cannot be seen when the drawer is installed. It makes for a clean look inside the drawer and they are relatively fast to build. I've not had any structural issues building them this way.
Tom
Member
I am very interested in this thread, question. I hope the OP doesn't mind an additional question. Leo, in your pictures, how do you attach the bottom of the drawer? I too am looking at a new project that will include creating a lot of drawers and they won't be holding a lot of weight....drawers for clothes mainly.
Member
As above, pocket screws are absolutely fine for drawers, have done many this way myself. The screws tend to creep a bit when power driving so I usually hand drive them for the last 2-3 turns. Seems to keep the joints aligned better.
Biscuits, dowels or Confirmats are also acceptable.
Contributor
If you're not worried about the aesthetic, the pocket screws will work great. If the drawers for the shop are big and deep, and will hold a lot of weight, you may want to reinforce the butt joint, but a normal butt joint with pocket screws is pretty strong.
"The first thing you need to know, will likely be the last thing you learn." (Unknown)
Member
My shop drawers are butt jointed, glued and nailed with 18g brads. Never had one fail.
-Lud
Member
The pocket screws with some glue make a decent drawer, possibly better in plywood than solid, but they work either way. To me drawer construction is one of those things that can really bring out the opinions of wood workers, search some old posts, can get hot. My take is its kind of like a dress code. Some styles of dress are more appropriate or even required at certain times, other occasions call for something more casual. Entering a juried furniture competition? Better to not pocket screw your drawers. In fact a soon as somebody tells me "applied fronts" my very next though is "I don't care whats behind them, all bets are off!". When I make dovetails its by hand, half blind integral fronts. I've always found kitchen cabs with dovetail drawers and applied fronts to be a major wast of time and money. They are strong, but its like driving an armored car to your day job...assuming your not an armored car driver. Drawer running on slides.....almost any construction is going to work. At work all the drawers for high end work get dovetailed, but there is a machine that spits them out, so its pretty much as fast as pocket screws but easier to assemble.
The one thing I don't like about pocket screw drawers is assembly. You start with four butt joints, no mechanical connection, no assembly aids, and the screws want to push the wood just a bit of the mark as they torque down. It can be a bit challenging to achieve square. For a few quick drawers I've used pocket screws, I keep the bottoms real tight to the opening to help square things up as thats really the only thing you have. But if I'm making more than a few I find its actually easier to set up for a tongue and rabbit, a drawer lock joint, even a simple shallow dado on the sides to give some mechanical reference fro keeping things square and plumb in three directions. I've come to the conclusion that when I add up all my time from stock prep through instillation (and installation of an out of square drawer can be more challenging) pocket screw drawers are not actually my quickest option. Try a pocket hole drawer sample for yourself and see if you like them! Its worth doing a test before committing a lot of stock to it.
"A good miter set up is like yoga pants: it makes everyone's butts look good." Prashun Patel
[OP]
Contributor
Great. I should have mentioned these will be made using solid wood, Ash, and I will be glueing them as well
Regarding the bottoms, I just cut a dado in three sides and make the back shorter so that I can slide the bottom in once the drawer is constructed
Member
Good method and easy to square up. I wouldn't over think it - especially if they're for the shop. I don't carry the OCD for my shop built stuff though, I'd go crazy. I love ugly and pragmatic shop cabs and jigs.Originally Posted by Bob Cooper
-Lud
Contributor
One thing that will make pocket screws easier to assemble is using a 23g pinner to tack things together.You won't notice the tiny hole it leaves, especially if you fill them, it will make the process go alot smoother.
Contributor
I built a closet organizer using pocket screws for drawer assembly. I used Woodpeckers box clamps to hole the pieces together while pocket screwing ang the srawers stayed aligned with no component movement. Drawers came out perfectly square and are strong. I used no glue in assembly.
George
Making sawdust regularly, occasionally a project is completed.
Contributor
The guys up in Cow Hampshire who built our kitchen cabinets ~15 years ago assured us that their butt joined and screwed drawers were "so strong you could't break them if you wanted to". Over the next 10 years all of them that carried any weight at all failed at those "super strong" corners. I replaced them as they failed with BB boxes made as #2 above (slightly different proportions to the joint), none of which had had any problems up until the time we sold the house. So my experience with glued and screwed butt joints for drawers is 100% negative. For solid wood I use through dovetails, cut on a jig so they are fast and easy--they don't need to look beautiful for utility cabinets. I can't imagine that the 10 minutes per drawer time savings of not making some kind of mechanical joint is not worthwhile.
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