Hi Malcolm, actually that's one of the reasons I like the Festool vac, they use a bag.
I guess that's the industrial approach in me, if you're concerned about hazardous fine dust, you want a bag so you're not exposed to it when emptying it.
At work we use a Dust Deputy for vacuuming dust, particularly when drilling concrete, it separates so much out that we don't change the bag more than once or twice a year....Rod.
I use a bag in my Ridgid vac for the same reasons that Rod mentioned. They're not that expensive and my vac doesn't fill up that quickly - I mostly use it connected to my sanders so most of the swarf is sanding dust. Makes it much easier to dispose of the swarf and the primary filter stays clean so I get consistent vacuuming.
Mike
Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.
One thing to note also is that the older R2D2 style Feins are reportedly a much better vac than the newer models. i don't personally have any comparison other than i have a 15ish year old R2D2 style turbo 2 and my dealer keeps telling me to hold onto it as this unit is way better than the newer models. In the hepa world and osha compliance festool is not out of line on their pricing. If you want to see some crazy pricing on a hepa rated vac take a look at the Hilti line. The model that compares to the CT36E (self cleaning fine dust model) is over 1k now. Hilti's are hepa rated and designed for concrete dust. Love my Hilti stuff as it is definitely a pro tool in terms of quality and the pricing shows it.
I ended up getting the Fein Turbo 1 and got a HEPA filter, $388 total. Liking it very much so far, the suction with the Domino and 125 sander is great! No dust left in the mortise or on the board when sanding, can't imagine that the Festool would do any better.
Thanks everyone for their advice and help!!
The suction power will be very similar. The advantages of the Festool will be in variable suction, convenience, anti-static, stacking tools on top, etc. The HEPA cert on the Festool will be important to many commercial users.
The calibrated air leak for variable suction on the new Feins is just one reason why I wouldn't replace on of my older Feins with the new models. The Festools are easily worth the price difference to some buyers. The Ridgid 1450 is great for others. Sounds like you have a reasonable compromise for your needs.
Yes, the bag is required on the Festool vac. It fills up pretty tightly and has taken me 6-12 months to fill one bag, but that's just for sanders. I recently used it when flatten a couple of slabs with a router sled. Mostly, I was hoping it would pick up the fine dust and it did a pretty good job. Then the vac suddenly stopped working. The bag was chock full, the first time I let it fill that far. I've even used it to pick up drywall dust from a pole sander. I thought that would clog the bag but it didn't.
“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness..." - Mark Twain
I have a Festool CT36 HEPA, Fein Turbo 1, and Nilfisk Attix 8 converted to HEPA.
IMHO, for woodworking: 1. nilfisk (good ergos, good power, relatively quiet, more refined, multiple layers of safeties); 2. Fein (more power, still quiet, more tougher, poor ergonomics and hose storage) 3. Festool (weaker real life power than the nilfisk, more audible--since noise is at higher register, well thought out stacking system).
If you're not extremely stacked for space (need to clip in systainers on your vac, or carry a Mirka Deros on your vac), I personally think the Fein is best.
For overall wet/dry utility and severe abusive use, I think my Fein is best. Two weeks ago, a leak came because my neighbor clogged the pipes. The Nilfisk would have about 60% of the suction of the fein, not hold as much water (due to hose position), and make an annoying alert sound if the airflow went below a certain level. The Fein soldered on...after maybe an hour of severe abuse, the motor would shut down to cool off. The festool stayed in the back like the drawer queen it is.
Personally, I'd recommend getting a used FEIN with variable suction and auto start---they go cheap, and are better than the new ones. Or you can get a Nilfisk with variable suction and auto start--they are sometimes made for other brands too.
IMHO, the Festool is best thought of as a portable systainer cart that has a functional hepa vacuum attached.
Btw, I'm not bashing the Festool at all. I pull out my festool ct36 (along with my tool systainers) when I need to have a break and do woodworking behind my office. It works extremely well as a convenient portable tool workshop of sorts when paired with a portable work bench.
I forgot to mention that Nilfisk confusingly has multiple options of the same vac:
Plain/ Tool triggered/ Tool trigger with auto clean/ Tool trigger with manual clean (my version).
All have variable suction.
The cheaper versions tend to be Plain (like for Stihl).
Makita has the Tool trigger with autoclean.
Mirka has the tool trigger with manual clean (most useful IMO, since the autoclean can result in bad things when you use a sander with the vac).
Festool has updated their vacs. They have strengthened the hose garage and designed a new hose. The new hose is smooth on the outside with no ridges to catch on the edge of tables or boards. No release date for North America has been announced yet.
FWIW, even though I may sound like a Festool basher, I'm a huge fan of how they implement their ergonomics and organization. As a hobbyist, I just can't justify too many of their tools when I can find something cheaper that works as well (Makita track saw, Nilfisk/Fein vac), better (Mirka Deros), or build something better (Paulk workbench).
Maybe I should save up for their router? The dust collection seems pretty sweet.
Matt, I do have to say that the dust collection on the OF1400 has been really good and with multiple options for collection, depending on the job at hand, it's flexible, too.
--
The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...
Thanks for the tip. Any thoughts on the OF1010?