Squaring Up Really Long Boards... Tips?

[William Fretwell]

Anuj, your double cut method relies on the width of the second cut removing some of the error from the first cut, which it will, it could be repeated as required. For real wood however the edge finish from the saw is not as good as a planed edge that could produce an almost invisible join, depending on the grain.
As for edge joining plywood where half the layered wood is running the wrong way, the result is more cosmetic than structural. Your choice of epoxy was wise as a gap filling adhesive!

[Robert Engel]

Erich,

Sounds like you've got a handle on it, but I would offer a few suggestions:

Be aware a long board must be well supported along its length or it may bow in the middle as you plane.

Have you checked your plane for flatness? Any slight variations at the toe or heel of the plane will affect the beginning and end of the board.

I will mention planing technique. I hope I'm not insulting you but just for edification, lots of toe pressure at the beginning, and little to no toe pressure at the the end. Also, I like to hold my hand low on the tote for me it seems to work better.

Finally, +1 on spring joint & grain direction (if hand planing).

[Brian Holcombe]

First thing is to forget about the ticking clock, and the wood will win every battle so it needs to become an ally.

Next, you need better prepare yourself for this job. You need a longer straight edge, a 4' isn't going to be all that helpful. 96" is where I would start, that will give you a better idea of where the edge is overall. Then you need to prepare two edges to meet. Get them close, then tune them to mate each other rather than trying to get the entirety of each board perfectly flat and square.

A slight gap in the center is needed for a tight glue up, the gap closes with clamping in the center and the edges become very tight.

I do long glue ups with a lot of clamps, two boards at a time. I clamp every 6"-8".

Winding sticks are the most important tool that the hand tool user (or any woodworker) has, use them to check your edge for accuracy to itself, not to the board face. If the board face is out of square then referencing it is useless. You'll need a general squareness, but once that is accomplished the edge needs to be flat in order to mate well to the accompanying edge.

This is the biggest area of screw up with long thin board edges in my experience. People check along the edge with a square, not realizing that the board reference face is not perfectly flat, and then the two boards won't mate well when edged up together even though they're both interpreted as square. A winding stick removes that source of error.

[Jim Koepke]

Brian's suggestion about winding sticks clicked and reminded me of an online write up on making straight edges for use as winding sticks:

https://www.scribd.com/document/5009...s-from-Scratch

Page two of this requires one to sign up for an account at the SCRIBD site. It will be in your Private Messages.

Using this method you can make 11' winding sticks which should be easy to glue up with or without spring.

jtk

[Brian Holcombe]

Jim, the winding sticks should be about 12-16” long. Any longer and they will be difficult to balance on an edge.

[Jim Koepke]

Jim, the winding sticks should be about 12-16” long. Any longer and they will be difficult to balance on an edge.

My wording was likely misleading. My point is using the method of making winding sticks, with the three straight faces, could work for making 11' pieces that match to be glued.

Many of the techniques mentioned in this thread so far are used by machinist to make a straight edge from scratch.

It also works for wood. The length is dependent on the one making the straight edges.

jtk

[William Fretwell]

first thing is to forget about the ticking clock, and the wood will win every battle so it needs to become an ally.

Next, you need better prepare yourself for this job. You need a longer straight edge, a 4' isn't going to be all that helpful. 96" is where i would start, that will give you a better idea of where the edge is overall. Then you need to prepare two edges to meet. Get them close, then tune them to mate each other rather than trying to get the entirety of each board perfectly flat and square.

A slight gap in the center is needed for a tight glue up, the gap closes with clamping in the center and the edges become very tight.

I do long glue ups with a lot of clamps, two boards at a time. I clamp every 6"-8".

Winding sticks are the most important tool that the hand tool user (or any woodworker) has, use them to check your edge for accuracy to itself, not to the board face. If the board face is out of square then referencing it is useless. You'll need a general squareness, but once that is accomplished the edge needs to be flat in order to mate well to the accompanying edge.

This is the biggest area of screw up with long thin board edges in my experience. People check along the edge with a square, not realizing that the board reference face is not perfectly flat, and then the two boards won't mate well when edged up together even though they're both interpreted as square. A winding stick removes that source of error.

this is excellent advise!

[Reinis Kanders]

Home depot has 8' length Empire level. Has worked for me pretty well as a reference and was only around $100 some 2-3 years ago.

[Erich Weidner]

For better or for worse, I'm forging ahead with the panel glue-ups after using the track saw. Gaps seem to be closing pretty well. Using cauls and clamping about every 12". I need to get more clamps...

The first glue up definitely "cupped" I'm dealing with 7 boards to make the width (the original, now fired trim carpenter ripped everything at 5"). Definitely the 2nd panel glue up went better tonight. Much flatter. I have (a minor) surgery on Thursday. Will likely be out of commission through Fri-Sat, and need this installed (even if unfinished) by Tuesday to not impact deadlines. Between day job and this, 14-16 hour days have become the norm. Can't wait to get through this.

My normal perfectionism is getting beaten down by fatigue. I'm discovering "good enough".

[Anuj Prateek]

Anuj, your double cut method relies on the width of the second cut removing some of the error from the first cut, which it will, it could be repeated as required. For real wood however the edge finish from the saw is not as good as a planed edge that could produce an almost invisible join, depending on the grain.
As for edge joining plywood where half the layered wood is running the wrong way, the result is more cosmetic than structural. Your choice of epoxy was wise as a gap filling adhesive!

I agree. Back then did not know any better.

After experiencing the finish from hand plane, I fix the saw marks now.
Previously these marks used to be invisible


I am a big fan of epoxy. I consider it a project saver for beginners (specifically for imperfect joinery).

[Jim Koepke]

I am a big fan of epoxy. I consider it a project saver for beginners (specifically for imperfect joinery).

My experience is based on the 'old school' of soldering. Before printed circuit boards one needed to have a strong mechanical joint before securing it with solder. That had an influence on my thoughts on joinery in wood.

Though one thing that is great with epoxy is it will fill and hold across gaps.

jtk

[Tom Trees]

I've heard this lots, pity it doesn't work for regluing popped guitar bridges IME,
I would stick to waterproof PVA type, like titebond ( "2" I think) for the job.
Tom

[steven c newman]

Have 5 Ash 1 x 6s to make into a desk top...
Computer desk top, 5 blanks trimmed.JPG
If you want to watch.....

[Anuj Prateek]

Have 5 Ash 1 x 6s to make into a desk top...
Computer desk top, 5 blanks trimmed.JPG
If you want to watch.....

Following.

[Erich Weidner]

Well, I've got the last of my giant panels in the clamps tonight. That is 6 panels of 27-32" width, and 12' length. I've certainly increased my skill in leveling the glued up panels with handplanes. However, not increased enough.

I ultimately worked through them with a #5 Jack set to take an aggressive cut. I worked across the grain (perpendicular) and there were plane tracks and tearout aplenty. I tried cleaning these up with my #8 Jointer but using it like I've seen in videos set for a moderately aggressive cut .005" it was hard to push. Too hard for the most part.
I tried finishing up with my #4 smoother, but it just wouldn't take much of a shaving anywhere. I guess I left the surface to rough. Not getting anything but little nibs off of a 12' panel meant I had to advance the blade to get a shaving, but once it started to bite, it bit too deep and wasn't really doing the job of preparing the surface for finishing. At least, I'd have been at it for months it felt like...

So I grabbed my RO sander and went at it with 40/80/100/150 grit. Things looked decent enough to me, but when we put the stain on the first two sections last night, there were tool marks and some tearout all over the place. Now, I like this look for certain things. But it wasn't what I was going for. Too late now, Nothing to do but forge ahead. The two parter panel just done (1/3rd of the project) was the "back bar". So not super customer visible. Not critical.

I went out an purchased white oak for the front bartop sections (the remaining four). I think I did a better job cleaning up the rough tool marks, but will see when the stain goes on tomorrow.

PS - I have two of the "panels" still to flatten/touch up. Tonight the screw holding down the front handle of the #5 snapped. It is a recent make of Stanley plane (bought in 2000's new). Not sure how to get the broken screw out of the shaft... that was kind of disappointing.

PPS - I guess tomorrow I'll press into service my Veritas #6 bevel up fore plane and see if I can convince it to sub in for the #5 to get the surface flattened.