fuming red oak

[Jim Cunningham]

I did an archive search and still have the following questions;
is it worth fuming red oak or should I just stain it to get that very dark color.
can I do a double dresser using visquine and tenting it.
will the fumes leak out in my garage and get into the house.
How long does it take.
how much ammonia do you use
how long shoul you air it out afterwards

Any answers as well as answers to questions I forgot to ask would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

Jim

[Donnie Raines]

Jim, fuming has some neat features to it(..and by the way, is this qrted sawn red oak?) If it is not, you can achieve an exact copy of the look you get by fuming with dyes, more dye and a layer of glaze. if it is qrted oak, fuming does present some special features, but again, nothing that can not be matched with dyes and glaze. i encourage you to NOT use a fuming process if the odors can be exposed directly to your family...you can be come very overwhelmed with the odor. I encourage you to purchase a high quailty finishing book(my suggestion would be Bob Flexner's Understanding Wood Finishes) He goes into great detail on the above appllication, as well as many others that will come in handy.

DonnieR

[Chris Padilla]

I've never heard of this...can someone briefly explain the technique and the end-result?

Thanks!

[Richard Allen]

Fumeing and dye/glaze with produce pieces that will look different over time.

Fumeing is an involved procedure that should be done with care. Your first fuming project should be something small. Mistakes you make on a small piece will be a pain. If you make those same mistakes on a large piece and it could be years before you can say fumeing without a tear in your eye ;->)

[Gene Collison]

I've never heard of this...can someone briefly explain the technique and the end-result?

Thanks!

Chris,

Ammonia fuming ages oak, gives it a look like it's 20 years old. Just get a 5 gal. plastic paint pail, place few test pieces in the bucket along with a cup of household ammonia in a cup. Put a cover of some sort, even an old sheet will work and set it preferably out in your backyard or the garage. Next morning your oak will have the 20 year old look. Watch the ammonia fumes when your working with it.
BTW, bought the 80 tooth CMT miter blade we talked about. That will fume oak (burns) too if you don't move fast. I would like the blade more if it had 60 teeth. Cuts nice tight miters though!

Gene

[Chris Padilla]

Ah, I see. Gee, I guess you could go through your cleaning stuff and do all sorts of things to wood! Interesting....

Does it give it a grey, weathered look or is it more of a patina like old cherry?

I have a metal light fixture with a very shiny gold finish that I want to etch so I can paint it. I took a section of the fixture and threw it into a bucket of muriatic acid (often used in pools to bring the pH down) to try and etch it. I tested a small section with the acid and a q-tip and it turned the gold finish to silver but it was still shiny. I wonder if soaking it longer in the acid will dull the silver finish further or even turn it another color.

Any way, got off-track here but one got me thinking about the other.

[Dave Richards]

Chris, ammonia fuming with oak and some other woods causes a reaction with the tannins in the wood. It creates that very dark brown color you see in old Stickley furniture among others.

My brother has had some success with using household ammonia but starting small is a good idea.

[Mark Stutz]

Jim,
I've read about fuming but never tried it. It is my understanding that to do entire pieces of furniture as was done years ago, requires Industrial strength anhydrous ammonia. Very caustic, dangerous material, requiring respirators, protective clothing, etc. Read an article afew years back about someone who loaded a rental truck full of furniture, put in the container of ammonia and came back the next day. Job done. Sounds too dangerous for me, but small projects with household ammonia might be interesting to try. Let us know how it works.

[Gene Collison]

Jim,
I've read about fuming but never tried it. It is my understanding that to do entire pieces of furniture as was done years ago, requires Industrial strength anhydrous ammonia. Very caustic, dangerous material, requiring respirators, protective clothing, etc. Read an article afew years back about someone who loaded a rental truck full of furniture, put in the container of ammonia and came back the next day. Job done. Sounds too dangerous for me, but small projects with household ammonia might be interesting to try. Let us know how it works.

Just ordinary household ammonia works fine. If you do the pieces before assembly you don't need any large type of chamber to put the parts in. Hard to imagine anhydrous being used way back then but who knows?

Gene

[Dave Richards]

Long, long ago they used cattle or horse urine to do it. Actually the story is the oak timbers in cattle barns and horse stables turned that nice dark brown and someone put two and two together to figure it out. The ammonia in the urine did it. Of course it probably took years to get it just right.

Household ammonia will take a bit longer but I think it is more controllable and definitely safer.

[Mark Stutz]

Gene,
You are absolutely correct. Anhydrous didn't look right when I typed it last night. I finally located the article I was thinking about--FWW Sept/Oct 1997. It is Industrial strength aqueous ammonia, 25-30% ammonium hydroxide compared to 5% for household ammonia. Still, not something to be careless with. I always assumed one needed to do entire pieces (maybe that's because that's what the author in that article did) but doing individual components makes sense.

[Mike Mastin]

I did an archive search and still have the following questions;
is it worth fuming red oak or should I just stain it to get that very dark color.
can I do a double dresser using visquine and tenting it.
will the fumes leak out in my garage and get into the house.
How long does it take.
how much ammonia do you use
how long shoul you air it out afterwards

Any answers as well as answers to questions I forgot to ask would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

Jim

Jim,

Fuming Red Oak will not produce the same effects that is acheived by fuming White Oak. Red Oak will come out looking very putred. White Oak has a high degree of tannic acids in it that react with the ammonia fumes to produce the deep dark effect that made this process so famous. Cherry can also be fumed with good results I have been told.

Fuming with 26% aqua-ammonia is dangerous and should be done outdoors and only with a high quality, properly fitted, vapor filtering respirator. It can be done, but it can be lethal if serious care is not taken.