Disclaimer: I want to be up front with the fact that this is going to be a less than favorable view on Sawstop. However, my intent is not to go ranting on the forums about Sawstop being a terrible company. I have a very significant issue with my brand new saw, and I'm sharing this mainly due to safety concerns. With that, I'll admit I'm frustrated and this write up is also going to reflect some customer service issues I encountered.
Getting machines since covid started has been a nightmare. I think we can all agree to that. I was looking for a sliding table saw when I found myself in a bind and had to make a last minute purchase for a new saw. I called my local vendor who just happened to have a 5hp 52" fence Sawstop ICS on hand that someone backed out on just before they received it. If I wanted it, the delivery could happen immediately. I'm saying this purely to share that this saw was acquired due to an urgent need for work and that I didn't pick the specs at all, it was this, or nothing (I'm a full time owner/operator carpenter and can't be without).
2 main issues with the saw were noticeable early on:
1. The table was out of flat. It was clear during assembly that there was a significant droop in the table on the right infeed side. This made attaching the table extension without a large belly impossible.
2. Kickbacks. I noticed early on that this saw was having kickback issues with the offcuts when I would make bevel cuts. The first few were mild, but the problem seemed to be getting worse quickly, and I started having offcuts violently thrown/lodged into the wall behind me. I intended to contact my vendor and tech support at this point, but I received a package in the mail the next morning that altered the plan.
3. New issue. I received a letter in the mail with two brake cartridges. The summary of the letter was that there appeared to be a problem with ICS saws that had specific serial numbers. The arbor may be faulty and the brake would not work correctly on these saws. Mine may be affected and I needed to stop using the old cartridges immediately. I was instructed to call in if I had an old dado cartridge and that it would be replaced as well. I called the next day.
I'm going to summarize everything in the next few paragraphs, but this all took place over a 2 week period and it resulted in a progressive decline in my trust of Sawstop.
Table Testing: I was asked to test the table for flatness at least 5 times over. Every time I tested the table, it was out by nearly double their tolerance. They asked me to repeat the test over and over again, even getting to a point where they were sending me instructions of how to hold a straightedge and not skew the results. I was even instructed to stop using my woodpeckers straight edges, go to home depot, buy new straight edges with the intent of returning them, and repeat the test. I refused at this point and the technician got angry and yelled at me over the phone that fine, they would accept my measurement and replace the table, but that the labor was my responsibility unless I can prove I am physically incapable of doing the work myself.
Hotdog Testing: To this day, I can rotate the blade with my fingers, and push my fingers into the teeth and shoulders of the teeth as hard as I can without the saw red safety light flashing. If I barely touch the blade with a hotdog, it immediately flashes. If I touch the blade with my fingers, it doesn't flash. No one has been able to explain this to me and it doesn't inspire confidence.
Kickback Testing: I was informed that the white oak I was cutting likely had too much tension in it and was causing the kickbacks. This was all kiln dried and then milled into flooring and sitting indoors in a clients house for about a year. It was 2-4" wide pieces that were no thicker than .75" at any point. I was instructed to use 1/4" plywood to try and recreate the kickbacks to prove that it wasn't the fault of my wood. I again, pointed out that the kickbacks were getting worse and that I was concerned about the safety of trying to intentionally do this. "Leadership wants you to do it, and stand to the side while doing it." On the 8th strip of 1/4" ply with the blade beveled for this experiment I experienced the worst kickback of my life. The cutoff was violently ripped free from the main board just before the cut was complete. This pulled the main board to the right of the blade up onto the riving knife and almost onto the top of the blade. This is the most dangerous thing I've ever done with power tools and it scared the hell out of me.
Saw Health Testing: This is a simple test. You use a stick of wood to turn the blade slowly. The green light is supposed to flash or briefly dim approximately once per rotation. On mine, the red light flashed. I was also asked to do this test repeatedly. The saw failed the same way every time. The first three times I performed this test a tech told me it was strange that the saw was still working despite failing this test. The forth time I performed this test, the tech who yelled at me about the table flatness (you can talk to numerous techs) instantly told me that the arbor and arbor block has to be replaced on my saw. The fifth time I performed this test a different tech told me that this failed test, meant that the original concern about arbor problems was likely the cause of my kickback issues. Essentially, the arbor is wobbling resulting in pinches happening between the table and blade when in a beveled position. It also decreases the quality of any straight cut.
As of this morning my situation is:
The saw cannot be considered safe for use in a beveled position.
The saw should not be trusted for high accuracy straight cuts with the blade at 90 to the table.
Parts are unavailable for the repair right now, but expected by January 15th.
Sawstop initially refused to cover labor for the arbor, arbor block, and table replacement. They have now backed off (my vendor got involved) and agreed to pay for the labor on these repairs.
Summary:
I'm pretty upset that I was treated more like a liar, than a concerned customer through most of the process. I was told several times that I needed to "prove it" because "Sawstop has been burned before" and asked to repeatedly take pictures from different angles to prove I wasn't skewing results or making things up. I don't have any idea what I would have to gain by calling in with a fake claim of kickbacks. I'm also, quite honestly, angry I was instructed to try and cause a kickback when a simple rotation of the blade test would have proved this was a problem, especially since they are in the middle of acknowledging they may have sent out wobbling arbors. Last, IMO it's incredibly important that you take good notes and fill in the tech on the phone every time you call in. Despite many notes on my file now, each tech seemed completely oblivious that tests had already been completed or that there was more than one problem being reported. Even at the end of the two week period, techs were still saying things like "oh that's the first we've heard of this." It seemed like they are trained to quickly direct you to videos to make adjustments yourself, but not necessarily trouble shoot unique scenarios.
So, again, my intent in writing this isn't to openly bash and discredit this company. As far as I know, they have never had an issue like this and my vendor said the same thing. I think the average person, on an average day, would likely have no issues with their saw or their customer service. However, if you find yourself with a serious issue, and the techs are not trained for it, I would strongly encourage you to take notes, stand up for yourself, and refuse to do anything that is unsafe.