Dark runs in stain

[Larry Klaaren]

I asked a question about BLO couple of weeks ago. We decided we wanted to have the table match a furniture set in our dining room, and I ended up buying some Miniwax Red Oak Stain. I made four test boards and stained them at 180 grit and 220 grit sanding and at both 5 and 15 mimutes. That was all good.

We decided on 220 grit sanding and let it stand for 15 minutes.

I stained the table this afternoon about three to four p.m.

The top, the rails, and three of the legs look great. One of the legs has what looks like horizontal runs where the stain is darker and has a little bit of an outline. There are three or four on one side and two on the front. They aren't connected to each other. I have absolutely no idea what the source of this is. I noticed it between applying the stain and wiping off the excess, but I was hoping that it would dry evenly. Doesn't look like it so far.

(Edit: I just added pictures about six or eight posts later in this thread.)

Is there anything I can do to ameliorate this? If pictures would help, I can take some later tonight. I have to be a chauffer for a while this evening.

If there is no evening it out, could these two surfaces be sanded and restained? Sounds tricky to me.

I did a search using words like "run" and "blotch" but didn't find any relevant threads.

Thanks,
Larry

[John Anderson]

Could be you may have missed some of the wood with the 220 grit, this would make the 180 portion be darker. You didn't say whether you brushed or wiped on the stain. I prefer the wipe-on because I have more control over the color.

I think that before sanding, I would wipe on another coat of stain using a 0000 steel wool pad applying more pressure on the darker areas, and see if this helps to blend in the color.

Hope this helps, don't like having to re-sand and re-stain .

[Larry Klaaren]

It looks more like perhaps it got splattered with water at some point in time after sanding and that raised the grain or something like that. The dark areas are teardrop shaped on one side of the leg and just little areas of spots on a side next to it.

Larry

[John Anderson]

Try a very light re-sanding of just the spot areas with the 180 grit and gently wipe on more stain over the sanded spots using a rag with just a small amount of stain. If it is water spots, the re-sanding should take care of the raised grain.

[Larry Klaaren]

Can do.

I'm interested in why you would go with 180 instead of 220 or something higher?

Also, would you wipe on and off in five minutes or so? I'm guessing you would do it right away and reapply if necessary.

Thanks for your help!

Larry

[Larry Klaaren]

Here are the larger two stains.

[Larry Klaaren]

Here's a couple of pictures of the table. Please pardon the shop clutter, I am taking these late at night to show the spots in the stain. This table is stained but has not had varnish yet. I didn't do a very good job of matching the grain on the top either. Looked good until I stained it. Except for the spots, it actually does look better than these pictures show. I think it's the reflection. Tomorrow I may take it outside and try some without the flash. Have a full day though.

This is my first piece of indoor furniture, and it has been a learning experience. I have done some shelves and toys before, and some Adirondack furniture and pot trees for the patio.

My dad likes the lathe, I've never tried it.

Thanks again,
Larry

[John Anderson]

Good looking job. I'm having a problem seeing anything but the natural grain. I do see a couple of spots in the first picture, not sure what caused this, but the only thing I see in the second posting is the grain pattern - cathedral pattern on the side of the leg. Are these the spots? If so this is the natural pattern of the wood. Looks like this is made from red oak, if so, red oak is an open cell wood meaning the fibers are hollow and will soak up the stain. As it dries, the stain will bleed out of the open cells for a period. You will have to keep wiping this down until all the stain has dried.

"I'm interested in why you would go with 180 instead of 220 or something higher?"

My mistake, you should use the highest grit you used for final sanding - 120.

"Also, would you wipe on and off in five minutes or so? I'm guessing you would do it right away and reapply if necessary."

Yes, wipe down as you apply, see if this blends the spots any.

"If there is no evening it out, could these two surfaces be sanded and re-stained? Sounds tricky to me."

If everything else fails, I would think you could sand and re-stain. I don't think it very tricky, just takes a little elbow grease and time. I would use the 180, then follow with the 220 grit just like the initial sanding. After sanding, I would re-stain by wiping on the stain and removing it as you apply. Us gentle strokes so as not to remove too much of the stain at once and continue until it matches the remainder of the piece.

[Larry Klaaren]

Thanks John,

All the stains are on the first picture. If you enlarge the picture you may be able to see that the grain runs vertically and these stains are at an angle but mostly horizontal. Unfortunately, I have to store my equipment and pieces by the freezer, between the car, soda storage, washer and drier, and water heater, right by an outside door. Potential for spillage is high and I suspect that something like that happened.

I'll try light sanding and restaining.

You're right, it's red oak. I didn't notice until I cut the leg tapers that one of the legs has a birds-eye pattern. Is that common in red oak?

Thanks again, I really appreciate it. As I said, this is my first piece of furniture of this type, but I have a lot of time invested. And of course, I had to learn how to make a mortise and tenon, make a taper jig, buy a drill press, teach my daughter to sand, (she wanted to do that). learn somethings about finishing, and all of that. We had it ready about three weeks ago and I dropped my finishing sander on the top, and it fell on the switch, which turned it on, which caused it to bounce all over the top and dented it up pretty good. Took us quite awhile to sand it down again.

Larry

[Larry Klaaren]

I sanded out the dark spots, but they went a little deeper than I expected. So I took a palm sander and (ahem . . . uh . . . uh . . . ) sanded tile the entire side of the leg was even, then restained it. Turned out great. Looks great. I'm happy.

John, I agree, it is better to wipe the stain on and off. I did figure out what the stains were. It was the brush pattern. My neighbor came over just as I was finishing up. We have had some burglaries in the neighborhood and he saw someone hiding in our bushes a couple of days ago. That was the last leg and I will bet that I just didn't wipe off all four sides.

The clue was when I noticed on the sandpaper that it was a gummy, greasy material, and it was the same color as the stain.

Thanks again,
Larry

[John Anderson]

Glad it worked out. Keep check on the "weeping" for a couple of days and be sure it is throughly dry before applying the final finish.

The wiping method gives you more control over the color than brushing, and eliminates cleaning brushes .

[Larry Klaaren]

As long as I am asking and learning here, what do you use to wipe it on with? I used a cloth rag, which had a high "soak quotient" which was good for wiping it off.

Just wondering if there is a more specialized material. Lately I have been zeroing out my cash account buying "Just little things" for the shop. Rubber mallet, BLO, stain, couple clamps, a mat - I noticed it all added up to over a hundred dollars since the first of the year, not including the drill press or wood, or things where I didn't save the receipt.

Thanks,
Larry

[John Anderson]

I use the disposable paper shop rags most of the time. Old Tee shirts are good, any lint-free rags.

[Larry Klaaren]

Thanks again. I have two layers of PU on it now . . . will probably put a last layer just on the top in the morning. Then, I'll post some better pictures.

Larry

[Larry Norton]

Larry, it looks like the dark spot was milled deeper than the rest of the leg, probably during the planing process. The deeper part didn't get sanded because it was deeper than the rest of the surface. Since it didn't get sanded, it held more stain than the rest of the surface and that's why it was darker. When you sanded and stained it over, it evened it out the surface and fixed the problem.