Pen Finishing Drama

[Tom Conger]

Somewhere in my pen finishing regimine I seem to be missing something fairly important. I go thru all 972 steps, the pen looks great, then it gets dull within minutes of handling it. Very frustrating.

The 972 steps:
Turn it.
1. Sand 220, 400, 600, 800, Micromesh 2400,3600,4800,6000,8000,12000
2. Paper towel with BLO, then dribble CA Thick evenly across pens making sure it is smooth.
3. Repeat #2 after 2 minutes
4. Sand MM 4800,6000,8000,12000
5. Hut PPP #1 at 3000rpm
6. Repeat #5 after 2 minutes
7. Hut PPP #2 at 3000rpm using a polishing cloth till my finger burns.
8. Repeat #6 after 2 minutes
9. Let it "breathe" for about five minutes
10. Without using fingers, move to a drying rack to sit for 12 hours or more. Drying rack is in garage, so no tempature control.

While sitting in the rack, it looks pretty nice and glossy. I am not going for the "plastic" look, but more for the deep clarity with shine to it.

So my question: Why am I losing the gloss that the wax puts on?

Any comments or help would be appreciated.

[Bob Noles]

Tom,

2 possibilities to consider. In #3 you said to repeat #2, I think the BLO is needed only once and not for each aplication of CA. Another consideration may be to find another final finish. I am not a big fan of HUT PPP. Possibly take a look at Renassance (sp) wax.

[John Hart]

It's my guess that the prob may be in the BLO as well....perhaps even with the CA Thick or the combination procedure. Here's a method that I use....not to say this is the end-all solution.

1. BLO with paper towel
2. Put a liberal amount of BLO on a lint-free, tight-mesh cloth wrapped tightly around your two finishing fingers....put 4 drops of CA Thin on the BLO Cloth and quickly run this back and forth across your barrel, spinning about 1200-1300.
3. Wait 2 minutes
4. Repeat #2 with a fresh cloth.

When the CA hits the BLO, it immediately begins to cure and turns to a gel. Perhaps using BLO with Thick CA is causing a premature curing that is resulting in a superficial coating rather than a bonded deep finish.

Just a guess.

[Curt Fuller]

Or you could replace steps 2 thru 8 with a couple applications of Hut Crystal Polish and then do step 9 and alter step 10 to inside the house where it's warm and dry. I've never had much luck at getting a gloss finish from wax and, in fact, use wax to remove the gloss if I don't want too shiney of a finish. The Hut Crystal Polish is some concoction of wax, shellac, and probably other driers and stuff that shines up nice and easy and fast and seems to be pretty durable. You can use it over the CA too if you're worried about the stability of the wood.

I'm not trying to promote Hut. It's just a finish I've had really good results from on pens and duck calls.

[Mike Ramsey]

The 972 steps:
Turn it.

I guess there are probably more than 972 ways to finish a pen!
I guess everybody does it a little different than the next, I finish
a lot of my pens the same as John but reversed, I put medium CA
down the length of the pen then followed by BLO, usually 4 coats, shines like a beacon in the night!

[Corey Hallagan]

John, how long lasting of a finish is your application? Just curious.

Corey

[John Hart]

John, how long lasting of a finish is your application? Just curious.

Corey

Well...that's the real question isn't it? The fact is, CA is water soluable after it's cured....so if you were to consider the fact that a pen is going to be handled by moist hands, it is probably not the most durable finish. Many folks would argue that there is no finish that will hold up to handling though, and that you should strive to give it a finish that would allow a patina to form over time due to handling.

I have a pen that I finished about 4 months ago with CA/BLO layers alternated with layers of shellac. I use that pen every day...all day, and the finish is still glossy, although it is beginning to show signs of wear near the tip.

I'm not an expert though....There are plenty of experts around SMC who know a thousand times more than I do. I just try stuff and see what happens.

[Tom Conger]

Made four pens today and finished them all differently. I was trying to find a catch all finishing system that would work for all pens, but am just not getting the desired results.

Pen 1 Ambroyna : BLO-CA - Hut PPP 1 and 2
Pen 2 Zircote : CA - Mylands Cellulose Sealer/Hut PPP 1 and 2
Pen 3 Ambroyna : Mylands Cellulose Sealer/Defl Spray Laquer
Pen 4 Pink Ivory : CA - Hut PPP 1 and 2

The one that really stands out is the Ambroyna Laquer, but I actually prefer the one done in wax. That laquer is some bright and shiny stuff. Need to see how long the shine will last with waxed ones in daily use.

I am starting to think that there are too many options, and I should just choose one finish and if someone doesn't like it, they can get their pen from Bob, John, Corey, or Mike.

[Corey Hallagan]

Tom, I haven't even turned a pen yet but I am very interested in you past postings and trials with finishing. I have been reading quite a bit on finishing. As John suggests, no single finish will last forever. Some will last longer than the gold on the pen, some will outlast the life of the pen etc. I am curious as to how long it takes for a pen to develop the natural patina from the human oils etc. with daily use and no finish at all. One person I have read says that may be the best overall finish .. no finish. However I think when buying a pen most people would opt for a shiny pen over a semi gloss finish.
John, I was interested in your application. Curious as to what the BLO does over the top of the CA? I know that the BLO under the CA causes the grain to pop but wasn't sure what it does over the CA. I was thinking the CA was a sealer and the BLO was the real finish? Anyway, it sounds like it definitely is much more durable than the wax finishes that wear away quickly.
Tom, I hope you keep posting your finidings here. You will be an expert soon on finishing!
Corey

[Kirk (KC) Constable]

EVERYBODY does it differently. I only use CA at the beginning of the 'final' sanding. I slather it on the entire blank(s) with a brush...wet all over but not dripping. Too wet and it'll fly off when I turn the lathe on . I use 'used' 150 grit Klingspor stearated to wet sand with the CA. Just a couple passes across the blank...the CA is still wet. While it's still wet, but getting tacky, I sand with 320G until 'dry'. From brushing on the CA to being done with the 320G is probably 90 seconds. Then I go through all the micromesh grits, both spinning and then not spinning and with the grain, three or four shots of DEFT gloss with light steel wool in between, and finish up with the HUT stick.

You may be trying too hard to polish up the HUT...if you're going at it until your finger burns you might be taking it all right back off, and mucking up whatever's underneath it with the heat you're generating.

KC

[John Hart]

I agree with KC that the CA should really just be considered as a base to seal and provide a good foundation to another finish (Deft in his case). I'll use a shellac mixture and alternate it with layers of the BLO/CA in hope that the eventual wear will take more time. As far as the role of the BLO Corey, I'm not really sure. There may be some chemistry involved there because the mixture seems to have more longevity than the CA by itself. Others have pointed out that the BLO serves as a lubricant to ensure a good delivery of the CA and slows the cure just a tad so you can get it applied without gobbing up. I'll apply BLO alone as a first step to pop the grain, but try to friction cure it before going to a next step...I don't want that first step to be weak and thereby affect all subsequent steps.

[Chris Barton]

For what its worth, I have tried many different methods but, the only one that provides a long lasting high gloss finish is lacquer. I like the water based stuff and you can force it a little by applying it like a friction finish. A couple of coats and then polish with either the Beal system or EEE wax.

[Tom Conger]

I tried Kurt's suggestion yesterday with Hut Chrystal Polish, (another $10.99 from the finishing fund.) Finished seven pens yesterday with it and so far it looks pretty good.

The ultimate test for the pen though is use, so I put my mother-in-law to work yesterday. (she moved in "temporaly" a few months ago ). When I finish polishing the blanks, I let them sit for a bit, then give to her to handle for a few hours. That way, if the finish was bad, I could still put it back on the lathe without having to ruin any hardware. So far, it seems that they "dull" just a little bit, but keep the "internal" burnished look which is what I have been going for. Woowoo. I may have my solution.

So for soft glow pens, from 973 steps, I am dow to 426.

1. Turn
2. Sand 220, 400, 600, 800 - DNA
3. Coat of Mylands Cellulose Sanding Sealer
4. MM 2400 thru 12,000 (DNA between 3600 and 4000 and after 12,000)
5. Another coat of Mylands
6. MM 2400 thru 12,000 (DNA after 12000)
7. Hut Chrystal polish (applied with soft rag, buff out with second rag)
8. Repeat application of Hut
9. Admire shine and appreciate not having eyes and lungs burn from CA application.

For high gloss, same concept except substitute Delf Laquer for the Hut Chrystal polish.

Time will tell though, and I'll keep the updates coming and maybe even upload a picture.

[Corey Hallagan]

Tom, when you do the lacquer do you apply it on the lathe? Keep us up to date how you like that Hut finish.

Corey

[Randy Meijer]

...with a couple applications of Hut Crystal Polish.... The Hut Crystal Polish is some concoction of wax, shellac, and probably other driers and stuff that shines up nice and easy and fast and seems to be pretty durable.....

Curt: Are you talking about Hut Crystal Coat Friction polish or something else?? While some folks report satisfactory results with CC as far as durability, you will find that many if not most experienced pencrafters have abandoned it in favor of other finishes. No doubt that it produces a pretty finish in a short period of time; but most folks will tell you that it just doesn't hold up in the long run. If it works for you, that's great; but everyone reading this thread who is considering trying it should be aware of the general rep of this product.