Porter Cable not looking good.

[Ben Rafael]

"The part in question had reached its lifetime", by Kelly C. Hanna, ain't that the truth.

I'm not trying to deter from the original poster, but those who have lifetime warranties on Ridgid tools, don't really have lifetime warranties. When the part has reached the point that "Ridgid claims is its lifetime", then you have to pay for it, believe it or not. I was told this during a 3-way phone conversation with 2 Ridgid employees. If the switch goes bad on your drill, then THEY can decide when you have to pay for it.

The batteries may be a different story, but the tools aren't lifetime, as they lead you to believe.


David

"As they lead you to believe"

One day, sooner than later, an attorney will run with this. Any reasonable person is led to believe that Lifetime is assumed to be the lifetime of the original owner; not the lifetime of the tool or any of it's components.

I have several of the gray ridgid tools. The manual states, quite explicitly, about the lifetime warranty. Honestly, I dont see anything going wrong with them anyway.

[Jeffrey Makiel]

I think a lot of folks believe that they are buying a quality tool even if it's only $59 when a comparable quality tool would be $159. I believe they recognize the famous brand name associated from a time that has long gone.

I also believe it is a one shot marketing deal for a manufacturer whose reputation will never be the same again no matter what. It deploys the philosophy that there is a seat for every rear end, and you can sell most anything to the masses once.

On the positive side, the internet is a powerful equalizer today. Forums like Sawmill Creek quickly dispel hype and expose badge deception. As stated above by other posters, brand is meaning less these days, and buyers must be more skeptical and vigilant.

Anyway, I must leave now to go to my famous national brand bank to withdrawl my life savings before they collapse.

-Jeff

[Denny Rice]

I don't profess to know nearly as much about this as some who have posted. But, I think we make a mistake in assigning some "deceptive" scheme to this. Most companies simply have to go where the market is.

SMC seems to be comprised of individuals that may be considerably more discerning than the bulk of the buying public. The responders here are hardly a representative group reflecting the mass market.

If a company, Festool for example, markets to the 10% or so that have both the money and desire for a quality built tool, they are playing to a very limited and finite group. The revenues are limited. They sell a tool that will not need replacement any time soon. Yes, this group will have more money, and will buy more tools in a lifetime. But, there are fewer of them. How long have you had your electric drill? Ask one of the younger guys coming out of the BORG how many drills he has bought in the last 10 years?

Unfortunately, we have become a disposable society and most people buy their circular saw, drill, etc. at a BORG to use 3 times a year building that new deck, picnic table, etc. That is where the bulk of the revenue source lies. And, those tools will be replaced in short order - either from lack of quality, lack of care, etc. I truly think that those that spend $39 for a drill know exactly what they are getting, and are OK with that.

We have only ourselves to blame. The number of individuals that demand quality is diminishing. Capitalism does work, it is just that the end result does not always please everyone.

This entire reorganization thing with PC and DeWalt is just stupid. There are enough companies out there that build cheap Chinese tools out there to take care of the market for the guy who wants junk. In 1988 I purchased a 9.6 Makita cordless drill, at the time I paid a litle over 200.00 (which was high for the times) for the drill and charger, it has been dropped, kicked, and thrown and I pick it off the concrete and it just keeps on running. Since 1988 I have had the brushes replaced a couple of times and bought a couple of 30.00 batteries. In 2004 I purchased another Makita drill and charger, (boy what 16 yrs will change a company) its JUNK! My Makita purchased in 1988 still has more torque than the newer drill even though its labeled with a cool sticker and boost about the high voltage ouput. The contruction of the newer drill vs the old drill, there is no comparision, the older drill is more stout, the casing is stonger and thicker and it is assembled in such a way it can be taken apart easier if repairs are needed. Its a shame companies don't care about quality anymore, all they seem to care about are their shareholders and dividens.

[Steve Nouis]

It took companys years to build up a good name and the so called management only a short time to ruin it. No such thing as intergity any more, take the money and run. Steve

[Stan Smith]

Hi Dave,

I'm not blaming B&D corporate for consumers who refuse to educate themselves, I'm blaming them for taking away from me, and everyone else, what I've always considered to be a good line of tools. What I am saying negative about B&D corporate is that they are going to be playing on a well established brand name to pull in money from an unexpecting consumer base. The average home owner does not have the experience with tools that the average member here has. They may watch DYI TV and NYW and others. From these shows they have gotten the idea that Porter Cable are professional grade tools. If B&D wanted to put out another line of lower end home owner tools they could use another brand name. Instead they chose to lower quality on a well known brand, which whether you, or I, like it or not is a calculated move designed to assure themselves of a ready made customer base for their 'new line'.

Yeah, and others point to the same thing happening with the other major brands. Didn't hear Bosch name mentioned yet though. I'm going to try and get my older tools repaired as long as I can. A cheapo router is damned dangerous IMHO.

[David Cramer]

I agree Ben and actually asked that same question on the phone. I was told that there is fine print, very fine print, aka a legal loophole. I am not an attorney and don't know one way or the other, but to me it's very misleading.

The battery repair place is a solid 45 minutes from where I live. With the price of gas and having to go there back and forth twice, you're talking about 3 hours of driving time at the very least. Gas alone could be in the $35-$45 range. It's not a free battery.

Again, sorry to hijack the thread, but Ridgid sold A LOT of tools when they came out with their "Lifetime Warranty" tools a few years back, but it really isn't lifetime as more than one of my tool buddy's found out. They thought it was no questioned asked and they'd give the emplolyee their old beat up tool and get a new one, but that was not to be. Sorry for bumming anyone out, but I was on the phone with Ridgid and that's what I was told. An HD employee verified it a few years ago.

David

[Rick Potter]

As I sit on my Chinese Schwinn bike, listening to my Chinese Capehart radio, looking at a brochure for a Chinese Oliver shaper, I can only say...I am glad this is an isolated event.

Rick Potter

[Anthony Anderson]

Quoting John Keeton: Most companies simply have to go where the market is.

Unfortunate, but true. Though the end result will not, usually, result in a long term viable company.

SMC seems to be comprised of individuals that may be considerably more discerning than the bulk of the buying public. The responders here are hardly a representative group reflecting the mass market.

Unfortunately, we have become a disposable society.

Unfortunately, again, true.

I truly think that those that spend $39 for a drill know exactly what they are getting, and are OK with that.

When I was first startin in this hobby/obsession, I bought many tools, mostly because information was not available as it is now, internet especially forums such as this one. Has I had places like this to seek advise, I would not have made as many tool buying mistakes, which also would have saved money. So, I guess I would have not been in the 'majority' of those who would have been okay with that $39 drill, it was because I didn't know any better or do my research. I simply walked into Sears and bought, based mainly (I know this sounds absurd now) on the Craftsman name recognition.

We have only ourselves to blame. The number of individuals that demand quality is diminishing. Capitalism does work, it is just that the end result does not always please everyone.

Very well stated John. And I feel/fear that the end result will continue to become more unpleasant.

I like your opinions. Very well put. Regards, Bill

[Harry Goodwin]

No one is more disappointed with what has happened to American craftmanship but we get what we diserve. We bad mouth our own American tools, glorify the sophisticated European and Asian counterparts paying huge prices and bad mouth the price of American tools as too high. We see those who fuss because their investments are not yielding fantastic dividends and the quality and profit are not good bed partners. I have great tools produced in US and great tools produced elsewhere and some over priced foreign stuff. . Maybe if I were willing to put up the cash US could produce the same quality. We get what we are willing to pay and we have destroyed so many great US companies. My friends are losing jobs because often I am not willing to pay for a skilled craftsman a living wage. My own two bits. Harry

[Drew Eckhardt]

I was walking around Lowe's yesterday. They have started receiving the new Porter Cable tools. They have not yet put displays out so I could not see or feel the tools. But they had the old model circular saw next to the new. The old model was $125 the new $59. Combine that with the fact the Black and Decker tools were flushed out and PC now sits in that shelf space. Is the new PC tools just the new Black and Decker? Looks to be the case.

That's better than what they did when moving from the 690 to 890 router series where the quality went down (tolerances on the sub-base mounting screw holes) but the price went up.

[Vic Castello]

Hi Dave,

I'm not blaming B&D corporate for consumers who refuse to educate themselves, I'm blaming them for taking away from me, and everyone else, what I've always considered to be a good line of tools. What I am saying negative about B&D corporate is that they are going to be playing on a well established brand name to pull in money from an unexpecting consumer base. The average home owner does not have the experience with tools that the average member here has. They may watch DYI TV and NYW and others. From these shows they have gotten the idea that Porter Cable are professional grade tools. If B&D wanted to put out another line of lower end home owner tools they could use another brand name. Instead they chose to lower quality on a well known brand, which whether you, or I, like it or not is a calculated move designed to assure themselves of a ready made customer base for their 'new line'.

Hello folks....I'm new. Nice to meet you all.

Brent....

As you well know, sadly, it's not only power tools! John Deere is now selling "mass market" lawn tractors at Home Depot. I'm told by people in the know that they simply aren't of the same quality as in the past. So, Deere is now running the risk of ruining their hard earned reputation for making the best in the business. Year's ago...many of us saw how our beloved Lionel Trains went down the tubes, until another company took them over and restored the quality.

Now, didn't this also happen to Rockwell power tools many years ago??? I was considering buying a used lathe recently, and when I asked a knowledgable friend about it, he told me to forget it unless it was an older "Delta" Rockwell. He said that the later Rockwell's were inferior to the older Delta Rockwell's. It sounds as if Rockwell did the same thing that is happening to PC now!

[Ben Rafael]

No one is more disappointed with what has happened to American craftmanship but we get what we diserve.

Dont blame me. All of my powertools are made in the USA or Europe(except for my lathe)
All of my woodworking hand tools are made in the USA, Canada or Europe.
IMO, the quality of western makers has not been overtaken by Asia and the price difference is generally not substantial(with a few exceptions).

[Jake Helmboldt]

You can get replacement parts for your ROS here.
www.ereplacementparts.com

Thanks Greg, you saved me the headache of trying to find a place with parts. Other than a dodgy switch (from day one) that sometimes turns off and on, it has and still is a good sander. Oh, and the dust collection pops off.

[Clay Thigpen]

I remember several years ago walking into a B&D store and seeing a Hybrid table saw or something that looked like one ( reminded me of the Dewalt that was just coming out) But I've never heard or read anything about it at all which I would think strange. Has anyone seen or used this thing?

[Steve Nouis]

This thread is about using a good name to sell cheap tools and I for one think the managers of these companys should be ashamed of ruining thier good name just to make money today. Steve