The "Quality" v-belt thread

[Douglas Brummett]

Interesting. At the least a thicker top for the base is in order on the current design. More power would be nice, but is somewhat pointless without nicer guides (bb rollers) and a taller resaw height. All of this would drive up cost, not sure that is a good thing.

I ended up at about $500 total for the rigid, mdf scraps, casters, Kreg fence, graphite cool blocks, and a couple of Olson blades. If the base saw price went up more than about $50-75 I would just go the Grizzly route. Main reasons I went with the Rigid were price, instant availability, and lifetime warranty.

[Rich Enders]

I lost a 7 year old v-belt on my J/P, so I started looking around at what other belts in the shop might be ready to fail. I pulled the cover off the Ridgid bandsaw, and sure enough it had a Fuju A-980 just like Douglas (the OP) noted in this older thread. It was lumpy and haggard looking so I replaced it with the Gates A38. The factory alignment of the pulleys was poor so I corrected that during the install.

To my surprise the band saw now has an annoying vibration that was not there with the A 980. Any thoughts you guys might have would be appreciated.

For the moment I am going back to the A-980.

[Bruce Page]

Did you run-in the new belt long enough to get the kink out? It's been sitting in that cardboard sleeve or hanging on a hook for who knows how long.

[Myk Rian]

Are you sure the belt was the problem, and not the wheels/tires?

As far as link belts go, I only use them to get the size needed for a proper belt.

[Allan Speers]

Industrial applications ten not to be plagued by crappy belt issues largely because the tension that they employ tends to overwhelm the sorts of problems that are so annoying to the lighter machinery users.

It's all in the bearings. Machinery made for consumers tends to be - - -well - - -not real robust.

However if you can do something like the flat belt pulley systems that you'll find on the finer Euro style machines you will be boatloads happier. . this of course means you'll need new pulleys and tensioners.Flat belts are better because:
1.) they transmit power more efficiently
2.) they thinner and more supple and that lets them operate with less vibration at lower tensions.

As a general proposition flat belts are the best power transmission devices going. They consume less energy than gears or chains and are dramatically lower consumers of power than any V belt. Most V belt systems lose 10% of the motor's power on each pulley.

Technically, the power consumption is less than that in a set up like a contractor's saw because the tension on the pulley is nowhere near the rated tension for the belt in question. But then you get all the attendant problems like vibration and noise and other problems.

Gears and chains are about 5% power consumption. Flat belts can be near zero. Rubber flat belts are about like gears. The lowest power consumption gong is a steel flat belt. Steel flat belt is, bar none, the most efficient and smooth power transmission mechanism going.

Cliff, I'm looking for replacements for the used grizzly 21" BS I recently purchased. It has a 5 Hp motor, and surprisingly only TWO belts. (A31 V-belts. ) The stock belts are extremely stiff, and I've read many complaint about the pulleys on larger Grizzly machines being hard to adjust properly, without vibration issues.

Additionally, the motor pulley is very small. For this reason I was going to get cogged (notched) belts, or VX belts. I have learned enough about link belts to know they are not the best option for higher HP or multi-groove pulleys.

However, you have me intrigued by these flat belts, but I also need to know if just 2 of them can handle a typical 5 HP load.

Also, of course, where does one get them (and the pulleys) for a decent price?
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Another issue is pulley diameter. For instance, with my Powermatic 100 planer, the motor pulley is 3.95" diameter, but the actual diameter that a 4L belt sees is only 3.7" (I think "A" belts see the full diameter, though I'm not sure) That's a critical difference if one is trying to maintain a certain arbor rpm.

So, if one is replacing either a 4L or an "A" belt, AND it's pulley, how does one determine the correct pulley size? Again, my 21" Grizzly uses two A31 V-belts. So?

[Michael W. Clark]

Hi Allan,
The pulleys should be made for the correct belt cross-section. To keep the same speed, you want the same size ratio. This can "usually" be done by measuring the OD of the pulleys. Say the big pulley is 6" and the small one 2", then any combination that gives you a 3:1 (6"/2") ratio will mechanically work. Weight and size of the pulleys should also be considered.

I like the Gates Polychain with flanged pulleys, but probably overkill for a 5hp bandsaw.

[Allan Speers]

- But that's NOT always so, hence my question.

For instance, My PM100 uses a 2AK41 pulley, which has an O.D. of 3.95", but the 4L belts only see an effective diameter ( known as "pitch" yes? ) of 3.7"

I think (not sure) that "A" belts, which of course can be used on such a pulley, effectively see the full 3.95". My Grizzly BS already uses "A" belts, so I assume that there would be little difference switching to a flat belt, but I want to be sure.


Regardless, I'm thinking that the Goodyear banded VX belt should probably be more than good enough, and no worries changing the pulley. (with the Grizzly at least.)

[Lee Schierer]

[QUOTE=Shawn Walker;915733][quote=Douglas Brummett;915727
RANT (may be off topic)
There is a pretty big bandwagon behind link belt upgrades. I don't see it as an upgrade. IIRC they were designed as an emergency replacement until you could get the correct belt. I have a 3/4HP saw and don't want to lose any of my power to belt slip at the pulley interfaces. There are some debates out there. A lot of users swear by link belts. Personally I think that they are overpriced and not a necessity. Higher quality machines than mine have gotten by on v-belts for a long time. If v-belts were the right solution I think that a lot more manufacturers would install them as factory equipment. They may silence your machine, but they are a bandaid solution.
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I may get skewered... But I agree.[/QUOTE]

I have stalled the motor on my 1.5 hp saw that has a link belt, so I wouldn't think any 3/4 Hp motor would lose much if any efficiency. Manufacturers are looking to keep their costs as low as possible to stay competitive. Adding a belt at twice the cost would not help them achieve that goal. On a frequently used saw they probably provide less benefit as the belt would not sit in one position for an extended period of time to take a set. However, in a hobbiest situation, a saw may sit for a month or more without being used and the belt could take more on more set and contribute to more vibration.

[Rick Fisher]

I just finished a restore... used Gates.. Asked at the automotive store which where the best.. Cost me $50.00 for 2 belts.. That's all I got ..

[Michael W. Clark]

Allan, Yes, if you go to a different belt section, but don't change the pulleys, could run into issues.

However, the "A" and "4L" do seem very close in section. Not sure you would see much difference.

[Rich Enders]

Bruce,

Good question. After hearing/feeling this new vibration I ran the BS for about 15 minutes with no added load. Do you think that is long enough? It didn't seem to help. I then resawed about 12 feet of 6 inch wide hard maple. The vibration is a bit better under load, but still a bit much. Would a notched belt be better? Will a link belt work on existing V-Belt pulleys?

[Larry Edgerton]

I use "Optibelt" brand. I an not a huge fan of link belts either but I do have a couple. One is on a Delta 14" band saw, works fine.

It may have been said, but automotive and machine belts are not made to the same standard. You want machine belts. I have used automotive in a pinch and they always introduce vibration.

[Justin Jump]

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...-Saw&highlight=

Link to my Ridgid bandsaw upgrades.....

The belt I used in on the link.....

let me preface by saying that I am not interested in a link belt as part of this discussion...

Okay, just spent the better part of an hour searching around several forums. There are a lot of instances of users recommending "quality" v-belts or industrial v-belts. Of course nobody recommends brand names or points to retail outlets to obtain these mythical high quality belts.

I recently picked up a Rigid bandsaw. The stock belt (a-980) is terrible, lumpy, and several other indications of its poor quality. I think I could get by with an a38 or a39 belt as an alternative. But the big question is what manufacturer? Any help?

[glenn bradley]

Any other comments?

Are you just searching for a standard belt that will be close to a link belt in performance for some reason? Just curious as to the purpose of trying different belts; is this or a review write up?

[Mark Godlesky]

Interesting thread, but .....the OP has not posted to this thread since 2008.