sawstop vs other tool upgrades...

[alex grams]

So, i've been looking at getting an old PM/Uni to rebuild for a new table saw to replace the Ridgid TS3650, and the wife drops the bomb that she would prefer me to get the sawstop. The current saw is underpowered on the thicker wood I am cutting, and was a beginner saw for me for about a year now.

I would love to have a sawstop, because of the safety feature and also the quality of the tool, but that is a LOT of money. With the 3hp, 52"fence & table, w/ mobile base, I am looking at $4500,and she is aware of the price.

I have been looking at more shop upgrade options. Need a drum sander and a good dust collector, but this would pretty much put all of that on hold if i dropped 4.5k on a sawstop.

I would honestly feel better getting a grizzly slider for 3k (G0623X) or even a G0651 with the larger tables, or even getting an old uni/powermatic 66 and rebuilding it and then using the other 2-3k for other tools and saving some money. The larger tables and more adequate power would make the work I do safer, but obviously not sawstop safe. A slider would help a LOT on larger crosscuts, and the G0623X looks reasonable (though no clue on common reviews of it).

Financially I can afford it, she said i could do it as a christmas gift to myself. I just have to be frugal and make other sacrifices to save the money, and it seems prices are only going to go up on machinery in the next year.

But I have a difficult time also justifying a $5,000 saw.

Thoughts? It is an interesting dilemma. I am just on the fence though about it and the other options.

[Mike Heidrick]

Do it. She said too. You will buy it and the $$$ pain will fade. After that you will find more money and more deals and still get all the tools you want for your shop and you will still have a sweet Sawstop. If you get hurt on the TS now and she said get the sawstop, and you did not, you will NEVER live it down with her. Bought mine in 2006 and have never regretted it! $4300 and that was the 5hp machine so $4400 now as it only went up $100 for the 5hp.

[Doug Mason]

If I were in your shoes I'd get a new General (Canadian). I don't know anything about the Grizzly slider saws--but it sounds like it would cause you more grief than it's worth. Unless you make a good living, $4,500
is alot $$ for one item.

Use the left-over money to get some hand tools to really work wood

[Vic Damone]

+1 Do it. A sliding saw does have its own level of safety and could easily be an option. After explaining the merits of a slider to your wife and getting her consent you should demo the green tool and then demo a Felder, Hammer, or Minimax. The difference in the quality of the sliding table alone is substantial.

At this point the SawStop looks more affordable. Since your wife understands the danger associated with the table saw and with her piece of mind in the mix I wouldn't even consider a traditional saw.

Merry Xmas

[Brian Penning]

Truly a no-brainer to get the SawStop.

[Dave Rose]

If you get hurt on the TS now and she said get the sawstop, and you did not, you will NEVER live it down with her.

Very good reasoning. Get the SawStop.

[NICK BARBOZA]

I think either way you go about it, you will look back and wonder how you lived without the 3hp. i know i have since i bout my SawStop. I also got the 52" rails, and i LOVE this machine. i still turn on the old craftsman once in a while for a dado. I dont know much about sliders, but i know if you end up with the SS you will not regret it. eventually (quickly) you'll get over the cost and you will find more money down the road to get the other machines you want.

I decided that at 24 years old i only wanted to buy one more table saw so it was easier to justify the $4k, and i plan to keep this one forever.

No regrets!
Nick

[Tim Thomas]

The thing that speaks to me in your original post is that you said you also want to get a dust collector and are concerned that you will have to wait on that if you blow your budget on the SawStop. To that end I would point out that a SawStop might save you from disfiguring your hands next week, but a good dust collection system might save you from dying of lung cancer in 20 years. It is easy to see the immediate safety benefit of the SawStop (which is an innovative and awe-inspiring tool) but more difficult to see the long-term and somewhat intangible benefit of having a good dust management system (which is mundane, boring and doesn't really scream "buy me!"). There are ways to work safely with a tablesaw that doesn't have an automatic brake, but I don't know of any way to work safely in a constantly dusty environment. Maybe a hazmat suit and respirator?

This is just a little devil's advocate post. I think you will get plenty of advice to buy the SawStop, and that is certainly a good way to go. It is a great tool and I doubt you would ever regret the purchase. But for me personally, if I needed a more powerful saw, a dust collector and a drum sander, I would take the $4500 budget and buy all three tools. Maybe the Rikon 10-110, an Oneida Dust Gorilla, and the best sander I could afford with the leftover cash. I don't think you would regret having a safer, cleaner and more efficient shop either. Whichever you choose, I think everyone can agree that your shop is soon going to be a much more enjoyable place to work with wood, and isn't that what it is all about?

(By the way, buy your wife some flowers today. She has earned them. )

[alex grams]

Tim, I run a decent dust collection setup at the moment. The DC would mainly to be to help with the mess of the dust everywhere in the garage. Whenever i run a sander or saw, I have a jet afs mounted on my ceiling that i run, and also will open up the garage and have a fan blowing to move the air out. Also, whenever i am doing any heavy sanding i wear a mask, so I am fairly happy with my regiment at the moment.

For my larger higher volume producing tools, I run a shop vac with a garbage can seperator. While this does the trick, I am going to make my vacuum have a short life. That is the main reason I want to get a decent dust collector, and to help on the table saw. though I will need a dC for the drum sander when that happens.

Thanks for the concern Tim, as SMC has always been good to point out the safety issues of a good DC system, but I don't view it as a critical item at the moment for my shop.

[Jim Becker]

Tough one, Alex...I can see the appeal of the SS and always have. But then again, it wasn't for me...I went slider and have less than zero regrets on it. That said, if you don't do a true slider, than it's probably a good idea to go with the LOYL's recommendation for SS for a "North American" design saw. This goes beyond the tools and stuff and into the relationship thing where she obviously cares enough about you to suggest that particular tool and why.

[Mark Singer]

I have the SS and it is very good! I love the safety and accuracy. I have 2 "dead on" sleds I made for crosscutting and that really works for furniture making. If you make a lot of cabinets from sheet goods, a slider is the way to go.

[Greg Cole]

Hey Alex,
Here's another $0.02 donation... most likely will be long winded as usual.
I have had my eyes on a SS for 8-9 months for the safety of the blade brake (and it's a damn good saw across the board), as I've said many times now I had a run in with my jointer and a pinky in December 07. $3000.00 was the tally on said run in, granted medical insurance picked up the tab, but just sayin'. The more I read and learn about the Euro style sliders, the more they perk my interest over a North American Cabinet style. Safety & accuracy are there and some of the hobbiyst models aren't out the the realm of price in comparison to a SS.
Good DC is a must regardless. Way too many of us wait for the DC as one of the last additions to the shop... I use a 2 HP canister style and coulda woulda shoulda gone with a cyclone. The Phil Thien mod's to the DC have helped quite a bit, but it's still not the same as a true cyclone.
I was very, very close to buying an open ended drum sander awhile ago, either a 16/32 or 22/44 Performax. I would up sending my $ to LN & LV for some hand tools instead. Some love the sanders, some not so much and my luck would put me in the not so much camp (I don't tempt Lady Luck). If you go with a drum sander, I'd really lean towards a closed end style machine. I hate sanding, absolutely HATE IT. Project finishing prep (ie sanding) used to be drudgery & progressing through the grits is a waste of time IMO. A couple passes with a #4 & maybe a card scraper and move on versus 150 grit to 180 to 220... etc. I will wind up with a drum or belt sander eventually as I'm doing more shop made veneer. Which bring about the need for a vacuum bag system.....

Cheers.
Greg

[Tim Thomas]

Thanks for the concern Tim, as SMC has always been good to point out the safety issues of a good DC system, but I don't view it as a critical item at the moment for my shop.

Well, if you currently have a dust collection system that is working for you, I would like to reverse my position and encourage you to get the SawStop.

[Mike Heidrick]

I would get a real DC, even a HFDC or other sub $200 machine, while contemplating my saw purchase!

HFDC and 1 micron filters were the second tool I bought after my first TS. Seeing someone die from pulmonary fibrosis will change your life!

[Charles P. Wright]

For my larger higher volume producing tools, I run a shop vac with a garbage can seperator. While this does the trick, I am going to make my vacuum have a short life. That is the main reason I want to get a decent dust collector, and to help on the table saw. though I will need a dC for the drum sander when that happens.

I would say not to worry about the short life of a shop vac, they are cheap enough to be almost disposable. Sure a good dust collector would be nice; but you might be surprised at how long the shop vac will last. Also, if you can afford a $4500 saw; there is a good chance that you can scrape together $200 for a DC if you need one later on.