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Thread: The Great Morris Chair project

  1. #121
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Windsor, ON
    Posts
    657
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    3

    mortise and tenon (2/4)

    The blind mortises seem forgiving after you wrestle with the throughs!
    My pet 'stop' is temporarily clamped on to help flush the tops.
    The leg must be slid home on both tenons while flush to the tops.
    blind-and-thru.jpg stop-gives-top.jpg

    I aim to build my tenons so that they will slide home with light mallet taps,
    and not fall out if inverted. (If dry winter shrinks them, I want to start big as possible)
    Fitting all four sides at once can be time consuming and joy-murdering.
    Having done a few, I figured out that fitting is best broken down into stages.
    I fit the thickness into the mortise, but the tenon is still too wide to enter.
    I have taken to tucking the tenon in diagonally as fit test.
    Next the width is fit, with tenon tilted off axis---thus taking it's thickness out of the equation,
    so we can get some work done.
    fit-thickness.jpg fit-width.jpg

    As you sneak up on a sweet fit, both thickness and width must slide in at once,
    as well as both tenons at once.
    both-must-fit-at-once.jpg

    ***my shiny new strategy***
    Last time I built an m&t frame, I got struck with a bolt of insight.
    Machining the blind tenons the same length as the through tenons would
    be very helpful.
    This keeps the crucial shoulder to shoulder length identical.
    Such as when pinched between the legs at final assembly.
    I struggled in the past to achieve that...due to different rail lengths.

    Also, it really helps layout and fitting to have both tenons the same length.
    The through tenon needs to be longer than the blind tenon.
    This causes the finished rails to be different lengths.
    If they are cut to those different lengths before machining the tenons,
    you will have your hands full.....
    and good luck making exact shoulder to shoulder fit.

    continued
    Last edited by Walt Caza; 08-22-2008 at 7:45 AM.
    There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going! WCC

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind - Dr. Seuss

    Crohn's takes guts. WCC

  2. #122
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
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    Windsor, ON
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    mortise and tenon (3/4)

    So, I make both rails the longer length, as required for the longer through tenon.
    This lets me butt up the leg nice and square to the tenon ends for layout.
    After test fitting, the blind tenons are cut short enough to depth of blind mortises.

    This is a small sacrifice of material, for an easier, quicker and more accurate fitting.
    You want to end up with identical shoulder to shoulder lengths.
    This is my personal solution. Surely old pros must know and do this? (there is nothing new under the sun)
    Especially true of an ancient craft like ours... (why didn't someone or somebook tell ME?!?)
    did you know the ancient Egyptians used mortise and tenons?!?
    snip-the-blinds.jpg the-long-and-short-of-it.jpg

    Now our 'single pc' sides are let-in to the legs, with flush tops.
    edit* I notice this pic is out of sequence, as blind tenons still long! haha*
    [oops-I was juggling a pile of pics]
    sides-into-legs.jpg

    The top rail with blind tenons.
    and the bottom rail with through tenons.
    blind-rail.jpg through-rail.jpg
    The mortise appears too long for the through tenon, but that is an illusion
    of perspective.....it is actually a press fit.

    continued
    Last edited by Walt Caza; 08-23-2008 at 2:20 AM.
    There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going! WCC

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind - Dr. Seuss

    Crohn's takes guts. WCC

  3. #123
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Windsor, ON
    Posts
    657
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    3

    mortise and tenon (4 of 4)

    So, I gently clamped my side dry fit to see where I'm at...
    (the double clamps pull nice and straight, but gently!)
    side-dry-fit.jpg

    Tenon poking through the back of the back leg.
    And a wider tenon, with a mysterious yellow dot poking through the front of the front leg.
    (You may recall I modified the front wider than plans...for better balance)
    thru-back-of-back-leg.jpg thru-front-of-fr-leg.jpg

    Dry fitted, but unclamped, this is chair backside.
    The tenon ends will be chamfered by 1/8" later...
    poked-in-the-back.jpg

    After another shop session, I end up with a pair of dry fitted side frames.
    These will be taken apart to let in the stretcher tenons next time.

    Sorry for long-talking, but I wanted to offer what I stumbled to learn,
    for anyone who might wanna fasttrack their own lessons.
    I feel I am very early in my woodworking journey.
    If you're still with me, thanks!
    be well,
    Walt
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Walt Caza; 08-22-2008 at 7:49 AM.
    There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going! WCC

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind - Dr. Seuss

    Crohn's takes guts. WCC

  4. #124
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Stony Plain, Alberta
    Posts
    2,702

    Lots of Pieces

    Good Day to the Creek!

    So the second phase of my project is now under way.

    Spent the last few nights milling most of the pieces
    for my 2 chairs. The legs were already done, so that
    was a bonus. Here is a quick pic of the rails, strechers,
    legs, side slats, and the slats for the seat and back.


    Morris chair and ottoman 104.jpg


    Like Walts chair, mine will have side and back slats
    that are 1/2" thick instead of the 3/8" as the plan calls for.

    Hope everyone at the Creek has a good weekend
    and a little shop time.


    .

  5. #125
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Stony Plain, Alberta
    Posts
    2,702

    Form time

    Good Day to the Creek.

    Found a little shop time yesterday and was
    able to make the form to bend the arms.

    All in all quite straight forward.
    I cut 8 pieces of MDF to size and marked
    the arc with the help of a asymmetric drawing bow from LV.
    This first one will be the template to cut the rest.

    Morris chair and ottoman 165.jpg

    A little work with the bandsaw and spindle sander and
    we have our template.

    Morris chair and ottoman 167.jpg Morris chair and ottoman 169.jpg

    The rest of the pieces were cut close to size.
    Then my template is then screwed to it and the router gives
    me an exact replica.

    Morris chair and ottoman 170.jpg

    A few screws to hold everything together and my form is done.

    Morris chair and ottoman 176.jpg

    Hope everyone had a good weekend!

    .
    Last edited by gary Zimmel; 08-24-2008 at 9:09 AM.

  6. #126
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Waterford, MI
    Posts
    5

    Another Morris Chair

    Hello all,

    My name is Brandon and I first came to this website when I was looking for some guidance at the tail end of my Morris chair project. When I searched your site, I came across this project thread. what a great idea! I wish I had worked on this project with a group for all the same reasons that I'm sure you all are enjoying it!

    Well, it was too late to chime in for me, but I figured that I would share my chair with you all once I got done. I used the American Furniture company plans (basically a stickley reproduction) for my chair. I stuck to the plans with a few slight modifications. (less radius in bow arms, straight back slats, and my rear corbels are just a bit longer than the front to try to match the curve in the arms and the 4 degree slant in the chair bottom). I also used the lock miter bit method in making the legs. The finish I used was basically the recipe on Jeff Jewitt's Homestead finishing webpage for Stickley reproductions.

    I couldn't be happier with the chair! It's been home for 4 days and I've already have one preseason football game, one nap, and about 4 hours of reading in it!

    Here are a few pictures, and if there is any way I might be able to help share my experiences to help any of you, please let me know!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #127
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Windsor, ON
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    Thumbs up the more the merrier!

    Good Day to the Creek,
    I noticed and wanted to applaud newcomer David Fortin for not just
    becoming a member, but also a financial Contributor to our Creek.
    Even with the new ads, those who receive value from our forum should
    consider contributing money to keep it going. Lots of great new features too!
    Thanks for your consideration.

    The group build is just starting to find it's stride. Some of our named builders are soon to begin.
    Also, I have been speaking with a couple 'stealth' builders who are following along,
    and quietly building their own chairs.
    One of whom is using a shed full of red oak, and promises to post here
    as soon as he feels he has something worth showing.

    (for myself, a pic of a board and a pencil is something I would want to see)shrugs
    It is uplifting to have heard more than once, that they would not have started,
    had it not been for this thread. Cool!

    Gary and I are amazed to have had over 11000 views already.
    Thanks for your interest and support.

    Just a reminder for newcomers, it helps bring you into the fold if you plug
    a little info into your personal profile. Let us know your birthday, location
    and maybe a pic of yourself, (or a pet!). It's nice to get a sense of who it is you're talking to...
    Bonus: you also get a Happy Birthday email from Sawmill Creek!!

    Also, longer threads are best viewed in Linear display mode. This keep postings
    listed in chronological order, and prevents shuffled posts, which we call 'buried'.
    I explained this in an earlier post called 'solution to shuffled posts'.
    It is also helpful to adjust your User CP to your liking.
    Myself, I view the freshest postings first, so I do not have to scroll through old posts each time.

    Lastly, to those following this thread: Please feel welcome to post comments
    and questions you might have... chances are someone else also wants to know.
    ...And thanks for watching our story unfold!
    be well,
    Walt
    Last edited by Walt Caza; 08-25-2008 at 10:39 AM.
    There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going! WCC

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind - Dr. Seuss

    Crohn's takes guts. WCC

  8. #128
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Brush Prairie, WA
    Posts
    191

    Back in the land of the living...

    Hey, guys. I've been distracted for awhile. Thanks for the concerned emails - I think the last project update had me whining about how my mortises turned out.

    I took a short break from the chairs - piled up all the materials and decided to take a swing at the shop - the worktables had been driving me batty for a couple of years - sagging, out of square, generally messy, and poorly organized. So, I put an ad on CL, got rid of ALL the tables and benches in one sitting, and started over from a gutted shop. I had a week vacation, and LOML was summer vacationing, so she spent a LOT of time in the shop helping and lending emotional support. She went so far as to sit down with boxes and boxes of screws with a tape measure and organized them all by length/type/finish.

    Anyhow, 28 sheets of plywood, 2 weeks and a gallon of Deft lacquer later, I have new Oak ply/Alder trimmed LARGE workbenches. Everything is now at 34 1/2" to match the height of the PM2000, even the mobile tables (that double as scrap storage). So, throwing a sheet of ply on the TS got easier and easier as I built things out. By the last two or three cuts, it was a breeze. Why didn't I think of this earlier?

    The sticking point was that I designed the drop (4 7/16", of course!) for the Makita LS 1012 CSMS with a couple of inches on each side for clearance. Then, when I got the 20' of lowers built and got the saw mounted, flushed, level, I noticed a teensy issue - it had enough clearance to go to ALMOST 10 degrees either way. (*sigh*)

    So, instead of tearing out the saw and the cabinet, I thought, "Self, this shouldn't be too hard" and raised the saw to countertop level, made 6 marks at the various 48 degree marks, sliding all directions, and got to cutting. It was WAY more work than I thought, getting all those compound angles and inside 45s cut and trimmed and sanded and plumb was a lot of work. And now the cabinet looks like a Frank Lloyd Wright creation near the miter saw. But it's functional, and finished.

    Anyhow, a new workspace, and completely reorganized and cleaned out shop, and way more table top space to work let me get a fresh look at the chairs, and gave me some time to think about new angles as I finished this big project off.

    Got to working last night on side slats, spacers, and got 4 sides dry-fit! Note that I'm going with slats/spacers all the way down the side instead of the center piece with the cutout. I like the look better this way.

    Then got the jig/form made for the arms. I took a sightly different tack than Gary. I cut 7 pieces of 3/4" MDF at 36" x 6", screwed them each together from opposing sides after clamping tightly and squaring, then drew the tracing on the face. Wrestled the whole block over to the band saw, and with one pass, had the whole thing done. Because it's a form, it didn't require any sanding, as I got a clean cut and went slowly. Heavy little beast, but I guess that's the point! Started to cut out the pattern for the arm shape, then realized I'd have to use 1/4" or something anyhow, as it needs to be flexible enough to bend on the curve. I may just stick with paper. Of course, the first pass with the Festool on the MDF left a nice clean cutline in one of the new mobile benches. (*facepalm*)

    Anyhow, I'm back in the groove. Got lots of catch-up work to do, but hopefully over the next week or two I'll be where I should have been. Making this shop work for me has been a bit of a trial. but well worth it.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #129
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Berwick, PA
    Posts
    42

    Got legs; and a question or two

    Quote Originally Posted by Walt Caza View Post
    ... I have been speaking with a couple 'stealth' builders who are following along,
    and quietly building their own chairs.
    One of whom is using a shed full of red oak, and promises to post here
    as soon as he feels he has something worth showing....
    Guess that was my cue ... My original plan was to follow along with this thread and keep my mouth shut in case I never finished the chair, but speaking up might keep me on track. Hello all!

    So ... I'm working in red oak, even though my shedful is dwindling. I glued up my legs this weekend and am milling some lumber for the sides. I need a new BS blade before I resaw the pieces for the arms.

    I had a question about a potential "gotcha" in the Wood magazine directions (which I'm following, more or less) ... how much springback should I expect from the laminated arms? And how much of a problem will it be? Would it make more sense to trim the sides up using the arms themselves as the template, rather than the mdf form?

    Thanks!

  10. #130

    Springback

    I used a different plan, and I think a little more severe bend to the arms. I bent the arms to a 72 inch radius at about 40 inches in length and had about 1/4 inch of spring back at each end. It was probably less when I trimmed them to 36 inch finished length. I used the finished arms as templates for the angles on the legs and it worked out fine.

  11. #131
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Windsor, ON
    Posts
    657
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    3

    Thumbs up well done, sweet chair and first posting...

    Hi Everyone,
    I want to formally welcome Brandon to the Creek, and also the Morris chair group.
    You built a terrific Morris chair, made a great first post, and shared
    a few pics with us to boot!
    Threads are like an ongoing conversation, it is never too late to chime in.

    How did you like making your lock miter legs?
    Do you have any construction pics...we would love to see them.
    Pleasing colour, any chance you want to lay out the basics,
    for those not likely to dig up Jewitt's homepage?

    Those are some beefy corbels! Attached by screws then plugs?
    Care to share how you made your pivot and recline pegs?
    Inquiring minds wanna know!

    Sweet looking leg top tenons, do they really poke through the arms?
    Or are they faux caps? Not that that would make them any lesser...

    Do you find your 4 degree seat slant comfortable?
    If you had it to do again, would you change that slant?
    (some of us are discussing that very issue today!)

    Your cushions look awesome...are you willing to tell us about them, too?

    It is clear to me that you have nailed the chair trifecta:
    -sports
    -reading
    -and naps
    congratulations!

    You have every right to be happy with, and proud of, your Morris chair.
    Thank you so much for sharing it with us.
    We hope you stick around the Creek, and share some more!
    Good to have you on the team.
    Thanks,
    Walt

    ps All these variations are the spice of our story!
    pss Brandon, What are you working on next?!?
    Last edited by Walt Caza; 08-25-2008 at 10:00 PM.
    There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going! WCC

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind - Dr. Seuss

    Crohn's takes guts. WCC

  12. #132
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Berwick, PA
    Posts
    42
    Quote Originally Posted by David Fortin View Post
    I used a different plan, and I think a little more severe bend to the arms. I bent the arms to a 72 inch radius at about 40 inches in length and had about 1/4 inch of spring back at each end. It was probably less when I trimmed them to 36 inch finished length. I used the finished arms as templates for the angles on the legs and it worked out fine.
    Thanks, this is very helpful! I plan to use the actual arms as templates also, just to avoid having to persuade them.

    Did you use three layers laminated, or more?

  13. #133
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Waterford, MI
    Posts
    5

    Another Morris Chair

    Walt,

    Thanks for the complements and the warm welcome to your community. This project was an exciting one for sure, and I am happy to be able to share my experiences with you all.

    About the lock miter legs - this was the second time I have done this. (first time was an arts and crafts clock with a tile inset which is very similar to a Schlaubauch clock design) I used a jig published in the Tauton Press book: In the Craftsman Style. The article in called "Stickley Style Legs by Patrick Nelson. If anybody is not familar with this method, contact me and I will try to help. I did this using my Rockwell shaper and even with this I ended up doing this in two passes! With one pass the White Oak just seemed to hard and tore out when I was cutting "into the grain". I ended up making these about 5 inches longer than necessary so that I could avoid using the ends. Even doing all of this, I ended using wood filler on the edges quite a bit as I had gaps. This filling seemed to work out fine and really can only be noticed by a fellow woodworker. I plugged both the ends about 3 inches deep after I glued them up.

    The finishing process goes as follows:

    1.) Sand to 180 grit
    2.) Wet wood and sand the raised grain (with 220 grit)
    3.) Apply transtint dye (2 parts golden brown/1 part mission brown diluted in water) - sand with grey scothbrite
    4.) Wipe on one coat General Finishes Seal-A-Cell clear
    5.) Wipe on General Finishes Antique Walnut Gel Stain
    6.) Wipe on two coats of General Finishes Arm-R-Seal Satin - sand between lightly with grey scothbrite
    7.) Apply Antiquax Brown Wax

    I did end up screwing the corbels to the legs and plugging them afterwards. Two screws for each one.

    Now for the pivot and recline pegs - this was quite a chore! I don't have a lathe and decided to make these with the only tool that I had access to that made sense - A Powermatic belt and disk sander in our prototype shop at work! I made a blank and sanded them from there. This method worked, but talk about a tedious task! Two days of sanding during my lunch hour and they were done though.

    The tenons on the legs do pass through the arms. The plans that I had just showed me how to make caps, but I really wanted to give this a shot. The tenons do have small gaps and some glue squeeze out visible, but I am happier that I went this route even though it would of looked alot cleaner with caps. I guess I've bought in (maybe a little too much) into all of the arts and crafts history mumbo jumbo about the return to honest craftsmanship I've read about. This whole process of making the thru tenons on the legs and mortises in the bow arms was quite an experience as I had no guidance and will gladly attempt to explain some (or all) of the steps if anyone else is going this route.

    I originally was going to match the angle of the seat bottom to the angle of the bow arm at the rear leg (5 degrees), but I feared that this would be too much. I ended up going with 4 degrees and this seems good to me. I must confess that it doesn't seem like much of an angle when sitting in it, but if I compared it to a flat seat it probably would. The way the chair sits, I usually have a bit of a gap between by lower back (at the hips and just under) and the seatback, so I would imagine that a 5 or 6 degree seat wouldn't be too bad. If I remember right, the difference between the front and back of the seat bottom was 1 3/4". (seat length x tangent x degrees) - 25.5tan(4)

    My leather was purchased at Weleather.com (recommended by somebody on this website!) Dark Honeywas my choice and wasn't my first choice but I was told to get at least 60 sq. feet of leather and this was the only hide I liked from them that came in a large enough size. I am very happy with the leather and got it for $300! The chair bottom is done in a 8-way tied coil spring instead of just foam. I knew this way is better, and I was afraid I'd regret not doing it. Because I chose this way, I had to make corner braces and a seat frame rather than a sheet of plywood for the seat bottom base. I supplied the plywood base for the ottoman and the frame for the seat bottom and the upholsterer charged $325 for the labor. I am satisfied with the job they did. I did get other quotes for about $600 and the job may have been top notch but I feel they did a B+ job for an A+ price!

    I was also asked about the bow arms. My arms were sawn from an 8/4 board with a brand new blade on the bandsaw. I used a life size template that came with the plans. In the plans, I believe the arms were to start at the front legs already beginning to bow, but I made them perpendicular to front legs. The reason I think this is because the original Stickley chairs have a much more extreme bow than my chair. I didn't want this much bow, but did make one mistake. I didn't adjust the locations of the four holes in the arms for the adjustable seatback. I know that I will never use the first location, and probably will not use the second. If anyone desires, I can get the angle of my seatback in all four positions as a reference for you. One thing about the arms - they are 6 inches wide! at first I thought this would be a little much as they to look huge, but thet are great! - I can use one arm as a place to put my drink and the other as a place to put a book. You really don't need an end table with this chair. I am going to get a floor lamp instead. I think it will be the Quoizel Grove Park Inn light. (any thoughts?)

    Unfortunately I didn't take pictures along my journey of making the chair and only have the finished product. I will take better pictures, or more detailed pictures and post them or email them if it can help anyone.

    All my other projects (besides a log bed for my son) have been functional, but nothing I actually personally use and put my hands on and I must confess this project has reached a new level of satisfaction and I am excited for all of you to enjoy the same reaction with your chairs!

    As for the next project - I guess I have to chose. The chair was one of many things needed to refurnish our living room. We are going down the arts and crafts/mission road for this and still need a couch, rocker, and table. For awhile though, I think I'll just come home, enjoy my family, and spend my quiet evenings in my Morris Chair!

    Take care,
    Brandon

  14. #134

    Spring back

    3 layers each 3/8 inches thick. They will bend around a 72 inch radius form but require some persuading. I used Pro-Glue veneer bond dry resin (Woodcraft). Long open time and pot life, no creep.

  15. #135
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Windsor, ON
    Posts
    657
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    3

    last leg pokes done...

    Good Day Everyone,
    After the latest heatwave, with humidty adjusted temps over 100degrees F,
    I finally got a little shop time in the loft.
    I was able to poke through the mortises to receive the stretcher tenons.
    Earlier, I referred to making the tenons which poke thru the front of the front legs wider.
    (indicated by those yellow dots)

    The tenons which poke thru the back of the back legs could not be made wider.
    The mortise criss-cross at the back leg is just 1/4 inch.
    The mortise criss-cross at the front leg is 3.25".
    This provides a 3" seat slant between the stretchers.
    quarter-inch-crisscross.jpg 3-inch-front-crisscross.jpg

    So, my side frames are nearly done, fit but not glued.
    Morris-side-not-glued.jpg dry-Morris-sides.jpg

    Fair warning: If you are gonna trim tenons down to length,
    do not attempt this floating trapped projectile cut!
    not-a-great-idea.jpg

    I snipped them nearly off, and finished with a couple strokes of my hand backsaw. (really, I did...)

    Next time I hand fit the stretcher tenons into the legs...
    Here is a link to a homemade tool I use to tune these m&t to fit. (link)
    http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...529#post914529
    be well,
    Walt
    Last edited by Walt Caza; 08-26-2008 at 12:38 PM.
    There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going! WCC

    Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind - Dr. Seuss

    Crohn's takes guts. WCC

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