Old Workbench Tops and New Workbench: First Step to my Workbench!

[Jim Newman]

I just picked up an old laminated workbench top 3' x 8' and 2 1/2"+ thick. It appears to be maple. The top was stored on its side in the dirt and started to rot a little on the dirt side. I intend to use this for my workbench top for my workbench I am designing. First question is what should I do with the piece that started to rot, as it is only 2" wide? Cut it off and replace it, or just don't worry about it? I am in the planning stages of my workbench and considering ripping this old top and doubling it up. I should also mention I also have the same top but only 1 3/4" thick, but stained with chemicals, so it will have to be cleaned up.

My next question is, if I ripped the tops and/or wanted to double them up depthwise, can I glue them together or will the wood movement and grain orientation not make this a good idea? I intend to use an apron and bought the maple and paduak (2 x 8") several years ago. I was planning on a front vise/tail vise combination and have 2 new Record 52 1/2 D's in the box I bought years ago for a front vise, Gebruder Busch Tail vise hardware and a Veritas Twin Screw Vise as well. I was considering putting the Twin Screw on the left end of the bench so I could hold big items using the whole bench or to be able to hand dovetail carcass parts, etc, though I have not done many dovetails by hand before. I intend to build furniture and use traditional wood joints, as well as do all the trim to finish my home I built (literally). I am considering putting in a tool trough about 15-18" in from the front side of the bench, and make the back side of the bench about 12-15" wide. However it seems a 36" wide bench is quite wide to work across, but have no personal bench experience to know. I have The Workbench, The Wokbench Book, and Building Workbenches and have studied them for years to arrive at this configuration. I was thinking of using the bench across the back of my table saw, which is 7' long with the extension wing, so the bench will be out in the room and act as an outfeed table as well when needed. I also have a space up against a wall I can use if I don't like it behind the table saw.

Any comments and suggestions are welcome and I need the help! I am starting this thread, so I can finish the planning phase and start making the bench shortly with everyone's help and encouragement as it is a lifelong dream! So let me know what to do about the narrow section of the top that is starting to rot and if I can glue the tops together depthwise and if not, how to join them (so they are stable) so I can increase the depth of the top to 4" to 5" thick. Thanks!

[Alan Turner]

Jim,
You have many questions! I'll tackle a couple.

If a bench is to be used against a wall or at the back of a table saw (I am assuming perpendicular to the path of the blade), then the depth will not be critical, and wider than customary will be fine. If you plan to work on the bench from both sides, then IMHO 36" is too wide. Rather, about 26" or so will be more comfortable.


As to the old bench top you located, first question is: is it reasonably flat? Take some winding sticks to it and check it. If so, then rip off the 2" of rot. A metal detector would be a handy device for an old top before ripping.

I am not familiar with your brand of tail vise hardware. Each set of tail vise hardware I have seen has had different dimensions in terms of the ultimate width of the wood structure (from a plan view). This will need to be determined first, before cutting wood. When we build benches at PFW, we build the main section of the top, and then build and install the tail vise, and then determine the width and starting position of the dog hole row and the face cap from the actual vise, as installed. I would suggest this approach for you as well. This will require you to rip off the width of the tail vise from the bench top, cut it to length, and then reinstall.

Your questions about the front vises and whether to use the LV twin screw are personal to your usage of the bench.

Unless you have some amazingly large milling equipment, I think you will find that getting a good flat surface for lamination of the two bench tops, to thicken the ultimate bench top to 4-1/4", will be quite difficult. 2-1/2" of top thickness should be sufficient for most any purpose. A large traditional veneer press might be required.

Good luck on this interesting project.

[Alex Yeilding]

Alan, can you please elaborate on this? It is the opposite of what I expected.

If a bench is to be used against a wall or at the back of a table saw (I am assuming perpendicular to the path of the blade), then the depth will not be critical, and wider than customary will be fine. If you plan to work on the bench from both sides, then IMHO 36" is too wide. Rather, about 26" or so will be more comfortable.

I was thinking that with a free-standing bench, 36" would give him 18" of work surface from each side, while if against a wall or table saw, the back 12"-18" would not be easily reachable, and would end up being a "table" or "countertop", not a workbench.

[Mike Gager]

If you plan to work on the bench from both sides, then IMHO 36" is too wide. Rather, about 26" or so will be more comfortable.

i somewhat disagree with this as i feel the wider/bigger the better. right now my "workbench" is a 48"x48" laminate covered board i have set on saw horses. i know its not exactly the same as a real workbench but its what i use. my next project im working on is an actual workbench that will measure about 48"x96" and i cant wait to have the bigger space to work on. its so nice to be able to put your whole project on the workbench to work on it. having only 26" of depth wouldnt allow me to even put most of the stuff ive built so far on it at all

however im 6'5" and i have no problem with reaching across the bench and its out in the middle of my shop and i can work from any side. this may be why i like it where someone shorter with thier bench against the wall wouldnt like the extra width

just my $0.02

[Charlie Mastro]

i somewhat disagree with this as i feel the wider/bigger the better. right now my "workbench" is a 48"x48" laminate covered board i have set on saw horses. i know its not exactly the same as a real workbench but its what i use.

Mike what you are discribing is an assembly table. We had one about the same size that we built cabinets and such on. The work bench is used to make the parts that you assemble on the assembly table. You may have used it for both but most of us have both.

I would never use my workbench for a run off table. I always have something I'm working on that would be in the way. My workbench is just too important a tool to use it for more than one thing. Just my opinion.

[Jim Newman]

Alan, I have the large tail vise hardware I bought from Woodcraft several years ago and have since learned it is from Gebruder-Busch of Germany. I bought quartersawn pasauk to build the spacer block between the upper and lower guide plates. It will end up being about 24" long, 6" wide and about 7"+ deep. The Tail vise hardware installation seems to start from the bottom of the bench to allow the lower guide plate to move freely. I was planning on making the dog hole/apron as wide as the tail vise or about 6" and the apron lumber will finish about 7" wide (being 2"x 8"), so the apron will be about 7" deep.

I planned on using square dogs for the front set of dog holes. I have 9"+ long steel dogs I bought from Highland Hardware (Hoffman and Hammer Steel Bench Dogs) years ago as well. I was planning on using round dogs for the rest of the bench. I originally bought the twin screw vise for the right end of the bench years ago, then after reading and learning about benches, feel a tail vise on the right side has merit. However, I wanted to be able to clamp large items on the bench such as doors I would make and large pieces of finish trim for my home) and a twin screw across an end does well with this. I also felt for hand dovetailing larger pieces a twin screw would be ideal, but felt using the front set of dog holes close to the front of the bench would hurt the twin screw vise over time, so a tail vise would be more useful in everday use on the right side. Since I already have the vise though, felt putting it on the left SIDE (not left front) of the bench would be good, then using my Record 52 1/2D in the regular left front position (yes, I am right handed) would be good. I felt having the legs even with the front of the apron would be best for clamping for the front vise as well large objects like doors (thanks Chris Schwartz!) so have gone with that design decision. Then next design choice is to situate the left legs about 16" from the left end of the bench with the right side of the front left (front Record) vise over the legs. The 16 inches is the clearance needed for the Twin Screws of the Veritas vise so they don't hit the top end stretcher on the left side of the bench. I will also have to have them just a little higher than the Record vise screw and guide plates so they don't hit (each other). I was planning on mounting the Record at the bottom of the 6" wide apron/ dog hole block, which is twice as deep as the 3 1/2" depth of the vise jaws of the Record. The legs on the right side (of the bench) would be in about 25" or so to allow a dog hole next to the tail vise (and before the leg on that side), in about 2 inches or so from the end of the dog hole block before the tail vise.

For the tail vise constuction I planned on followng the directions John Leppo detailed in his excellent article in the Fine Woodworking, April 2003 issue, "Rock Solid Workbench". However, I was not sure I could do the Houndstooth dovetails for the workbench, as I have only done a few dovetails many years ago. However, in that spirit, I have gotten my dovetail and tenon saws in good shape in case I want to tackle it. After an aquisition spree to get a few vintage Disston dovetail and tenon saws and a visit to Steve Cooke of Cooke's Sharpening 40 minutes up the road (from my home) took care of that (Thanks Steve, what a great guy and highly recommended!) I feel I am ready to go. Alan I remember you have some studio nights on ocassion, so maybe this is a project I can come up for as I live about 2 1/2 hours away from you.

I hope this details my intentions a little more. As far as the tops, neither is flat. I have 2 choices. If I rip the tops in half (to 18" in width) to double them in thickness, I can pass them through a 20" planer, whch a friend has (my planer and jointer are only 15" and 8" Bridgewoods, respectively). If not, I will have to do it by hand, I guess with hand planes in which I am well equipped. Another preparation project for me to get to this point was to learn to sharpen and get hand planes working well. I have a LN No.7 a Union No. 8 along with a LN low angle jack, Stanley No. 5's, 6, 7, 5 1/2, 4's and more smoothers than you can shake a stick at, including a stable of 3 Primus woodies (Smoother, English Pattern Jack and Jointer). So I just need to finish the design and get some encouragement from my "soldiers in arms" to get the bench and my home done!

So going back to the design, should I keep the tool tray in the middle or put it on the back or not at all as it will make the bench 6 inches wider at 36" or so? Right now what is in stone is a 6" wide dog/apron block to be made of 2 x 8" maple, padauk and red oak on hand and at least 12" of workbench from the tops I have on hand now that are both 36" wide by 8' long, one top 2 1/2" thick and the other 1 3/4" thick. If I put in a tool tray of 6", that would make the bench 24" wide already, so a 12" wide back part of the bench would bring it to 36 inches in width. I have never had a bench, so am not married to a tool tray, but after years of thinking about it, thought maybe it had some merit and can help clamping at times, especially with it close to the middle. This also gives me a regular 24" wide bench with the flexibility of a larger jointer's bench as well or at least that is what I was thinking! However, a straight, flat, very heavy, solid bench top that will not move and supports clamping in all 3 dimensions and allows me to do hand joint making such as dovetails, mortise and tenon, carving, along with clamping larger pieces of furniture to do work on is the most basic fundamental I will not budge from. Guess, I just need your help to finish this design with all the materials on hand and get the project from design to making it.

I should mention, I intend to do all the finish trim in my home (I built) with this bench, making cabinet heads for above all my doors and windows, stools and aprons, wall paneling, etc. I also have all the oak and cherry base and casing I need to hand plane machine marks out of to get them ready to finish and install as well as the extension jambs, so holding long pieces of trim at least 8' long to plane and finish is an important role the bench needs to fulfill and has been incorporated into the design. I also am considering making raised panel oak and cherry doors for my home as well, which is another reason for the Twin Screw vise at the end of the bench and my original thought of a 36" wide bench years ago. Only after reading so much about workbenches in books and here, have I considered cutting down the width, but you guys have far more experience than I. So to summarize, I need a jointer's and hand tool bench I guess...something to build doors and all the fine finish work for my home at the largest, but something I can do fine hand tool joints on as well for the rest of my life without the bench being too large and cumbersome to use. Guess this was why I considered putting the tool tray just past the middle of the bench...so I can have a regular size bench of about 24" width most of the time, but a larger bench of 36" to construct large objects like solid raised panel doors I would make. Hope this explains some more behind my design process and why I have "evolved" the design the way I have and am now ready to open it to all of you more experienced woodworkers for your scrutiny so I don't miss something important. This is why I have had a hard time designing my bench, vise selection, location, etc. and why I need everyone's help to get me "over the hump" and get this thing going, so thanks everyone!!! I assure you I will follow through on my end!!!

[Alex Yeilding]

Hope this explains some more behind my design process and why I have "evolved" the design the way I have and am now ready to open it to all of you more experienced woodworkers for your scrutiny so I don't miss something important. This is why I have had a hard time designing my bench, vise selection, location, etc. and why I need everyone's help to get me "over the hump" and get this thing going, so thanks everyone!!!

IMHO, you are going about this in exactly the right way--defining the "mission" of your bench, and designing to that goal. Learn from what has worked for others, but apply what you learn rather than copying.

I don't get the sense that you are letting your wood "find" dictate your design. Don't. While you have to consider the stock you have to work with, ten years from now the source of wood, or a few hundred $s getting exactly what you need to build to your needs will be forgotten, but any significant compromises you make to use existing stock will be a thorn in your side.