Way OT - Do any industries offer lifetime employment these days?

[Brian Elfert]

Are there any industries that offer lifetime employment these days? I don't mean a guaranteed job, but industries that are very consistent and don't hire and lay off folks constantly as business ebbs and flows.

I currently work in IT (Information Technology) and pretty much any company of any size has either an IT department or an IT person.

I work in the newspaper industry and the newspaper industry is going the way of the way of the horse and buggy it seems. The entire industry is losing revenue, but my employer is losing revenue much faster than other newspapers. A 3% layoff with wage freezes was announced today on top of 10% layoffs in the past year.

Maybe it isn't possible today, but it would be nice to find an industry where someone can basically have a job as long as they want one. Many folks in IT switch jobs every few years, but I would like a nice stable job. I know it will never be like our father's or grandfather's day when they had the same job for 30 or 40 years until retirement.

I would probably look for another job, but I have four weeks vacation after just seven years. A new job would mean I might be first out the door if there are layoffs there.

[Joe Pelonio]

Yes, actually.

I used to have that kind of job, stayed 17 years. That has it's own issues too, but yes, totally secure. Everyone puts in their 30+ years and retires, most there taking home more than they made working once Social Security kicks in.

It was a municipal utility district, governed by an elected board of directors, and of course, people will always use water and need the sewage treated. State law required them to be in the black, so if money runs short the rates are increased. Every range of jobs from engineers, clerical office, customer service, IT, carpenters, auto mechanics, laborers and on and on. (I was a management analyst).

[Brian Elfert]

I've thought about government work, but government jobs aren't always as secure as in the past.

Our state government has laid off quite a few people this decade with a $4.5 billion deficit a few years back. The governor would not allow tax increases. Congress likes to eliminate various programs and departments from year to year. Government jobs will probably shrink as Medicare and Social Security obligations grow.

[Joe Pelonio]

That's why I specified this one type. Cities and counties, even states, are subject o the economy. When homes values drop, and people stop spending, they lose tax revenue. The public agencies providing essential services like water and sewage treatment may not be totally exempt from economic influences, but are as close as it gets. The place I worked never had a layoff or hiring freeze in it's history, since 1923. When I left in 1992, there were 1,500 employees, currently 1,900. An entry level clerical position there pays $3,796/month with full benefits. The job I had back then is now at $6,532/mo.

[Gary Keedwell]

Many, many government jobs are secure...for instance...justice ..prison guards..
Gary

[Dennis Peacock]

Don't we all wish the IT industry was a stable job. Much of our IT work is now getting shifted to India and Poland. Then we wonder why the American economy is in the toilet.

I better hush before I get myself in trouble.

[Steven Wilson]

Nope, none left. Just assume that your employer will suck your brain for what you know and then toss you asside when you are of no value. The way to win is to make sure that you get more out of the job than you give your employer. Not just money, take advantage of training, certification training, networking, etc. Always have a resume that's relevant. Always look for that next job. You owe your employer nothing. It's just business, nothing personal.

[Phil Sanders]

Brian:

Excluding Doctors, Lawyers, Military, Plumbers, Post Office, and Government Employees then no.

By industry, I am presuming you mean like Auto, Appliance, Electronics, and so forth; the industry your employer is in. Industries are changing, or moving overseas to cheaper labor markets, and then moving again as other labor markets open up. Technology changes, so do companies and company management.

Example: Local telephone companies are hurting because of the Internet Phones and the Cell phones; technology changes. Here in Detroit area, people are dropping their land line phone since the cell phones work better and have less technical problems than dealing with the local Telco and static filled lines. (please note, I said technical problems, cell phone billing is another topic.)

You can only protect yourself, IMHO, by selecting a job field, or skill, and realize that you are only a replaceable cog in the company which you are currently working for. It may be cheaper to replace you than train you.

The reason IT people, including myself, change jobs so often is to gain experience with new ways of doing things. Every company solves similar problems with different means. You become loyal to your craft, trade, job skills, or area of expertise. You should expect that technology will overcome your knowledge every so many years, so you have to be on the look out that you don't become technologically boxed into dead end job skills. Dead end job skills which are obsolete and un-marketable to new employers.

Phil

[Matt Meiser]

The reason IT people, including myself, change jobs so often is to gain experience with new ways of doing things. Every company solves similar problems with different means. You become loyal to your craft, trade, job skills, or area of expertise. You should expect that technology will overcome your knowledge every so many years, so you have to be on the look out that you don't become technologically boxed into dead end job skills. Dead end job skills which are obsolete and un-marketable to new employers.

That is an excellent point. I've changed jobs less often than average, but working in consulting we are constantly doing new things rather than supporting the old stuff day in and out. We do some of that, but usually our customer takes over the day to day support and we move on to new projects

At my last job I interviewed many people who had 20+ years of IT experience--all on some obsolete system. Their salary expectations were that of a 20 year experienced individual, but their technical skills weren't as good as a recent college grad with good co-op experience.

[Terre Hooks]

Do any industries offer lifetime employment these days?

Yes.

Doctors. Nurses. Hospital Administrators.

Police officers. Firefighters. Politicians.

Grocery store workers. Sewer line installers. Septic tank installers.

Funeral Home directors. Embalmers. Casket makers. Grave diggers.

[Art Mulder]

Well the pay is lousy, but parenting is a pretty much lifetime job.

Has anyone mentioned the Military? That's pretty permanent isn't it?

[Greg Peterson]

Lifetime employment options are becoming more of the exception than the norm. Publicly traded corporations are forced by investors to reduce expenses and increase profits. Private companies also realize a gain by moving production facilities into low cost labor markets.

As long as investors continue to demand historically high, short term returns on their investments, corporations will be forced to compete on two fronts; the market place and Wall Street.

Corporations that typically provided lifetime, multi-generational jobs are simply responding to the market.

[Dennis Peacock]

Corporations that typically provided lifetime, multi-generational jobs are simply responding to the market.

I don't see any problem with a company doing this and keeping a steady / reliable workforce in place. In my book, as long as the company is making money and meeting market demands....then why get "greedy"?

We don't "have" to have an exorbitant way of life....but a way of life.

[Brian Elfert]

Well the pay is lousy, but parenting is a pretty much lifetime job.

Has anyone mentioned the Military? That's pretty permanent isn't it?

I also am looking for an industry that pays decent. Military is not it. I am also 10 to 15 years beyond the ideal age for entering the military. I know they do have needs for IT skills though.

This brings up something that might not be so bad. If I do get laid off working for military contractor in IT in Iraq might be so bad for a year or so. I know it is risky and would only consider if I did lose my job.

[Brian Elfert]

I don't see any problem with a company doing this and keeping a steady / reliable workforce in place. In my book, as long as the company is making money and meeting market demands....then why get "greedy"?

The problem is shareholders today. They want profits today, not next month or even next quarter and they want those profits to continue forever. Even when companies report record profits shareholders will sell the stock if the outlook is for lower profits in the next quarter.

CEOs are beholden to the shareholders so they lay off people if even one quarter is bad and the shareholders reward them for reducing expenses thereby hopefully increasing profits.

I think we as a nation would be better off if shareholders looked at the long term profits of companies over a year or two instead of focusing so much on today's share price. These companies might do better too if they kept employees long term who know the business instead of hiring and laying off employees based on today's share price.