J/P combo upgrade or just a new planer?

[Don Abele]

I have a major kitchen overhaul project to complete this summer for which I've been stocking up on the toy...err, tools.

Last year, I got an excellent deal on upgrading my 6" Jet jointer with a Byrd Shelix head. I also have the Ridgid 13" portable planer. Both are in excellent shape.

I recently found an excellent supply of S4S Hard Maple for the cabinet face frames, doors, and drawers. A lot of it has some amount of curl to it as well. It ranges from 4/4 to 5/4 in 6 to 8 inch widths. This is obviously too thick for my purposes, so it all needs to be planed down. If I use the Ridgid planer I know I'm just asking for disappointment (overall finished quality, time, noise, blades, etc).

So here's the question, do I:

(A) Sell my current Jointer and Planer and buy the Grizzly combo unit with the shelix head (G0634).

(B) Sell the Planer and upgrade to the Grizzly 15" with shelix head (G1021X2).

Background: I mostly buy S4S or S2S boards and tend to stick to the 6-8" range. Very rarely will I grab a 10" board (even if it's available) - I'm just too worried about excessive cupping.

What I would really like from you is not just a "Go with option A" answer, but instead a "Go with option A because..." answer. I'm drawing on the collective experience, especially those that had separate tools and now own the combo units.

BTW, I want to thank my Uncle for his "stimulus" which will provide the funds for this acquisition as I do my part to help the economy by spending it quickly.

Thanks in advance for your guidance.

Be well,

Doc

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Or you could get a 12" Hammer JP combo and install a true helical on that. One helical cutterhead with inserts will last a very long time. and you'll only need one.

[Greg Funk]

If you are going to be making kitchen cabinets with frame and panel doors it is likely that you will need some wider doors. If you get the Grizzly combo unit your max panel size will be 12" which might give you a 15" maximum door width. I would prefer to have the widest planer possible. If you have the space a separate Planer and Jointer is more flexible and easy to use (no need to switch combo unit).

Greg

[Matt Meiser]

Hey, we must be related because my uncle is sending me money too. He must have a lot of money laying around . I'm not sure how many kids you have, but if its two, your Uncle should be giving you enough to cover the Grizzly J/P combo with a standard head, not including shipping. I think you'd need 4 kids to cover the spiral head if my math is right. This is the only time I've been jealous of my friend with 5 kids.

I vote that you should buy the combo so that I can read more reviews.

In all seriousness, I used to have an 8" jointer and 15" planer. They take up a lot of room. And most of the boards I've personally ever used that needed to be face jointed have been wider than 8". When I scaled back my shop I went to an old 6" jointer for edge jointing and a portable planer. Those meet my needs great as far as capacity, with the exception that if I have boards that need to be face jointed I'll either have to phone a friend or make a planer sled, and the jointer is a tad short. I think the Griz would take up about the same floor space as my current two machines or one of my old machines. It would give great jointing capacity and planing capacity almost equal to my current planer, all in a heavier duty machine. Anyway, that's the reason for my interest.

[Mike Spanbauer]

One other thought. That Rigid is a unit that performs extremely well and actually the cut quality on it is equal to or superior to many 15" planers (minus helical / index heads.) However, the knife cost and life of each side isn't too great. I miss my 13" rigid some times now that I have a 15" griz and wish I had kept it for finish cuts.

I've also waffled about whether to upgrade my current J & P to a j/p combo based on cost. However, I'm fairly sure that if the right deal were to present itself I would spring for the combo + cutterhead unit based on the enhanced jointer capability. I've a 24" drum sander, and frankly once the panel is glued up, I've never re-fed my panels back through my planer. Through my DS, yes, but not my planer.

I would however, LOVE to have an extra 4 or 6" to my jointer which is currently an 8" PM60 (a dang fine jointer in its own right) for times when I have highly figured stock that would like to be skewed across the head, OR simply 8"> stock.

I would suggest considering keeping your Rigid no matter which direction you go as a set of sharp knives on it will cut VERY well given the high RPM.

mike

[Don Abele]

Wow guys, that was some quick responses.

Cliff, the Hammer is just a tad over the price point I was looking at (actually it's almost close to double it).

Greg, I plane the boards prior to glue up and then, like Mike, I have a 22" drum sander to finalize any smoothing. I have never planned a glued up panel.

Matt, yup, same uncle and I have 3 little crumb snatchers plus the wifey so the total purchase should be covered easily (I hope). I also confirmed that the combo unit would actually occupy an area almost the same size as both the 15" planer and my 6" jointer (J/P is 45x60, Planer is 48x32, Jointer is 46x20 - so 48x52). It appears that the rear fence post is HUGE when in the actual use position. I don't know how small it can get, but it seems that size doesn't sound like it's a real consideration. At least until someone that owns the unit chimes in.

Mike, you're right on with the Ridgid. I love it and it has performed VERY well for me. I actually have a new set of knives on it now with a fresh spare set waiting. They do dull quickly though with the hard maple.

Thanks guys - keep 'em coming, they have me thinking.

Be well,

Doc

[Matt Meiser]

Wow, its a lot bigger than I imagined and I've never looked at specs. But also take into account infeed and outfeed room. The J/P combo share the same infeed/outfeed path where the separate machines will need separate areas. The bed on 15" planers is quite low.

[Jim Becker]

Wide is good, IMHO. And not just for wide boards. I've seen no need for a special cutter head on my J/P combo...the quick change Tersa knives are the bee's knees and since I can skew the cut, dealing with knarly stock is no worse than with a heilical head. I love my J/P...no regrets.

[Don Abele]

Matt, you have me taking a ruler to my monitor now!

Just did some guesstimations...

The J/P Combo lists an overall height of 45" - that makes it appear that the planer table is about 26".

The 15" Planer lists an overall height of 43" (interesting that it is shorter than the J/P) - that would put the table at about...26".

Both of these are low, considering that the height on my Ridgid (on it's stand) is about 36". I think feeding stock lower will actually be more of a benefit (less height to lift it up to load it).



This brought up another question (since I'm measuring things)...

The planer has a table (with extensions) of 51". The J/P Combo only has a planer table of 23" - that seems REALLY small. My Ridgid is 33" with extensions.

Does such a short table create any problems? Especially with snipe on long boards (the longest I typically work with is about 6 feet).

Be well,

Doc

[Matt Meiser]

That sounds about right for a 15" planer. The only issue for me was that it was lower than I could reach without bending over. I suppose you could build a box to set the 15" unit on to raise it up. I'm not sure what the mobility requirements in your shop are.

I guess what I was getting at with size is that, assuming your machines are in a fixed location the J/P combo would use less overall space than separate machines because they would share infeed/outfeed paths. You couldn't do that with the separates because of the heights of the two machines would preclude it. The base of the jointer would get in the way of the planer and the top of the planer would get in the way of the jointer. I had mine arranged so that the outfeed of the planer went just past the front of the jointer. That kept the overall work area relatively narrow, but they had to be offset so overall lenght of the work area was very long. If you put the planer behind the jointer, the area is shorter, but very wide.

[Don Abele]

Matt, I have a 2 car garage about 24x24. All my tools are on mobile bases. The jointer, drum sander, molder, planer/oss are all in a "tool coral" in one corner. I bring them out and set them up as I need them. There is plenty of room to set them all in permanent locations, but I like the free space so keep them coraled.

As for raising the planer, I don't think I'd try - it's 581 pounds. Not sure I'd want to elevated it any more than it already is, unless I welded on extensions to the base.

Be well,

Doc

[Bob Antoniewicz]

Well, if you really wanted to stimulate the economy, you'd have to buy American. And since you can't (or at least, I don't know how you can) buy a large planer or J/P combo that's American made, that idea is out.

It seems to me that you have the planer you need, you just need a way to take off a little bit after your planer gets you close. And if you are doing cabinets, maybe the right approach would be a sander.

That said, I couldn't tell you which, if any, sanders are made in the USA.

If a choice has to be made between the J/P and Planer, well, that gets down to room and what you feel comfortable using. I'd prefer separates (though I have a MM Combo).

There was someone in the classifieds selling a MM FS30 J/P. And like Jim Becker said, the Tersa head IS the bee's knees!

Bob A.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi Don, I recently went through the same process, except I was replacing a 15 inch cast iron planer.

I opted for the Hammer A31 which is a 300mm planer/jointer comination.

Jet and Grizzly have models in that size range, as well as Rojek, Felder, and MiniMax.

In my shop (Basement of a townhouse) a combo is much better from a space perspective, as well as giving me a wider jointer than I would ever have purchased in a stand alone jointer.

I know that it's often hard to justify spending large amount of cash on machinery, however I've finally learned that it's better to buy good equipment once, than go through multiple upgrades.

Regards, Rod.

[Matt Meiser]

Yeah, I wouldn't want to raise it either. Especially if its going to be mobile. Mine only moved by tractor power.

Speaking of mobility, does Grizzly offer a mobile base they saw will work with the J/P combo? The really don't say which Shop Fox base you could use like they do with most of the rest of the tools.

[Don Abele]

Bob, it may not be American made, but I'll be purchasing it from an American company so it should help some. I already have a Jet 22/44 drum sander which I use for final tweaking on the size.

Rod, I agree which is why I am asking this question. When I bought the 6" jointer and 13" planer, it was really all I had the room for (small 1 car garage). I was also building stuff that didn't need more umph than that either. With the amount of planing I'm going to be doing, I thought a beefier planer would yield better results in the long run.

I looked at the A31 and the only reason I am opting over it for the Grizzly is cost. Now if someone comes back and says it's absolutely not worth it, then I'll save more until I can afford one of the higher priced combos. I excluded the Jet due to cost and the standard knives. While I have no experience with the Tersa knives, I've heard many positive comments on them. I do use Shelix heads and like them very much (especially how quiet they are). Can you comment on the question I posted earlier about the short table length for the planer - it's smaller than the one on my Ridgid. Any problems?

Matt, I personally don't like the Shop Fox mobile bases and have almost all of my tools on HTC-2000's. For the stuff over 300# I buy the dedicated HTC base that matches the footprint. I've had great results with them without any complaints.

Thanks again for all the comments guys.

Be well,

Doc