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Thread: Woodworking is so frustrating...

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    Angry Woodworking is so frustrating...

    I can't do any of this right.........so it seems. So here I am making some end grain cutting boards, just like the ones on The Wood Whisperer. Mill up my Purple Heart and Maple. Cut them into the appropriate strips. Start gluing up the strips.......but it doesn't seem right (more later). On the way home, stop by the local door/cabinet door shop to have them run the glue ups through their belt sander. Ahhh, looks nice (or so it seems). Come home to start cutting the strips to expose the end grain. First major project since the move, so I get out my framers square, check the miter gauge to the blade (need a new fancy miter gauge), squared up.......nice. Clean up the one end, check with square........crap.......less than 90°. Ok, check the miter gauge again.....seems square. Run it again........crap, less than 90° again. Although I need a new one, I pulled out the crosscut sled, same thing, less than 90°

    << interruption mode on >>
    I had suspected prior to starting today that my saw blade might of been a SMALL tad out of perpendicular to the table. It was, so I adjusted it back to what I assume is 90°. That's why I was wondering why the initial strip glue up was not right.
    << interruption mode off >>

    Ok, back to not being able to get 90° with the miter gauge despite squares saying it was. So I took all 3 framing squares, and started comparing the inside 90's to each other. None matched........CRAP. So off to find my old drafting squares from back in the days. Hey, my small framing square was 90° on the inside with my drafting square. Ok, while we are at it, let's check the blade to the table, see if the runners are parallel to the blade. Now I can't find my jig I made prior to my move.........so I try a tape measure. To my eye, it seems pretty good. Let's try with the calipers, nope, off. So I loosen bolts up and tweak things. Ok, so I thought. I check the fence to make sure it's parallel with the blade.......seems fine by tape and calipers.

    So I start running the boards through creating 1.25" strips. But the wood starts against the fence, but tends to end away from the fence past the blade. Ok, check fence again.........seems parallel to the tools I use to check. I decide......just run them and let the belt sanded make it flush, as long as one side is flush, it will be flat on the other side once the belt sander is done with it.

    Oh, while exposing the end grain through the strip cutting, I bumped a strip and a glue joint failed. REAL GREAT.......I am making quality stuff here. 2 months from now......my intended xmas gifts will fall apart in my family members hands.

    So...
    • Is the blade really 90° to the table?
    • Is the blade really parallel with the runners?
    • Is the miter gauge really 90° to the blade?
    • Is the fence really parallel to the blade?
    SO FLIPPING FRUSTRATING. Glad I spent all that money on a new 8" jointer and 14" bandsaw with riser.
    Last edited by Jim Fox; 12-07-2007 at 8:39 PM. Reason: some many typos, so little time...
    If over thinking was an Olympic event, I'd win Gold every time!

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    You might invest in a TS-Aligner JR. I went through similar problems to you and it is really versatile in checking all of those setups:

    http://www.ts-aligner.com/tsalignerjr.htm
    Mike Marcade
    Senior Mechanical Engineer
    Server Development
    Dell Inc.

  3. #3
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    My first purchase would be a good machinists square. Spend the extra $bucks and get a good one (or 2 or 3) and use it every day. I use mine after I joint, rip, plane etc.
    Gary

  4. #4
    Jim, sorry to hear this is happening to you too. When I first started woodworking I had similar problems. I thought it was the cheap tools I was using so I bought better ones. That didn't solve the problem so I bought even more expensive ones. I think you get the picture. I finally realized that I needed to get some good setup tools and once I did, boy did my results improve. The setup tools were expensive but they are hands down the best dollars I have ever spent.

    Do yourself a favor and get a good dial indicator that rides in the miter slot, an engineering straight edge (big as you can afford) and some machinist squares.

    If you know a machinist ask him to come and help you. If you don't, hiring one to help you get setup is money well spent too.

    Good luck Jim. Keep at it, its worth it once you get the setup right!

  5. #5
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    Sounds like your one of your problems is machine setup. You don't need to spend a small fortune to get good results. Pick up two decent size 90/45 drafting triangles. They are very accurate and cheap. Second, make yourself a alignment checker out of two scraps of wood and a brass screw like this one
    http://www.woodworkingtips.com/etips/etip030411sn.html

    You can set the blade parallel with your miter slot and the fence parallel to the blade for the cost of a brass screw. It's not as fancy as a dial indicator, but it'll get you just as close if you take your time and work at it.

    The 90/45 drafting triangles are useful for setting your blade to both 90deg or 45deg which cover 95% of your cuts. Same goes for you're miter gage. The drafting triangles are also useful to check your jointer beds for parallel. Put them back to back, one on each table. any sag or rise in your tables will show up as a gap between the edges. A small drafting triangle is useful for setting up your band saw blade to 90deg or checking the front to back alignment.

    While fancy gadgets are nice, you can do some very nice and accurate work with a decent setup on your machine and some inexpensive aids.

    Oh, by the way. Toss the framing squares, they're notoriously inaccurate. Even if you get one side of the leg straight, the odds are the other side will be off a mile.

    Mike
    Last edited by M Toupin; 12-07-2007 at 9:44 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by M Toupin View Post
    Oh, by the way. Toss the framing squares, they're notoriously inaccurate. Even if you get one side of the leg straight, the odds are the other side will be off a mile.

    Mike
    Good to know. I'm glad I spent only a few dollars on mine. And here I though I found a good, inexpensive measuring device. Figures.

    Jim, don't forget that woodworking takes practice. I don't think it matters how good your tools are if you don't have some practice under your belt. I'm learning this myself.

    I just finished building three cutting boards and each one was a learning experience. A lot of issues you describe are prevented by just doing it a few times. Pretty soon you're compensating for such issues without even realizing it. For example, after awhile you'll be able to safely feed your stock through the saw while keeping it against the fence. For large boards, I bought Board Buddies to prevent this problem.

  7. #7
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    I have this video I think it is well worth the price and can save you money on setup tools and wasted materials: http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=16790

    Of course there are other places to purchase it but this one just came up first with a Google search.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by M Toupin View Post
    Sounds like your one of your problems is machine setup. You don't need to spend a small fortune to get good results. Pick up two decent size 90/45 drafting triangles. They are very accurate and cheap. ...Mike
    Some of the best bucks I have spent was on two of these. As Mike says, "They are accurate and cheap." That's one thing that I learned by taking a woodworking class at WoodCraft last summer. I'd like to suggest that you take some classes if at all possible. The one I took was fantastic and I ended up with a Shaker table that I built at the end of the class. --- It looks like the closest WoodCraft to you is in Grand Rapids. In January/February they have a class titled Setting Up Shop, Introduction To Woodworking Machines and Power Tool Instruction that sound like classes that might help.
    Last edited by Don Bullock; 12-07-2007 at 10:47 PM.
    Don Bullock
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  9. #9
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    I had a problem with my PM contractor saw. If you tilted the blade to 45 degrees the parallel rods that the arbor wereon would hit the angle iron from my fence and knocked my arbor out of alignment. If you look at my older posts you'll find pics of this problem. It made my blade go out of true by about 3/32nd to 1/8th of an inch. What kind of saw do you have?
    What you listen to is your business....what you hear is ours.

  10. #10
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    Square your square

    Pat, don't pitch your framing square. Square it up.

    Get a piece of buther paper or something and draw a line using the long leg of your square - twice as long as the leg would be good.

    Put the square in the middle of the line with the long leg parallel to line.

    Draw a line perpendicular to that line using the short leg.

    Flip over the square (keeping the long leg parallel to the drawn line) and draw another line perpendicular to it, again using the short leg.

    If the perpendicular lines aren't parallel, your square isn't square.

    If they're tending towards each other at the end farthest from the long line at the bottom, your square is more than 90. Take a nail set and a hammer and peen the outside of the square. Put the nail set near the outside corner and whack it with the hammer. Every couple times you do this, repeat the line drawing part until the perpendicular lines are parallel.

    If the square is less than 90, you peen the inside corner of the square. First time I did it, it took less than 15 minutes.

    Proper machine set up is critical, but accurate measuring tools are too.

    And yes, woodworking can be frustrating at times for all of us.
    Where did I put that tape measure...

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Wyko View Post
    I had a problem with my PM contractor saw. If you tilted the blade to 45 degrees the parallel rods that the arbor wereon would hit the angle iron from my fence and knocked my arbor out of alignment. If you look at my older posts you'll find pics of this problem. It made my blade go out of true by about 3/32nd to 1/8th of an inch. What kind of saw do you have?
    I've got a ShopFox
    If over thinking was an Olympic event, I'd win Gold every time!

  12. #12
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    Watch out if you assume drafting triangles bought at a big box are any good! My daughter had a high school project to carefully measure everything on the high school grounds in a designated 100 meter by 100 meter section, then draw it up accurately. Project was more than a month long. When she got to the drawing stage, she spent a couple days working very carefully, but finally came to me: "Daddy, these lines that should meet aren't. What am I doing wrong?"

    I drew a straight line, struck a perpendicular with her large, nice looking drafting triangle, flipped it over and struck another that should have been coincident but was instead more than a few degrees off. Total crap! I took the blasted thing back to the store and griped lengthily about how nasty it was to sell something like that. I checked others triangles from their stock -- not a single good one. And I'm sure that after they refunded my money, the piece of plastic crud ended up back on display.
    Last edited by Dennis Peacock; 12-08-2007 at 7:24 PM. Reason: Language correction for profanity.

  13. #13

    I agree....

    It is frustrating. I'm new to woodworking and decided cutting boards would be perfect gifts this year. I'm on my fourth one, and while it's getting better, it ain't near as easy as The Wood Whisperer made it sound. I am a sanding pro now because NOTHING, EVER, EVER comes out flat though I could swear I cut each strip to expose the end-grain to 1.25 inches.

    On the positive-side, I'm no longer afraid of my belt sander now.

    Bob

  14. #14
    Jim,

    If any of your cutting machines are not properly adjusted this is the result, trust me we've all been there.

    For starters, get yourself one of these, a TS Alighner Jr.



    With this you tune the entire saw to the machined miter slot, this is the onle way you'll achieve repeatable results.

    The miter square is next. This is the one I have and it's square within 0.003 over 10 inches.



    A set of machinist squares are a must. There are expensive ones that can be bought but I've seen sets of 2 or 3, different sizes, for $29.00 and they work great, no need to give away your first born for these.

    If you take your time the frustration you're experiencing will cease to exist, however no mater how many times you cut the board it's still too short...

  15. #15
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    Boy, the problems we have with woodworking sounds a lot like golf!!! Come to think about it, I haven't played a round of golf since 1976......At least I've stuck with woodworking a little longer! Jim.
    Coolmeadow Setters...Exclusively Irish! When Irish Eyes are smiling....They're usually up to something!!
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