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Thread: ASHRAE filter test?

  1. #1

    ASHRAE filter test?

    Questions for Bill Pentz,
    I think that the below posts make allot of sense and are excellent advice. I visited the Wynn site and looked at the Farr & Torit compatible filters you highly recommend. Maybe I overlooked something but I did not see where these filters were certified. I didn’t see where they reported any testing on these: ASHRAE, BIA ? Where did you purchase the certified filters for your own shop? Where are their ASHRAE tests posted on the Wynn site? Thank you in advance?



    99.995% efficient at 1.0 micron and above
    Washable
    Torit-Style

    2B100SBOL
    Open Open


    No inner Liner

    100% Polyester Spun Bond
    12.75" x 26" (100 sq.ft..)
    126.00

    99.995% efficient at 1.0 micron and above
    Torit-Style
    2A100SBOL
    Open Closed


    Bolt Hole
    No inner Liner

    100% Polyester Spun Bond
    12.75" x 26" (100 sq.ft..)
    134.00


    99.995% efficient at 1.0 micron and above
    Torit-Style
    2C100SBOL
    Open Closed


    No Bolt Hole
    No inner Liner

    100% Polyester Spun Bond
    12.75" x 26" (100 sq.ft..)
    134.00

    Sincerely,
    Robert Witter
    Oneida Air Systems, Inc.




    Below are the quotes from Bill Pentz:

    “ I also recommend you power it with my recommended impeller, blower design, and heavy duty motor. I tried to help by working out discounted prices on the parts from Clear Vue Cyclones, Electric Motor Warehouse, and Wynn Environmental.

    bill


    ”That careful filter testing left me now only trusting filter ratings provided by an American Society of Heating, Refrigeration, and Air-conditioning Engineers (ASHRAE) certified independent testing laboratory. ASHRAE is not a government organization, but instead a private, non-profit group of professional engineers that set the standards for their industry. Unable to find any certified dust collector bags and knowing that most bags have so little surface area that then need constant cleaning which exposes me to the very dust I must avoid, I personally use certified cartridge filters with a cyclone to protect those filters. I recommend all others do the same”.



    bill

    “For commercial dust collection systems that vent inside into facilities that must pass regular government air quality tests, the vendors use filters tested and certified according to ASHRAE standards when new, not after building up this dust cake. A well seasoned filter will filter 20 to 30 times better than a brand new filter. Unfortunately with no oversight on our vendors and the testing being very expensive, most hobbyist filters are advertised with their outdoor fully “seasoned” filtering levels. This means most pass the finest unhealthiest dust most of the time when used indoors. Between moving too little air to capture the fine dust as it is made, hoods that do not control and contain this fine dust, and these open filters, most small shops build up dangerously high levels of fine dust unless they regularly get blown out thoroughly.”

    bill



    Suppliers from Bill Pentz's site

    Clear Vue Cyclones: http://www.ClearVueCyclones.com now makes cyclones, material movement blowers, and provides material handling impellers. Ed Morgano who started this small firm has been a pleasure to work with and does excellent work.
    Wynn Environmental (Dick & Rick): http://www.wynnenv.com/torit_filters.htm has the best pricing and service in providing excellent affordable cartridge filters, 3.5", 4", 5" and 6" clear flex hose in 25' lengths and clamps. They are my recommended source for the Farr and Torit compatible filters in both the washable poly and the less expensive blended cartridge filters. They also offer the Donaldson Torit 0.2 micron fine filters that I need to use to take better care of my poor lungs.
    Last edited by Robert Witter; 10-16-2006 at 9:09 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Witter
    Questions for Bill Pentz,
    I think that the below posts make allot of sense and are excellent advice. I visited the Wynn site and looked at the Farr & Torit compatible filters you highly recommend. Maybe I overlooked something but I did not see where these filters were certified. I didn’t see where they reported any testing on these: ASHRAE, BIA ? Where did you purchase the certified filters for your own shop? Where are their ASHRAE tests posted on the Unquote.)
    hi Robert, I just visited the Donaldson Torit website and went through their filter brochure. I didn't find any mention of ASHRAE testing there. Maybe like Wynn they don't think this particular testing agency is necessary to mention. In a footnote I did find a mention that a BIA C certificate was available. So if Wynn is selling the genuine Torit filters then the note in the Torit brochure would infer certification.
    Isn't the classification based on the filter media being used. I'm not sure.
    take care,
    John
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:23 PM.

  3. The content of this post was deleted since the reply only referred to the way the thread was written and was not on topic.

    Ken Salisbury
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:31 PM.

  4. #4
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    Content of this post was deleted since it was off topic to the thread.
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:34 PM.
    Yoga class makes me feel like a total stud, mostly because I'm about as flexible as a 2x4.
    "Design"? Possibly. "Intelligent"? Sure doesn't look like it from this angle.
    We used to be hunter gatherers. Now we're shopper borrowers.
    The three most important words in the English language: "Front Towards Enemy".
    The world makes a lot more sense when you remember that Butthead was the smart one.
    You can never be too rich, too thin, or have too much ammo.

  5. #5
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    Putnam County, NY
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    3,086
    This is from the Camfill/Farr website


    "Here is a selection of standardisation bodies that we have either set up or been closely involved in: Eurovent 4/5, Eurovent 4/9, Eurovent 4/10 Eurovent Recommendation 1/ LCC 2/ Air Filters and IAQ

    CEN EN 779:1993, Proposed revised CEN EN 779:2001, CEN EN 1822, SEM Analysis.
    CEN (Comité Européen de Normalisation) is working to establish common standards throughout Europe.

    EUROVENT is leading the development of new and modern test methods that can meet today's requirements in terms of ventilation, air filter installations in indoor environments and other areas.

    In the United States, ASHRAE is developing new test methods for use with filters.
    Camfil Farr has been involved in developing the ASHRAE 52.2. test method."

    http://www.camfilfarr.com/script/standardisation.asp
    I could cry for the time I've wasted, but thats a waste of time and tears.

  6. #6
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    Dec 2003
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    Putnam County, NY
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    3,086
    Does Camfil Farr make these Torit filters or are they a knock off.
    Not sure since they say "Torit-Style"
    I could cry for the time I've wasted, but thats a waste of time and tears.

  7. #7
    Content was deleted due to being off topic

    Ken Salisbury
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:36 PM.

  8. #8
    A portion of this post was redacted since content was off topic to the discussion.
    Ken Salisbury

    I look forward to learning how, when, when and why all these claims are made and sorting them out to become more educated and have prudent safety in my shop. It will be nice to have a two sided conversation to do so. Hopefully no one thinks they have been threatened and the lawyers need to get involved. So far I see facts being questioned in a civil manner.

    edit>bad spallin
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:38 PM.

  9. Off topic content was deleted - let the moderators moderate, please
    Ken Salisbury
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:40 PM.

  10. #10
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    Off topic content deleted
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:41 PM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Shuk
    This is from the Camfill/Farr website


    "Here is a selection of standardisation bodies that we have either set up or been closely involved in: Eurovent 4/5, Eurovent 4/9, Eurovent 4/10 Eurovent Recommendation 1/ LCC 2/ Air Filters and IAQ

    CEN EN 779:1993, Proposed revised CEN EN 779:2001, CEN EN 1822, SEM Analysis.
    CEN (Comité Européen de Normalisation) is working to establish common standards throughout Europe.

    EUROVENT is leading the development of new and modern test methods that can meet today's requirements in terms of ventilation, air filter installations in indoor environments and other areas.
    Hi John, EUROVENT is an organization composed of the manufacturers of air conditioning and refrigeration equipment. Since Farr make filters for so many applications, they might have included EUROVENT as related to the filters they make in this area.
    BIA or Berufsgenossenschaftliches Institut für Arbeitsschutz (I didn't make that up) is the agency that handles wood dust emissions for the workplace. It looks like they handle the testing of a complete Dust Collector as a unit and not just the filtration media. To get the BIA sticker the machine must have tested no more than .2mg/cubic meter of air if 50% of the air will be exhausted outside and .1mg/per cm if the air is 100% recycled. I didn't see any mention of particle size but from what I understand the particle size will be from .1m on up. I think they blow quartz dust for an hour for the tests. I think BIA also does fitler media certification. I know two classes G and C. I'll have to look up what each means.
    take care,
    John
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:26 PM. Reason: corrected quote coding

  12. #12
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    Content had nothing to do with thread subject so it was deleted.
    Ken Salisbury
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:44 PM.
    Yoga class makes me feel like a total stud, mostly because I'm about as flexible as a 2x4.
    "Design"? Possibly. "Intelligent"? Sure doesn't look like it from this angle.
    We used to be hunter gatherers. Now we're shopper borrowers.
    The three most important words in the English language: "Front Towards Enemy".
    The world makes a lot more sense when you remember that Butthead was the smart one.
    You can never be too rich, too thin, or have too much ammo.

  13. What is truth?, asked the Velveteen Rabbit

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Dauphinee
    Are we trying to get to the truth of the matter?
    Independent testing by a certified lab is about the only way to arrive at what would approximate the truth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Dauphinee
    Who really cares who asked the question. I for one think it is about time we begin actual intellectual discussion over the myths and facts about DC.
    This is the "best" we can hope for. And for myself, tis good enough. Not sure I am smart enough to understand what all could be discussed in this thread. But I am willing to have a go.

    Take care, Mike

    Content that was off topic to the thead subject was redacted.
    Ken Salisbury
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:46 PM.

  14. #14
    Off topic content deleted
    Ken Salisbury
    Last edited by Ken Salisbury; 10-08-2006 at 4:47 PM.

  15. #15
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    Like Lee, I'm also a bit confused as to which portions are B.Pentz quoted statements and which are responses by R.Witter. I'm all for seeing this stuff brought up here on SMC, but just found the post somewhat confusing.
    Use the fence Luke

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