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Thread: Odd molding profile

  1. #1
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    Odd molding profile

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    How would you go about reproducing the light colored molding in this photo? These are exterior architectural moldings for window ornamentation on a 1890's Victorian house.


    20240516_202144.jpg

    I can probably get close enough using a 5/8 bullnose cutter on my shaper, then rip a 45 deg angle on the table saw, then rip 90 deg to that cut, but I am curious how this might have originally been done.

    What is puzzling me is that the round part is partially undercut. I don't know how you would do that without a dedicated machine with multiple cutters. Any ideas?
    Last edited by Chris David; 05-16-2024 at 8:48 PM. Reason: photo was not displaying

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris David View Post
    Forum members:

    How would you go about reproducing the light colored molding in this photo? These are exterior architectural moldings for window ornamentation on a 1890's Victorian house.


    20240516_202144.jpg

    I can probably get close enough using a 5/8 bullnose cutter on my shaper, then rip a 45 deg angle on the table saw, then rip 90 deg to that cut, but I am curious how this might have originally been done.

    What is puzzling me is that the round part is partially undercut. I don't know how you would do that without a dedicated machine with multiple cutters. Any ideas?
    Originally it would have been done with hand planes

  3. #3
    Three passes with a beading bit in a router table should do it.

  4. #4
    I posted a long reply last night and it got wiped out when hitting the "reply" button.

    Basically, you can do that with one bullnose cutter, but you need a follow shoe to support the (developing) round as it exits the cutting circle.
    Flip the stick end for end, rotate 90 deg (or 270) and run again. if you eyeball the grain for the first pass, it should still be correct for the second.
    I personally would not run it without power feeder.
    To obviate grain issues, i often run stuff like that climb cutting (Of course only with a well set up power feeder and guide shoes), but if you are not familiar and well practiced, don't do it on this as a first project.


    A slightly safer method if you just have to run it manually, would be a quarter round cutter, and then finish the top with hand plane(s).
    Even a block plane and sandpaper could round what is left if you do not have a suitable round (plane) or, say, Stanley #45, e.g. .

    That probably was not made on a shaper originally for production. Maybe a sticker.
    If you grind the knife so the part lays flat on a corner (in a trough, knife overhead) it is an easy cut but needs a matching trough to do the second side/corner when flipped end for end.

    smt

    Edited/PS: Actually, it occurred to me that if someone ordered a "bunch: of that, i might well grind the knife to run in a shaper, corner in a trough, & power feed pressing straight down into the trough. Probably with an outside fence. That would be fast, foolproof, and no set up or trough changes between the two passes. Plus the trough is a simple "VEE" instead of a precisely fit cove shape. Also easier to read the grain. Depending how the feeder is set up and the amount of swing in the wheels, it could be efficient/prudent to first knock the top off on a tablesaw. So the wheel grabs a flat, instead of the point of the corner for the first pass. With the saw op, that would be when you would be paying attention and reading the grain for orientation when it is fed in the shaper trough. That way you won't find some are against the grain. And in fact, thinking done at the saw, you won't have to think at the shaper.
    Last edited by stephen thomas; 05-17-2024 at 9:00 AM.

  5. #5
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    You apply the bead to the edge of a wider board, using whatever method you deem appropriate and available and then trim off the excess material.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

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  7. #7
    https://toolstoday.com/v-4900-54170.html 2 passes on the router table, then rip off the edge.

  8. #8
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    It's also an off the shelf profile.
    Screenshot_20240517_111850_Samsung Notes.jpg

    Originally (victorian era) it would have been run an a multi head moulder.

  9. #9
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    I had to make 16 lineal feet of this a while back. The bead was attached on this one. I used a 1/2” round over tilted and a corrugated 1/2” radius that worked for the undercut. Actually probably could have done it all with the 1/2” round over with an extra pass. Jim has good advice to cut it out of a wider board.
    tilting the shaper works for small quantities with a little extra labor for setup. Larger quantities more cost effective to have cutters ground.
    Original was most likely done on a molder in the late 1800s. Most of the Victorian era Millwork was machine made.
    IMG_0644.jpg
    IMG_0333.jpg
    IMG_0335.jpg
    IMG_0336.jpg

  10. #10
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    Here is a drawing of a router bit that makes pencil beads in one set up, two passes.
    It matches an old molding.

    Pencil Bead Router Bit.pdf

    The fillets are off set and skinny, and the arc is 168 degrees. Also a 7/32" radius. That's why it looks so different from stock cutters with big fillets, 180 degree arcs, and too big or too small radiuses.
    Last edited by William Hodge; 05-17-2024 at 12:53 PM.

  11. #11
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    I want to thank you all for your replies. I sincerely appreciate everyone's willingness to help me out. It is interesting that there are so many ways to tackle this. My first thought was that I would need a tilting head shaper, which I don't have. I do have a shaper, and a power feed, so Jarod's suggestion might work for me. Thank you Jarod for introducing me the idea of an outboard fence!

    I also have a Shopfox clone of the Williams Hussey molder, so Steven Thomas' suggestion of using a flat cutter with a guide bed for the second cut is probably the way I will go with this. I have to make about 100 feet of this stuff, so want the process to be as idiot proof as possible, because, well, I am an idiot.

  12. #12
    I think itís under-cut to make water drip off instead of running down the face of the building. Remember they were heating with coal.

  13. #13
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    I found this one on Woodcraft. https://www.woodcraft.com/products/w...roduct-details. I think it should work. I have made those beads before. Straight stock and good stock control is essential especially on the second pass.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Fulks View Post
    I think it’s under-cut to make water drip off instead of running down the face of the building. Remember they were heating with coal.
    I'm 99% sure it's not undercut based on the picture
    Screenshot_20240517_114851_Photo Editor.jpg

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