Starrett has been sold.

[John C Cox]

A running, profitable business is worth a lot of money. Nowadays, can't even give away a dilapidated building full rusting machinery. With modern remediation laws, you can't just walk away. Close a factory and you're in for 20 years and and possibly billions of dollars of remediation. Never mind that the economy is begging for USA made stuff for sale.

The thing is - investors and regulators learned the game of the fellows buying out companies, loading them with debt, then closing them down in bankruptcy. The truth was that those businesses enriched the shysters at the expense of everybody else, investors included.

The company I work for got sold to private equity several years ago, and it was the best thing that had happened in 10 years. They poured investment in, sorted out management, and stopped the foolishness our previous parent company engaged in.

[Tom Bain]

Couldn't miss the name, is this your side gig?
https://www.baincapital.com/

No, I don’t work for Bain … although I wish I had access to their capital!

[James Jayko]

Like lots of other people on here I'm sure, I ponied up the $130/each for a 12" and 6" combo and a 4" double square from Starrett when I started trying to make things. They're excellent, for sure. But I look back and laugh that I didn't just buy the iGauging things and spend $200 somewhere else which might be more productive for woodworking. There is SQUARE, and then there is SQUARE ENOUGH FOR GOVERMENT WORK. I don't think I really need the former...

[Patty Hann]

Like lots of other people on here I'm sure, I ponied up the $130/each for a 12" and 6" combo and a 4" double square from Starrett when I started trying to make things. They're excellent, for sure. But I look back and laugh that I didn't just buy the iGauging things and spend $200 somewhere else which might be more productive for woodworking. There is SQUARE, and then there is SQUARE ENOUGH FOR GOVERMENT WORK. I don't think I really need the former...

What is "square enough?" 1 degree off? 1/2 degree? 1/10 degree?
Seriously... what, for you, is "square enough"?
If a square is off by say, 1/10 of a degree, then over 80 inches (height of a standard door) the error at the other end is between 1/8 and 5/32" off.
(tan 0.1 = x/80).
That is pretty noticeable.

[Ray Selinger]

I think square enough depends on whether it's for metal working or woodworking. A couple of days back I checked a cut with my 1971 Stanley 12" combination square, though I have couple of machinist quality combination squares and a couple of engineer squares. I didn't bother getting either one.

[Brian Holcombe]

What is "square enough?" 1 degree off? 1/2 degree? 1/10 degree?
Seriously... what, for you, is "square enough"?
If a square is off by say, 1/10 of a degree, then over 80 inches (height of a standard door) the error at the other end is between 1/8 and 5/32" off.
(tan 0.1 = x/80).
That is pretty noticeable.

I agree completely.

0.0005" over 6" is generally square enough in my shop for the try squares. If I use this as a general parameter for how square a tenon shoulder should be, the results create doors that will square up to better than 1/32" over most size door frames that I build (7-9' x 30-50" wide).

For the Table saw I stick to a similar level of squareness, using the larger square which is .001" over 15" or so. It produces accurate cuts that when translated to a panel I usually cannot notice a deviation from corner to corner.

Accuracy and precision open the door to efficiency, efficiency allows for expedient quality. Expedient quality produces return on investment.

People often think backwards about this, in my opinion. They often think that precision and accuracy make the job take longer, which can be true. What shortens the time is setup, if you equipment is accurate and repeatable, then their precision will make it so that you do not have to second guess and that will speed things up tremendously.

This all starts with precision checking tools, which I think are worth every dollar paid.

[Bob Jones 5443]

I just prefer to have an excellent tool, if I can afford it. My only Starretts are a 24” straightedge and a 12” combo square with 45° fixture. I sat in wait for a sale price on the former, and I bought the square used at a great price from a fine fellow here in the Creek.

[William Hodge]

Most of my Starrett tools came from the town dump. We used to have a metal pile at the dump. People would throw metal in a pile, and a scrapper would take it to the scrap yard.

One day I found what must have been a clean out from a Starrett employee's house. There were 12" and 18" square blades in satin chrome finish, dozens of radius gauges, squares, several dozen 3", 6" 12" 18" and 24 " rulers, thickness gauges, center finders, dividers, trammel points, tool holders, set up blocks, and stuff I don't know the name of. Most of the stuff had the distinctive red grease paint mark that means it was seconds. I gave a lot of the multiples away. Who needs twenty of the same 15/64" Starrett radius gauges? I made racks to hold the stuff I use, so it doesn't get damaged. The rest is in boxes on a shelf for the next guy.

[Michael Burnside]

What is "square enough?" 1 degree off? 1/2 degree? 1/10 degree?
Seriously... what, for you, is "square enough"?
If a square is off by say, 1/10 of a degree, then over 80 inches (height of a standard door) the error at the other end is between 1/8 and 5/32" off.
(tan 0.1 = x/80).
That is pretty noticeable.

I wouldn’t use a square to hang a door. But you’re not wrong that accumulated error is bad, but I think the poster was implying that chasing absolute precision in woodworking is a product of diminishing returns.

I have several squares I payed good money for that look square and I have built thousands of dollars worth of furniture using them. I built a crosscut sled with my 18” square, no 5-cut method employed. I have no idea what the error is, I couldn’t care less. I use the same tools in the same way on every build and my stuff always comes out looking square.

And THAT is square enough.

[Patty Hann]

I wouldn’t use a square to hang a door. But you’re not wrong that accumulated error is bad, but I think the poster was implying that chasing absolute precision in woodworking is a product of diminishing returns.

I have several squares I payed good money for that look square and I have built thousands of dollars worth of furniture using them. I built a crosscut sled with my 18” square, no 5-cut method employed. I have no idea what the error is, I couldn’t care less. I use the same tools in the same way on every build and my stuff always comes out looking square.

And THAT is square enough.

Fair enough (that rhymes, you see, with what you said ).
And I used the door example to illustrate the accumulative error... but I think it would still be significant enough if one were making, say, a bank of kitchen cabinets.

One thing I find kind of headscratching is that the same folks who are Ok with a not quite square square will use a razor sharp marking knife to make a cut line.
Now, as long as you know the error/tolerance of your square, or any tool, and as long as you maintain consistency in accounting for that error, you will be fine (and that "sign" + or - is also important )

[Michael Burnside]

Fair enough (that rhymes, you see, with what you said ).
And I used the door example to illustrate the accumulative error... but I think it would still be significant enough if one were making, say, a bank of kitchen cabinets.

One thing I find kind of headscratching is that the same folks who are Ok with a not quite square square will use a razor sharp marking knife to make a cut line.
Now, as long as you know the error/tolerance of your square, or any tool, and as long as you maintain consistency in accounting for that error, you will be fine (and that "sign" + or - is also important )

Yea, head scratcher for sure. Good old number 5 lead is ok for me. I try to measure as little as possible and cut/plan/layout to maximize moving my fence or making the same cut without changing. When I do measure it’s the aforementioned tools I rely on!