Shopping for a new beast of a planer

[Tom Yaegle]

I had boards planned by 3 different planers when I was fighting over my planer head. One was a Laguna, it was the worst for scallops. It was not a new model so maybe not a problem any more? Just something else to think on.

[Patrick Kane]

Thanks for the reply, Patrick. I'm currently using a Woodmaster 15" with spiral head. And, I have two 15" Grizzly widebelts. I'm getting a 30" dual drumsander, tomorrow.

Really appreciate the Marketplace searches.
I rule out the SCMI S52, because I really want a fully electronic read out, along with digital bed movement.
I rule out the S630, because too many features weren't working (I spoke w/seller).
I rule out the EMA planer, because it's non-digital.

Indeed, I do plan on doing my final finishing on my new drumsander, but being able to plane down close to final dimensions, helps with production time. I supply the crafters marketplace with wood premilled to exact specs, both thick and thin...however being able to mill the thin stock, is the most challenging. Most of my 1/8" pieces are under 15".

I too think I may need to wait for a newer S630, or a Felder, or a Minimax, or who knows. I'm not well versed on machines at this level of quality, so this thread is helping me a lot.

Personally, i would wait out a newer SCM too. Those green/cream models are from the 90s--which isnt as recent as i wish it was. Ultimately, you are talking $4-5,000 between a decades newer machine, and i think the premium is worth it. Everyone;s situation is different. I would feel differently about the EMA if it were cheaper. Unitronix/Fortis/Gomad/DSMC all look identical, and they are very stout 24" planers that TYPICALLY sell for fairly cheap, because of the generic names. Ive seen these well under $3,000 every now and then, and combined with Phillip's setup, could be a formidable workhorse.

Are these super figured pieces? How much lumber are you processing? Are you hand jointing all this lumber? If you are ripping through 10,000 board feet of rough cut a year, then you might want to think about a small S4S and not a tricked out planer.

[Warren Lake]

thanks Phillip. The digital is a thing I dont really need but would consider it. If planing its usually one setting and dialing in is maybe one minute slower or half of that. If you want to match a board thickness to another then just run the board in stop the feed wind the table down till you hear the knives and it will be the same. Likely id enjoy, thanks for the brand and price. The Wadkin is a BAJ which was their mid level 24" planer. Forgotten the details as I put time into it when I got it, found issues and been too busy since. The knives you got from Schimdt are they 18 percent tungsten? I have another jointer that is wired and I had cut knives for it from Dimar only to measure and find one of four is thinner. I checked that after reading Mel that you want all your knives from the same bar stock. Likely mentioned it for Shaper but its a good thought and will go to Dimar when i have time.

[dirk martin]

Are these super figured pieces? How much lumber are you processing? Are you hand jointing all this lumber? If you are ripping through 10,000 board feet of rough cut a year, then you might want to think about a small S4S and not a tricked out planer.

i do work with a lot of curly and quilted stock. 10K BF/year...at least.

Small S4S? Do they make those? Every one I've seen, are monsters.

[Patrick Kane]

i do work with a lot of curly and quilted stock. 10K BF/year...at least.

Small S4S? Do they make those? Every one I've seen, are monsters.

Sure, the 5 and 6 head moulders are more common, but there are smaller 4 head machines. Wadkin, Weinig, and SCMI are a few manufacturers of the smaller machines. I havent seen one in person in maybe 7 years, but i remember it was about the same footprint as my 20" jointer, just chest height with the cutterhead enclosure/controls etc. The length and width werent overwhelming.

SCMI SINTEX MOULDER 4 SIDED S4S PLANER (youtube.com)
Michael Weinig Q23P 4 HeadFeed Through Moulder (youtube.com)

I found two short youtube videos of the smaller machines to give you an idea of size. Have you spent anytime on WoodWeb? I would go poke around and try to find smaller shops that made the switch. Ask to talk to them for 5-10 mins, and you will have a better understanding of where to spend your $16,000. I remember years ago when i made countertops that i was constantly searching for efficiencies in the milling process. After speaking with a few pros, they recommended making the switch to a moulder when you surpass the 6-7,000 bdft a year mark. I was right around that point. As you know, that is a ton of man hours spent at the jointer and planer. Depending on the starting material, that is also a decent amount of wear and tear on your body. I remember i would be pretty sore after a full day of manually dressing a stack of 8/4.

Im really complicating your situation, because a small moulder will absolutely require a phase converter. Also, what is your main service? I think i heard in the video that SCMI had TWO motors of 7.5hp and 9hp. That is going to pull some amps. Finally, i recall guys recommending to take a hard look at DC, because these machines put out chips.

We can debate planers--and i love talking machines--but i would take 3 steps back and think about workflow and where your bottlenecks are. I think one thing is for certain, you need to find a means of powering 3 phase equipment for your future.

[Curt Harms]

Wow...this could be my solution, Robert....
I wonder if I can swap the outfeed rollers, for something rubber....
I'm not familiar with Baileigh brand. Anyone else know of them?

I don't know where you are in Wisconsin but Baileigh's web site shows an address of 1625 Dufek Dr. Manitowoc WI. 54220 920-684-4980. They used to have a showroom in that area, don't know if they still do or not. It would be worth a call I'd think.

[Jared Sankovich]

Sure, the 5 and 6 head moulders are more common, but there are smaller 4 head machines. Wadkin, Weinig, and SCMI are a few manufacturers of the smaller machines. I havent seen one in person in maybe 7 years, but i remember it was about the same footprint as my 20" jointer, just chest height with the cutterhead enclosure/controls etc. The length and width werent overwhelming.

SCMI SINTEX MOULDER 4 SIDED S4S PLANER (youtube.com)
Michael Weinig Q23P 4 HeadFeed Through Moulder (youtube.com)

I found two short youtube videos of the smaller machines to give you an idea of size. Have you spent anytime on WoodWeb? I would go poke around and try to find smaller shops that made the switch. Ask to talk to them for 5-10 mins, and you will have a better understanding of where to spend your $16,000. I remember years ago when i made countertops that i was constantly searching for efficiencies in the milling process. After speaking with a few pros, they recommended making the switch to a moulder when you surpass the 6-7,000 bdft a year mark. I was right around that point. As you know, that is a ton of man hours spent at the jointer and planer. Depending on the starting material, that is also a decent amount of wear and tear on your body. I remember i would be pretty sore after a full day of manually dressing a stack of 8/4.

Im really complicating your situation, because a small moulder will absolutely require a phase converter. Also, what is your main service? I think i heard in the video that SCMI had TWO motors of 7.5hp and 9hp. That is going to pull some amps. Finally, i recall guys recommending to take a hard look at DC, because these machines put out chips.

We can debate planers--and i love talking machines--but i would take 3 steps back and think about workflow and where your bottlenecks are. I think one thing is for certain, you need to find a means of powering 3 phase equipment for your future.

Width capacity is usually the big limiting factor on s4s machines. Imho a 4x7" 4 head doesn't replace a 20 or 24" planer.

[Patrick Kane]

Width capacity is usually the big limiting factor on s4s machines. Imho a 4x7" 4 head doesn't replace a 20 or 24" planer.

Definitely, i dont disagree with you for a typical FURNITURE shop's needs. However, the OP sounds like he is processing lumber to set dimensions and not really building a project. For example, he doesnt make it seem like he is gluing panels etc. or coming anywhere near the capacity or capability that a 24" single sided planer offers. Now, there are 1,000 different reasons to buy a 24" planer without needing 24" of width capacity, but im offering the potential consideration of the OP keeping his existing planer/jointer for material greater than 7-9" in width, and look at the S4S moulder for 80%+ of his material handling.

My only point is that he atleast consider the bigger picture. This conversation started with, "i have $16,000, what planer do i get?", and i think it should start with, "i have $16,000, how do i make my business life easier/better?". Im very interested to see what direction he goes, because it gets out of my range a bit, but it's a road i thought about going down a few years ago. I never discovered too many resources on effectively outfitting a 1-2 man shop. From what he describes, he is operating with pretty 'bare bones' equipment and making a decent profit. It is the equivalent of the one man cabinet shops that are getting by with a PM66, 8" jointer, lunchbox planer, dewalt miter saw and 3hp small format shaper. Ive walked shops identical to that description that do great work and make money. I feel a little guilty, because my dumb basement hobbyist shop is significantly better equipped and i know what $10,000-15,000+/- would do for those guys' capabilities. I am not exaggerating when i say it would be life changing. It's not that they dont have the money, i just dont think they know another way.

[Nick Crivello]

A bump with quick question: Would I be correct in thinking that an American Rotary AR20 with 28amp max starting current and 56 amp running current wouldn't handle an SCMI s630 with 12hp/33amp tag?

[Phillip Mitchell]

Probably not going to cut it in my opinion and experience in the past of starting larger motor/cutterhead diameter planer on an RPC rated to start 10 HP.

[Warren Lake]

call the manufacturer and ask them. Depends on the brand. My !0hp starts 10 hp even if hard start and its only the middle model. Ive started more then 3Hp on an other primitive Roto same brand no gizmos in it just simple and still worked fine.

[Nick Crivello]

Probably not going to cut it in my opinion and experience in the past of starting larger motor/cutterhead diameter planer on an RPC rated to start 10 HP.

Darn, and my electrical service won’t support a larger rpc. Probably a good thing… 😆

[Nick Crivello]

call the manufacturer and ask them. Depends on the brand. My !0hp starts 10 hp even if hard start and its only the middle model. Ive started more then 3Hp on an other primitive Roto same brand no gizmos in it just simple and still worked fine.

The machine I have supports a 10hp saw and 5hp dust collector without issue. The saw has 24amps on the plate.