Blue Max Bandsaw Tires for MM16

[Dave Sabo]

I forgot to mention that some Meber's came with grooved wheels, like this
The P400 was a Laguna LT16 frame by the looks of things, should it also have grooved wheels, and should they be the same offset groove

Tom

Laguna hasn’t sourced a saw from Meber in 30-40 years !

[Jim Becker]

Jim, in regards to aftermarket tires, I’m not sure that the groove matters. I mean,it could if someone planned to run a really skinny blade and track it over the spot where the groove was but for wider blades, I can’t imagine it would matter that much. My feeling was always that the factory indexed the groove more as a guide for the assembly line, as to which way to face the wheel during production. If you think about it, tongue-and-groove tires are probably cheaper, from a manufacturing standpoint, than having to glue or vulcanize a tire onto a wheel. I mean, the modern Centauro tires feel more like plastic than rubber (though they should be made from gold-inlaid graphene, for what Parts Pronto asks for them). Anyway, I always assumed they went the went they went for cost reasons rather than any design advantage. All this being said, Rod’s comments are exciting since it seems like Blue Max might actually be offering a legit Metric option for MM owners.

Erik

I agree with you, Erik. I do not believe the alignment grooves matter for aftermarket tires. I was only pointing out that they exist, per the sticker on the door. Size is absolutely important, whether held by friction or adhesive.

[Lee Schierer]

As you can see there have been several posts deleted. If the trend continues, the thread my be locked and or vanish. Let's keep it civil and stick with the facts. Sometimes when we see things differently than others, we can all agree to disagree

[Tom Trees]

As you can see there have been several posts deleted. If the trend continues, the thread my be locked and or vanish. Let's keep it civil and stick with the facts. Sometimes when we see things differently than others, we can all agree to disagree

Hard to stick to the facts, or indeed try to moderate it, when the facts themselves aren't very civil to discuss!
I take it, lots see my posts as possibly bashing the design of whichever flavour or colour schemed saw available today,
when infact things are very much the opposite, and it's testament to the quality of the parts.

[Jim Becker]

Still trying to figure out what you mean here... "the tires are not crowned" as if it's a totally flat profile on the rubber
then it'll be concave when installed.

This is what I mean, Tom...the surface of the tires are flat and perpendicular to the sides of the wheels. The bands are run with the teeth slightly off the front edge of the wheels which is common for uncrowned tire bandsaws. This photo was taken today while I was cleaning up my MM16 and installing a new band on it as well as replacing the 20 year old foam tape on the inside of the doors.

FlatTires.jpg

[Tom Trees]

Not sure what you're showing Jim, and can only guess it's something like this, from my first attempts at dressing them.
One can see things are clearly needing a lick again.
Whilst one can see the apex in these photos, so a good example of testing things through various stages, from a mile off, to as flat as what the square & straight edge would
read, bearing in mind the wheels had a 0.5mm discrepancy of the face, as likely with most machines.
Checking for uniform tire height.JPG
SAM_4145.jpg

As it happens that/any apex was pretty difficult to eliminate, it's almost like the machine was fighting me!

In the end I had to cut a rebate into the scraper mounting block to stop specifically that from happening.
tire dressing jig .jpg
I could screenshot or timestamp my videos and whatnot, to demonstrate flat as good as your eye will see,
but the proof is in in the pudding, and such crown either perceivable or otherwise exists, regardless of what one can see,
as having no crown is a recipe for blade set compression, and I'm including blades of a suitable width, strictly to be run with the teeth off the wheel, at that
Hence my comment about anticlastic curvature providing a crown on the edge of the wheel........
if it is indeed true, that all these urethane tires might have a flat profile (uninstalled, that is)
I'd guess it might just turn out somewhat a bit more similar to the CO saws than some might reckon, (except for the offset crown apex obviously)
Screenshot-2023-12-21 SCM Mini Max S600P Bandsaw 3 Phrase eBay.jpg
Obviously, I'm way off the mark here, and whatnot, but just clearing up matters on that deceptive profile on Centauro's tires.
SAM_7986.jpgSAM_7988.jpg

Happy new year

Tom

[Erik Loza]

Jim, this thread has me thinking about “outside-the-box” options for tires. Assuming were talking about a wide blade, I’m not even totally sure that a tire is necessary. That sounds whacky but I’ve seen plenty of ancient shop machines with practically non-existent tires that ran fine. Also, one of the handful of bandsaws I sold during my time with Felder was an FB710. That particular machine basically doesn’t have tires. It seemed to be just this ribbon of canvas fabric-type material glued to the wheel. Zero cushioning. I’d never seen anything like it before but the FB710 is a really nice saw and it behaved fine.

So, is it possible that (assuming the owner is not planning to fit a small blade) that you don’t need a conventional tire? It’s a crazy notion but if I had an MM16, I’m curious enough that I’d remove the tires and give it a shot. No answers, just thoughts.

Erik

[Rod Sheridan]

Erik, metal cutting band saws have uncrowned metal wheels without tires.

Regards, Rod

[Erik Loza]

Erik, metal cutting band saws have uncrowned metal wheels without tires.

Regards, Rod

Rod, thanks. Of all the bandsaws I’ve sold/worked on/etc., cannot remember a single issue that could be attributed to tires or tire condition. But again, none of these were abused, ex-shop machines.

Erik

[Jim Becker]

Jim, this thread has me thinking about “outside-the-box” options for tires. Assuming were talking about a wide blade, I’m not even totally sure that a tire is necessary. That sounds whacky but I’ve seen plenty of ancient shop machines with practically non-existent tires that ran fine. Also, one of the handful of bandsaws I sold during my time with Felder was an FB710. That particular machine basically doesn’t have tires. It seemed to be just this ribbon of canvas fabric-type material glued to the wheel. Zero cushioning. I’d never seen anything like it before but the FB710 is a really nice saw and it behaved fine.

So, is it possible that (assuming the owner is not planning to fit a small blade) that you don’t need a conventional tire? It’s a crazy notion but if I had an MM16, I’m curious enough that I’d remove the tires and give it a shot. No answers, just thoughts.

Erik

The wheels on my MM16 seem to have "edges" as far as I can tell (but I could certainly be wrong about that) so unlike those "auld arn" machines with smooth metal wheels (I think some metal cutting bandsaws don't have tires, too) I do not believe one could run a band on the wheel without a tire installed. But that's certainly speculation since I have not needed to change out those "beautiful" 2003 tires at this point. They are certainly cleaner now after today's maintenance...since I can't really do projects due to the cast on my right wrist, I'm "puttering" in the shop doing various sharpening things and machine maintenance that is unfortunately way over due on some things.

[Jim Becker]

Not sure what you're showing Jim

Succinctly, I'm showing that the tires on my MM16 are flat. They are not crowned and never have been.

[Tom Trees]

I've got no reason to believe anyone without seeing the tire profile when off the wheel, so unless that's what you've shown,
then I will continue to mention the offset crown on Centauro wheels is apparent, as with the rest of the Minimax/Centauro saws,
as per the SP manual, which take the same tires as the CO machines.
i.e on the 500mm wheeled size for the CO or SP saws.
Screenshot-2024-1-4 Tyre for SP500 Centauro Bandsaw.jpg

All the best
Tom

[Jim Becker]

Well...on the wheel is what counts in the end and as I clearly show in that nice fresh photo, the tire is flat. I'm out of this discussion.

[Erik Loza]

To Jim's point, even if there was some minor crown on the tire, Centauro wheels are machined flat and when you put a 1" blade on there with 20,000psi+ of tension, that tire is going to get flat. I'm likewise about through with these types of "debates". Peace to all and so long as your personal machine runs the way you want, nobody else's opinion matters.

Erik

[andrew whicker]

I got some orange tires from Sulphur grove.. called to ensure 600 mm would work. Supposedly don't need glue
.. bs. They need glue. The next advice is to use a gasket adhesive in a few spots.

In the spots without the adhesive I can easily move the tire back and forth. My bottom tire came off when I ran the machine. So I re did the bottom tire (removed, cleaned etc) and am currently waiting on the adhesive to dry (again) to try my failure of a centauro again. Maybe buy different tires.

So anyway. Not happy with this brand so far...