Hard maple purchase

[George Yetka]

I ordered 200 bf of hard maple as follows
-13/16 Prime HARD MAPLE KD S2S SLR1E RW RL

My problem was I assumed this would be perfect or near perfect finish, maybe needing sanding only. It came in with chatter on both sides across the entire lot. This is my first time buying non rough cut lumber. Do I return this or is this acceptable? The wood is other wise straight and square. My thought was a pass in the drum sander should smooth this right out as its not very deep.

[Jonathan Jung]

S2S means it was sent through a 2-sided planer. There can be some light marks / lines / tearout.. It's not a finished surface, so although sometimes it can look really good, I always have to plan on sanding.

If you want nearly finish ready, ask them how much to send through their wide belt sander.

[George Yetka]

S2S means it was sent through a 2-sided planer. There can be some light marks / lines / tearout.. It's not a finished surface, so although sometimes it can look really good, I always have to plan on sanding.

If you want nearly finish ready, ask them how much to send through their wide belt sander.

I assumed some sanding, just didnt expect that much chatter. Atlantic Plywood supplied it and they source it elsewhere so no hope of having them do it. I will run a board later this week to see what I lose on thickness.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Their supplier mill has - most likely - both top and bottom heads out of balance. Meaning one knife on the head weighs more than the others - by a fraction of a gram. Which is a lot at high-speed rotation, and will cause what you are seeing. [other possibilities like bearing failure, and on and on]

This is molder/planer 101. They flunked. No - it is not acceptable in my world. And both heads means they aren't paying any attention to their process, nor to the lame efforts in their tool room.

Did it [A] pass through Atlantic Ply's hands, or [B] ship direct?

A - they are both accountable; B -Atlantic Ply needs to know.

I'd talk to them. If A have them check a piece in their warehouse and get back to you.

Could I get you to put a ruler on a board and count the chatter marks per inch? Like counting TIP/PPI on a saw blade. I'm curious - this can indicate a second issue re: feed rate.

Either way - I think you been had. I buy finished stuff also, and get nothing but pristine surfaces. Including the HM I'm holding right now.

[Lee Schierer]

S2S means it was sent through a 2-sided planer. There can be some light marks / lines / tearout.. It's not a finished surface, so although sometimes it can look really good, I always have to plan on sanding.

If you want nearly finish ready, ask them how much to send through their wide belt sander.

S2S means it was surfaced on two sides, not necessarily a two head planer, though I would expect a production mill would probably have a 2 headed planer.

[Warren Lake]

I only buy rough but did look at material per surfaced at a higher end kitchen place. I dont see it other than the time saving advantages. Can you stick some photos in so we see it.

[Jeff Roltgen]

Surfaced means it's been planed enough to remove the sawtooth pattern and meet a specified rough thickness. Period. To expect ready to sand and assemble is completely out of the question, and the material you received is precisely what we all get, when ordering lumber in this fashion. They're just saving wear and tear on your planer and reducing your sawdust pile by reducing thickness closer to what you need.


Any arguments about poor machinery setup are irrelevant. These mills are slamming it out as fast as possible, so tear out, leftover waney/live edge losses are eaten by you, and you'll be laughed out of the building if you approach them with complaints and call outs about their poor machinery setup.

Let it acclimate for a week or two. You will see the "straight and square" features rapidly deteriorating as well.

What you received is completely normal. Not arguing it shouldn't be better, just saying, it's never going to be so.

There is an option if you want ready to sand sticks of lumber. Go to a local Home Center, find the boards sealed in plastic, and pay exorbitant sums of money for the privilege.

[Richard Coers]

Their supplier mill has - most likely - both top and bottom heads out of balance. Meaning one knife on the head weighs more than the others - by a fraction of a gram. Which is a lot at high-speed rotation, and will cause what you are seeing. [other possibilities like bearing failure, and on and on]

This is molder/planer 101. They flunked. No - it is not acceptable in my world. And both heads means they aren't paying any attention to their process, nor to the lame efforts in their tool room.

Did it [A] pass through Atlantic Ply's hands, or [B] ship direct?

A - they are both accountable; B -Atlantic Ply needs to know.

I'd talk to them. If A have them check a piece in their warehouse and get back to you.

Could I get you to put a ruler on a board and count the chatter marks per inch? Like counting TIP/PPI on a saw blade. I'm curious - this can indicate a second issue re: feed rate.

Either way - I think you been had. I buy finished stuff also, and get nothing but pristine surfaces. Including the HM I'm holding right now.

If the machine had both main heads out of balance you wouldn't want to stand next to it and the bearings would be damaged in short order. With no pictures, any conjecture of the cause is just that.

[Richard Coers]

I ordered 200 bf of hard maple as follows
-13/16 Prime HARD MAPLE KD S2S SLR1E RW RL

My problem was I assumed this would be perfect or near perfect finish, maybe needing sanding only. It came in with chatter on both sides across the entire lot. This is my first time buying non rough cut lumber. Do I return this or is this acceptable? The wood is other wise straight and square. My thought was a pass in the drum sander should smooth this right out as it's not very deep.

When I order from a mill, I order it skip dressed to 15/16 or 7/8" and then make the surface what I want. Your lesson here is that you should have asked either us or the supplier, just what you would get or be able to look at a piece of stock dressed that way. You can NEVER assume the mill or store will provide what you think is acceptable. It has never been like hand selecting stock by yourself. I've never seen prime as an accepted grading term, unless it was for beef.

[Warren Lake]

prime is a made up name has been here over 25 years amybe more. Its just spinal tap, 11 one more than 10. Always hand picked though very hard thing to pull off. Ill say from going through tons of lifts of prime that 20 to 25 percent at most is prime. The rest is all good but that amount or less consistently was the best stuff.

[Cameron Wood]

13/16" is so that it can be dressed to 3/4"

[Kent A Bathurst]

I've never seen prime as an accepted grading term.....

If you mean for hardwoods, I agree. As far as I know, it is not a grading term in hardwoods, or in most most species of softwoods.

It is most assuredly an accepted grading term in Southern Yellow Pine [SYP]. The creation of this grade was around 25 years ago +/-. The layman's definition: #2 grade with #1 wane. Used only for "dimensional lumber", which means 2x material in that world. Not boards [1x ] or timbers [4x and up].

It was started by the Big Box retailers - by far the most massive buyers of SYP - but they buy the vast majority as pressure treated. Their problem was Joe Consumer would sort out #2 PT that had "too much" wane, in the eyes of the consumer. Definitely on-grade. Definitely suitable for purpose. But once it hits the cull rack, it has no where to go, in practical retail terms.

And so - they twisted the collective arms of the major suppliers of PT SYP [there were maybe 5 or 6 then, consolidated to only 2 now], who in turn twisted the arms of the major suppliers of SYP. Dunno how many there were then or are now - moving target. I do know that the modest-sized and mom-and-pop "peckerwood' mills were on the sidelines during this.

The result was the new grade - #2 PRIME SYP.

Which caused a lot of angst and consternation in other industries - particularly manufactured roof trusses - but that's a different topic.

[Kent A Bathurst]

If the machine had both main heads out of balance you wouldn't want to stand next to it and the bearings would be damaged in short order. With no pictures, any conjecture of the cause is just that.

I'll pass on relitigating our previous adventure, Richard, and simply note that lights-out S4S production and low-volume custom milling often occurs on different equipment, which has much lower feed rates and different characteristics. Seen it happen, but not in "lights out" world.

Back to you.

[Richard Coers]

13/16" is so that it can be dressed to 3/4"

Sure, but is 1/32" per side going to be enough? That's why I ask for 7/8" or more.

[George Yetka]

20230808_162412.jpg

Hard to photograph, since I had never purchased this way, only rough. Just wanted to confirm it being normal before complaining. I wont be complaining its not bad. I will probably be hair under 3/4. Ill reserve the ones I can keep at 3/4 for doors and drawer fronts. I should have went 15/16