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Thread: Looking for horizontal slicing bandsaw, g0503?

  1. #16
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    Woodmizer sells multiple head resows if speed is what you want. Get the heads with electric motors and production levels will skyrocket. https://woodmizer.com/us/Products/Sa...rizontal-Resaw

  2. #17
    I recently purchased the 16” version Grizzly Resaw, G0504. Its sells new for something like 25K, but i found this one used on FB Marketplace for 8K. I’m not normally a big Grizzly fan, but I’m really impressed with this saw. The fellow I bought it from had two of them, and made his living selling really high value instrument wood. He ran Lenox CT blades, and on the samples he ran for me when I was looking to buy the saw, the surface finish was so good you’d swear it had been run thru a wide belt. It’s a 25 HP motor requiring a 100 amp circuit, so I’m waiting for my shop to be finished so I can put it to work.

    The saw head uses ball screws with rotary encoders, so I think the intent is sawing off the top with a predetermined step height. The 16” version also has a return conveyer, so I think its intended to be two person operation.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Jenness View Post
    ...Call up door component suppliers and see if they will share what they use for this task...
    I live in Amish country. These guys make their doors of solid wood, thru and thru. No veneers on these babies....

  4. #19
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    The Grizzly G0503 comes in at $15,100 (with shipping). Can cut up to 12" wide, using a 20HP motor @ 3Phase. I don't have 3Phase, so I'd have to deal with that. Manual blade tension...pretty much all adjustments are manual. Weighs in at 2,778 lbs.

    The Woodmizer HR120 comes in at $13,700 (no shipping needed due to proximity). Can cut up to 16" wide, using a 10HP motor @ single phase. All adjustments appear to be electric. No hydraulics either. Even the blade tensioning seems to be electric. Not sure if that's good or bad. Tips the scale at 980 lbs

    The Laguna HRS-28 is out of the running. Looks to be exactly the same machine as the Grizzly, but I've got a bad taste in my mouth ever since I bought my Laguna cyclone dust collector. It quickly became obsolete, and no parts were to be had. No online diagrams to consult.

    I don't think I'm gonna consider the Baker unit. It starts at $19,840, and nowhere in their online specs do they talk about width capacity. All units seem to be 3 phase. I see the Baker's all over my Amish community, but they're all breaking down green cants into pallet stock. Baker doesn't seem to really be into the resawing of hard kiln dry 4/4 lumber. I vote no.

    There is a used Grizzly G0504 about an hour from me, for $18K. Would cost $30,700 new from Grizzly. Looks very clean, and seller says "lightly used". Could be a good buy, but again, I'd have to deal with it being 3phase.
    ===========

    I was thinking the 10HP on the WM was a little light. Then I thought about how I cut all day long with 5HP on both my vertical Grizzly and Minimax 24" saws.....so 10HP should be just fine. Makes me wonder if the 20HP on the Grizzly is a bit overkill, yielding a higher electric bill then I really need. Grizzly seems to have parts for years and years, after a machine is discontinued, and tho I have little experience with Woodmizer, I think we all know they have a solid track record....and have a dealer an hour from my shop.

    Whatcha all think? Which way would you lean?

  5. #20
    Take a trip to Indianapolis. Check out HR500 also. You could buy a single head unit and later add 2 more heads. Return table option.
    I have a Kay RPC that runs 14 machines. Very reliable.

  6. #21
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    geo with a converter to three phase , either a rotary or a VFD and don't look back.
    Ron

  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by dirk martin View Post
    I live in Amish country. These guys make their doors of solid wood, thru and thru. No veneers on these babies....
    Sure, most cabinet doors are made with solid wood, but makers of architectural stile and rail doors commonly use "engineered" stile and rail components with thick veneers. I don't know what Dirk's veneers are used for but that would seem to be a natural market.

    If I were in this situation I would be looking for production capacity. Heavy duty build, high hp, possibly multiple heads. If the market is there, why not have a machine that prints $100 bills rather than $20 bills? I would think 3 phase essential for a wide belt sander sized to match an industrial resaw. Easy to spend someone else's money, I know.
    Last edited by Kevin Jenness; 05-21-2023 at 12:10 PM.

  8. #23
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    You should take a few minutes and look into Baker resaws.


    I spent many years in the lumber remanufacturing bidness. That's where you buy from sawmills, then reman to other products. I worked out of corporate, dealing with a few dozen manufacturing plants. I did process design, plant layout, equip specs, blah, blah, blah.

    I directed the purchase equipment and machinery, including a number of horizontal resaws, and the hands-down, go-to dog was Baker. They're as close to an industry standard as you can get in that product range. Robust, reliable, very good company. USA - SE Missouri.

    Understand that I was not after veneer, rather after manufacturing production. But I don't think that matters. I needed to edge close to bulletproof. Wide range of capacities and capabilities.

    File under "You get what you pay for" especially for USA manufactured, serviced, support, parts. Frequently available on Ex-Factory, but they never last long. You can always call their sales dept to discuss what you want to do, and they will be very helpful. They always came through with flying colors on their commitments.

    https://www.baker-online.com/Product...?categoryid=91

    PS - FWIW, in my world, the bigger issue was not the saw itself, but the infeed and outfeed systems needed to keep up with the saw, running butt-to-butt @ 100+ LFPM. A pair of 2 x 4 side-by-side up to 2 x 12. Plus the dust system to pull all that dust out. The saw was not the big $$ in the equation. Veneer would not be run that fast, I'm assuming.
    When I started woodworking, I didn't know squat. I have progressed in 30 years - now I do know squat.

  9. #24
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    Kirk, this has turned into an interesting thread, even for those of us who would never own these machines, glad u are getting good feedback.

    Kent makes some very valid points that I was going to mention as well. As for which maker, others have offered a lot of good feedback to consider. As for size, or expansion capability, a lot depends on what you think the future holds as for as potential sales volume. Always a difficult, but critical prediction. I like the analogy of printing $100 bills vs. 20s, but this assumes you feel the volume will be there. Seems there is surely a tradeoff between labor to run any machine vs. the how much out-feed product per hour is...i.e. the more product per hour, the less labor cost per hour, assuming same man count per hour is required.

    AS far as electrical consumption....While I am generalizing a little bit here to keep my response simple and short.... The amount of electrical consumption is based on the load (work load here) not the size of the motors, or even if 3 phase / 240V / single phase 120V. Work volume, hardness of wood, sharpness of blades (ease of cut), optimum feed speeds, dust collection, (prob. a bigger component than you would think in an application like this) etc. will determine your elect. consumption. Regardless, electrical cost per saleable sheet is prob. minimal vs. your total cost of a sheet is my guess...specially if you are selling more costly woods.

    I do want to mention though, you should look at your utility providers tariff, and thoroughly read it, as occasionally, there is some real "gotcha's" in how utilities can bill customers, things like Ratchet clauses, peak hour rates, etc. If this is the case, sometimes it just takes some clever scheduling to reduce electrical costs. OTOH, some utilities offer very simple tariffs, just $ per kwh, during certain ToD, Time of Day and ToY, Time of Year which are easy to understand. Other times, the tariffs are complex.

    Of course, the bigger factor is... some utilities charge very little for power to start with...which is the biggest component... for example, I had a shop in AZ that charged about $.05 kwh on avg, about 7 years ago... now my shop here, $.50 kwh, yep, 10x. I have a lot of solar here to offset most of it, but that did not come cheap at $40K...but my ww electrical consumption is minimal (biggest motor is 5HP) vs. what you could potentially use running these huge saws with dust collection full time.

    Of course, as you mentioned, lots of upfront costs to consider in addition to the machine...possibly to upgrade your dust collection and electrical, assuming you have the capacity. If you dont have sufficient capacity in the building, that too should be investigated, as unless you have a local tap for the added capacity, that up front cost could shock you. I was once quoted $90K to bring added capacity to a small building, good thing I ruled out that site! And as you add capacity, the tariff often changes as well, so be sure to read that new tariff rate structure in advance to avoid more gotcha's. Some utilities give breaks to large users, others charge more...some penalize for mid day usage, etc.

    Lots to consider, but sounds like you are asking all the right questions....

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bradley Gray View Post
    Take a trip to Indianapolis. Check out HR500 also. You could buy a single head unit and later add 2 more heads. Return table option.
    I have a Kay RPC that runs 14 machines. Very reliable.
    I'll never need to add additional heads. I'm slicing 4/4 lumber. I'll get 3 or four slices max per board. The HR500 is overkill when the HR120 would do. I'm not slicing cants.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Selzer View Post
    geo with a converter to three phase , either a rotary or a VFD and don't look back.
    Ron
    I assume "geo", should have been "Go".
    Is single phase to 3 phase conversion like this no big deal? Or is it a major hassle?

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Jenness View Post

    If I were in this situation I would be looking for production capacity. Heavy duty build, high hp, possibly multiple heads.
    Waaay overkill for me. Again, I'm simply looking to replace one guy that slicing on a 24" upright bandsaw (with poor accuracy). The accuracy on these horizonal saws, alone, will give me a significant boost on productivity.

  13. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by dirk martin View Post
    Is single phase to 3 phase conversion like this no big deal? Or is it a major hassle?
    Not a big deal. Generally far less expensive than bringing in utility supplied 3 phase. VFDs get pretty expensive over 5hp so rotary convertors are more common in high hp applications, or digital converters like Phase Perfect.

  14. #29
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    no big deal for a good electrician. very commonly done in the agricultural world where the farm is out in the "boonies" and only has single phase power, gets more interesting when they are limited by electric provider to 15hp motors. There are three phase generator sets installed then, also when power company wants $100,000 and up to drag three phase power to them, some guys have posted over $1,000,000. I am making the assumption you are in town or close. As Kent and Will have brought up you also have other items to calculate into final cost. I would have to believe that with that size bandsaw you also want three phase for the dust collector and wide belt sander. However maybe you are just on the edge and can get by for a while with only the bandsaw on three phase. If you can get by with only the bandsaw on three phase then get your electrician to install a vfd for you. Will definitely start that motor a lot easier and easier on the electric bill every time it starts up!
    A good electrician is your first need, after explaining to him what you want to do, then he can explain to you which he feels is your best route. Whether a VFD or to upgrade the electric service to include a new 3 phase panel to go along with existing electric service panels.
    Good luck
    Ron

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Jenness View Post
    Not a big deal. Generally far less expensive than bringing in utility supplied 3 phase. VFDs get pretty expensive over 5hp so rotary convertors are more common in high hp applications, or digital converters like Phase Perfect.
    Are we talking like 1 grand, or several thousand dollars, if I wanted to run 20HP 3phase?

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