Talk me down from this ledge: Is this plan stupid?

[Charles LaMont]

Hi everyone. I've just had my garage rewired, which means my workshop is all broken down and piled in the middle, so I have a chance to put it back together in a more space-smart way.

It's a 3-car garage which has 3 cars parked in it. Parking one outside permanently isn't generally an option because we get hail a fair amount here, and a lot of snow in the winter. So all the workshop tools need to be stored up against the walls when not in use to fit the cars in. It's one of the "modern" 3-cars where the third stall is shorter than the other two, and there isn't a whole lot of room between stalls. Fortunately, one of the cars is an old Japanese sports car so it doesn't take up a lot of room.

Currently I've got a miter station along the 3rd bay wall. It's set up so the fence is just barely proud of the garage door track for cutting long boards. Under the miter saw is a rolling cart that holds the planer.

There' s an air compressor under the long side of the station, and my shop stool tucks in under the short side, so there's no more floor space under there to store tools.

I have an old Craftsman jointer on the metal wheeled stand that sits between the miter station and the back wall. There's a table saw up against the back wall, so between that, the jointer and the miter station I'm stretching the full length of the garage.

The trick is that I need a dust collector (which is why I had the wiring done). I'm planning on a wall-mounted one between the miter station and the table saw because that's the only place in the whole garage it can possibly fit, but if I do that, I lose the space for the jointer. I figure, sell that and get a benchtop model so it doesn't have to take up floor space.

That got me thinking. What's stopping me from recessing a benchtop jointer into the miter station? Set it so the outfeed is level with the station, with the infeed side ending right at the edge of the miter station so I can feed boards into it without the top of the miter station blocking them. The fence would line up with the miter saw fence so it wouldn't block any boards I'm cutting.

I looked around and couldn't find anyone else doing this, which tells me it's probably a bad idea but I can't really think of a reason why.

Any input on this crazy plan?

[Michael Burnside]

It's not crazy if it works. I've not seen it done specifically but I don't understand why it would be a big deal. I don't have the same setup as you but I went with an Oneida supercell wall-mount and it is pretty close to my jointer. However, the 30 gallon drum is shorter than my jointer table and the connecting pipe closer to the wall than the back jointer fece. Therefore, the work flows right over the barrel and proud of the connecting hose. Not sure how tall your garage ceilings are, but there is no rule about how high you have to mount a DC.

[Aaron Inami]

My understanding is that benchtop jointers are definitely a step down from a normal full sized jointer. If you are doing small piece, it is likely fine. Have you looked at the Harvey G-700? It's a smaller height dust collector. You might be able to build a workbench on top of it. The physical size is 56" wide, 34" tall and 24" deep. It's mobile so you can roll it around for positioning. Not sure if this would work in your setup. The Supercell is good if you have smaller 1-1/2" to 2-1/2" hoses/ports because it has higher suction. However, the Harvey will likely pull more air.

One thing to keep in mind is that wall mounted dust collectors can cause the wall to resonate and create a subwoofer effect (increases sound pressure). The Supercell mounted on the wall would not have this effect because it uses four small motors with turbines. It's not the same as a big dust collector motor and impeller setup.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

I am in favor of the idea but would want to create a way to use the old sears jointer rather than buy a bench top jointer. It won't be ideal and will create some logistic & safety concerns but sometimes needs must prevail. I had a micro shop in the basement of an urban house with a footprint of 3 feet by 7 feet. I did some things bordering on goofy to make it work, including a jointer conversion. I have thought about trying to create appliance garage hardware that is heavy duty enough for power tools. I was never super pleased with the ones that put a food processor or mixer away for you.
Heavy Duty Mixer Lift

IMG_1023.jpg IMG_0383.jpg
Old Delta jointer: bench top / portable conversion. The OEM base and motor are stored at the farm and used to power a big abrasive disc for sharpening sheep shear blades.

[Charles LaMont]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

Not sure how tall your garage ceilings are, but there is no rule about how high you have to mount a DC.

True, but I'm looking at the new one that Rockler just launched this week (dunno if links are OK here, but it's the wall-mount cyclone). Since it's got the integrated cyclone that feeds into a can that sits on the floor, that restricts where I can mount it. Plus, the air compressor is one of those horizontal wheeled ones, so it takes up almost the entire width of the wide side of the miter station. There's also the unmentioned problem that my garage is also set up for car work, and the tire racks are up by the ceiling. What I really need is a different house that's maybe just a bedroom and a kitchen attached to an 8-car garage, but I don't think my wife'll go for that.

My understanding is that benchtop jointers are definitely a step down from a normal full sized jointer. If you are doing small piece, it is likely fine. Have you looked at the Harvey G-700?

I'd love a Harvey, but I don't have enough room in my panel for another 220 breaker, so that nixes it and the Supercell. What's got me looking at the Rockler one is that it'll run off of a standard outlet, and it's got the same size motor / CFM as the Rockler dust collector my father in law uses which he has hooked up to a custom cyclone, and he gets great results so I'm pretty confident the new design will work for me.

I am in favor of the idea but would want to create a way to use the old sears jointer rather than buy a bench top jointer. It won't be ideal and will create some logistic & safety concerns but sometimes needs must prevail.

The big issue is that it's belt-driven, which is great except that then that limits where I can relocate the motor. But you've given me something to think about. Maybe I could get the motor mounted under the table and keep the old Sears. I'll have to do some measuring on that. Thank you!

[Jim Becker]

Charles, keep in mind that the "actual", real world CFM for mass market type systems are often much lower than the marketing number and in most cases, you cannot get a fan curve that shows actual testing under various loads to illustrate performance that can be expected with ductwork/hose, filters and tools in the mix.

[Charles LaMont]

Agreed. The next time I move, I'll make sure the garage/workshop setup is a lot friendlier to the stuff I do! These suburban garages just weren't designed for doing anything but storing a couple of cars and the kids' bikes in them, and the power setups assume the biggest demand on them will be the oven. Unfortunately I just don't have the panel space to do another 220v breaker - I've already got 6 in there as it is. I'd consider doing a subpanel, but that's pretty expensive and I suspect I'll only be in this house another 4-5 years, so the cost/benefit calculation doesn't make sense. The rewiring I did was pretty cheap and really just fixing existing problems rather than adding whole new systems.

So I'm limited to the mass market stuff that plugs into 110. I'm looking at the Rockler ones because my FIL is doing very similar things to what I do as far as tools, and his DC has the same motor as the one I'm looking at so I have the advantage of real-world results testing rather than having to rely on overhyped marketing. There won't be a whole lot of lengthy plumbing to this system, just a flex hose going to the table saw (no choice, the saw has to be moved up against the wall when not in use so a rigid pipe is out), and rigid to the miter saw and the C&C, which will be only a few feet to either side of the DC.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

Keeping the garage a garage while having it as woodshop is indeed a challenge. I backed a car out once not realizing that a stack of formica sheets had slumped over. I broke several hundred dollars worth in 1 second.
In my 1 man shop I get by using one 240 volt circuit for multiple tools as long I use them one at a time and the circuit can handle the biggest tool and D.C. at the same time. I am not sure if this is a good idea for your CNC which probably wants a dedicated circuit.

[Mike Kees]

Check out one of the car lift/four post hoist so you can store one car with another under it.

[Greg Parrish]

I'm guessing the old Japanese sports car isn't a daily driver. Maybe time to sell it and reinvest the funds into some new wood working equipment? LOL

[Matt Lau]

Hey Charles,

Can you post some pictures/layout?

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around your question.
As for your question about the jointer going into the miter station....I dunno what the problem would be......Maybe that you'd possibly bump into your miter saw when running boards through your jointer?

As for the dust collector, I'm retrofitting an older Delta Dust collector 1.5 hp with a cylone and Wynn filter.
If I had the proper wiring and planned to stay at my site long term, I'd want a Supercell....but I'm limited to 110, and will likely have to move to a bigger house in a better school district for my soon to be born kiddo.
You could get a dust collector head, attach it to a cyclone/Thein baffle, and either hang it on the wall or under a workbench surface.

https://forums.woodnet.net/showthread.php?tid=7348084

Not sure if that helps?

[Tom Bender]

I'm with Greg on this, sell the Datsun, partition off the small bay and have a decent shop.