EV battery news

[Kent A Bathurst]

Saw Miss Bardahl run in the Seattle area as a kid, guess I am showing my age

Early 80's, we lived in an apartment complex that backed up on the Detroit River. Boats ran 25 yards off the shoreline

The first year all boats were running Merlin and Griffon V-12 engines from WW II Spitfires [like Miss Bardahl]. Amazing sight and sound of the 5 boats in each race 25 yards away.

Second year Miss Bud ran the first turbine, then it all changed.

Man - that was something to see and hear.

[Rick Potter]

You're right Bob. I don't want to spoil an informative thread. I edited it.

[Bill Dufour]

I just read the Lordstown electric pickup truck company may go bankrupt. Hard to compete against Ford and GMC while asking over $100,000 for an unknown brand. Total production is like 30 trucks so far. All got recalled a few months ago. No idea who made their batteries.
You can still get batteries that can work and fit in a Baker Electric from 1904.
Bill D.
Edit: Foxcom made Lordstown batteries and invested heavily in the company. They are calling in their loans.

[Rick Potter]

$100,000,000 Just doesn't go so far these days. Looks like most small startups are going to be left behind, along with some legacy companies who might not be able to change with the times.

Europe and China are really trying to push EV's, and starting to freeze out foreign carmakers who built plants there. I read an article about Chinese nationalism becoming a factor over there. 'Buy made in China autos' and help the Chinese economy. Sounds familiar. I have been trying to buy USA for a year and a half, first with the Maverick, then the Escape Plug in, then with the Bolt. One after the other has ads for unavailable cars, and/or dealer markups, and finally the Bolt becomes an orphan car.

The perfect car for me is a plug in hybrid with 50 miles of electric. I would prefer a Toyota RAV4 Plug-in, but it is hard to ignore a Tesla Model Y which is cheaper with the tax incentives. With my solar I would never have to buy power unless I went on a long trip, and it is currently the only one with dependable charging stations.

The daughter living here with us bought one, and her daughter bought one. I am starting to lean that way. With a new service center in walking distance, and the price reductions, I might finally make a move soon.

[Alan Lightstone]

$100,000,000 Just doesn't go so far these days. Looks like most small startups are going to be left behind, along with some legacy companies who might not be able to change with the times.

Europe and China are really trying to push EV's, and starting to freeze out foreign carmakers who built plants there. I read an article about Chinese nationalism becoming a factor over there. 'Buy made in China autos' and help the Chinese economy. Sounds familiar. I have been trying to buy USA for a year and a half, first with the Maverick, then the Escape Plug in, then with the Bolt. One after the other has ads for unavailable cars, and/or dealer markups, and finally the Bolt becomes an orphan car.

The perfect car for me is a plug in hybrid with 50 miles of electric. I would prefer a Toyota RAV4 Plug-in, but it is hard to ignore a Tesla Model Y which is cheaper with the tax incentives. With my solar I would never have to buy power unless I went on a long trip, and it is currently the only one with dependable charging stations.

The daughter living here with us bought one, and her daughter bought one. I am starting to lean that way. With a new service center in walking distance, and the price reductions, I might finally make a move soon.

I have the solar/Tesla combo. Hard not to love it. Only expenses after purchase are tires.

Really, this future is all about batteries. Lower cost/higher capacity batteries will facilitate massive changes in society.

I once heard Tesla described as a battery company that happens to sell cars. It's a great description of their future role.

[Jason Roehl]

Early 80's, we lived in an apartment complex that backed up on the Detroit River. Boats ran 25 yards off the shoreline

The first year all boats were running Merlin and Griffon V-12 engines from WW II Spitfires [like Miss Bardahl]. Amazing sight and sound of the 5 boats in each race 25 yards away.

Second year Miss Bud ran the first turbine, then it all changed.

Man - that was something to see and hear.

I lived in Madison, IN from ‘84-‘89. Went to the Governor’s Cup Regatta there several times, including once after I moved away, I think in ‘92 or ‘93. The first time I went, in ‘85, there were still a lot of Merlin engines running, and you didn’t just hear the boats go by, you FELT them. By the time I moved away, I think the Miss Madison (locally owned and operated) was the only boat still running a piston engine, and it was not competitive.

The turbine-powered unlimited boats are a sight to behold, though. Going almost 200 mph, just barely touching the water, throwing a 60’ tall, 300’ long roostertail…

[Larry Frank]

Batteries are certainly a key to EVs. Unfortunately, we are importing much of the raw materials from places like China. I think it is great that they are looking to source them in US. Lithium is one mineral but each battery contains a lot of graphite which is also imported. One company is opening a mine in Alaska which has huge reserves of graphite.

The other part of this is electrical generation. We need a large increase in electricity to supply the EV requirements. Building new generation plants takes a long time and expensive. We need to be planning and building these quickly.

[Peter Mich]

Agree completely. We recently had solar panels installed and then purchased a 2023 Hyundai Ioniq 5. We are very fortunate to be able to make this happen. When I think back to the various Chicago neighborhoods that I lived in for 30+ years, I struggle to imagine how heavily populated urban areas will be able to take advantage of EVs.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

Batteries are certainly a key to EVs. Unfortunately, we are importing much of the raw materials from places like China. I think it is great that they are looking to source them in US. Lithium is one mineral but each battery contains a lot of graphite which is also imported. One company is opening a mine in Alaska which has huge reserves of graphite.

The other part of this is electrical generation. We need a large increase in electricity to supply the EV requirements. Building new generation plants takes a long time and expensive. We need to be planning and building these quickly.

There is a long boring film about life near the lithium salt fields in Peru. While looking for that I found this. Easy answers to gigantic chalanges seem elusive.

Documentary shines a light on lithium mining and conflicts in Argentina

[Larry Frank]

Somehow if we want to go to EVs, we need to find an economic balance between mining the need resources and climate. You cannot have the batteries without the mining.

[Andrew More]

I expect mining to pick up in a number of places around the world as China becomes less and less desirable as a trading partner. As mentioned lithium is abundant, but China was willing to sell at the lowest price, so no nobody else could compete. That appears to be changing.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Somehow if we want to go to EVs, we need to find an economic balance between mining the need resources and climate. You cannot have the batteries without the mining.

Frank - you are correct. Same story for oil, natural gas, nuclear, wind farms, solar. There is no free lunch aka the law of unintended consequences.

I recently read that there is nearly - but not quite - zero value in recycling solar panels - whose effective life span is estimated at 25 years. Alla them there solar farms being installed - future landfill, and not too distant future.

Big solar and wind farm power generation, but no distribution network to move from gen sites to consumption. Grid ain't there.

I've got no position. I know change is gonna come, because it must come. Just that there are a lot of interrelated complexities to resolve. Which we will do. But we have to come to know the unknown.

Sadly, I've come to the conclusion that, now knowing the identity of Watergate's Deepthroat, I will never know where Hoffa is buried. Siiiigh. Oh, well.

[Rick Potter]

Kent, he is in a heavy duty concrete vault in my backyard, but I might be wrong there, I find a lot of really big rocks there too.

[Dave Lehnert]

60 minutes had a story about this tonight on TV.

[Rick Potter]

Any new theories?