SawStop suspicion

[robert kempisty]

This is simply my observation but I'm wondering if SawStop gives away their table saws to popular YouTube woodworkers. I've never used one but find it difficult to believe that every one of those channels suddenly decided to get rid of their expensive table saws and buy a SawStop. Is it just about safety of do these saws do something that My Delta Unisaw doesn't? I've tricked out my Unisaw with a fold up roller extension, under-mount router with it's own T-square slot and rolling base because my show doubles as a heated car repair space. For 25 years I've loved it and grin every time I use it and have never once even come close to injuring myself. I've seen channels with my same setup suddenly get replaced by a SawStop. Am I missing out on something?

[Jason White]

It’s not uncommon for tool companies to offer free or discounted products to TV shows or YouTube channels. It’s relatively cheap advertising for them.

[Tom Trees]

Can't say I'd blame them, from a European or UK perspective, as the approach is done differently in regards to safety.
Seems if you learn from someone using a Sawstop, then you'd better get one too!
or to take the UK HSE approach instead,
450mm pushsticks, RK's mandatory, short fences, crown guards....everything done to accommodate cutting just so, and not be a pain in the @r$E,

i.e having a jig for yer fence so you can keep the guard on, or whatever needs done, likely something done for safety and accuracy.

Though it must be said the Sawstop design is an improvement with the RK, lets hope it might be more the usual in time,
and perhaps give those older machines a new lease of life, when someone's clever enough to figure out to make a decent bolt on version,
and make them by the thousand.

Two folks I can think of, who do things by the UK HSE advise are Steve Maskery, and the older stuff by the esteemed Roy Sutton.
If you watch those folks you might see some differences. (both on youtube)
I'm getting itchy to get at stage two on my machine, some of the stuff in Roy's video has the answer for what I need to do.

All the best
Tom

[Jay Houghton]

Well, it's true that product placement is cheap advertising but I doubt if getting a $3000 saw free is enough to give up the hosts reputation for objective product reviews and tools advice. I just sold my Delta 12/14 which I really enjoyed but now have a Sawstop PCS which is the 3hp model. It's every bit as good as a Unisaw (I've had 3) or a Powermatic or Jet. Several things make the Sawstop a great saw. First is dust collection. With the overarm hose its extremely effective. Second, the motor goes straight up and down, it doesn't travel in an arc when you raise the blade. Third it's very well balance and smooth with a poly-V belt drive. And finally, the safety technology. Unlike some of the comments here you don't brazenly wave your hands around a spinning blade because it won't hurt you, any more than you speed because you're wearing a seat belt. It never enters my mind that if I'm making a difficult cut the saw will save me. But accidents happen and it has nothing to do with how experienced you are. So why not add that extra layer of protection when you give up nothing to get it in terms of performance? I think that's the main reason why the top YouTubers have embraced Sawstop. BTW, my runner up was a Harvey.
Jay

[Jim Becker]

Product placement is not a new thing and yes, some folks do get product from companies for promotional purposes. Many actually acknowledge that. But many also buy products on their own and seek out new sponsors when one goes away. A big obvious one not long ago was when PowerMatic decided not to renew their sponsorship of the Woodwhisper. Marc moved on and now has a SawStop table saw, a Felder (monster) planer, etc. You have to understand that folks who are influencers and content creators are running a business and sponsors are an important part of that business.

[Dan Friedrichs]

There was an old New Yankee Workshop clip where the producer was doing a shop tour, stopped at the widebelt, and said, "Timesaver just sent us this. Hope they don't ever ask for it back - it's nice to have".

Point being, this is not new, at all.

[Clifford McGuire]

I've wondered the same thing. Often it's accompanied by a video about the new saw. They are careful to say "I replaced my old saw" or "I just aquired this new saw". They don't say "I bought .....".

It's fine, I just wished they'd be more upfront about it.

Many times they are standing in front of a wall of Woodpecker products. I often wonder if that's a paid placement.

[Tom Bussey]

I agree with Jay. I used a General 350 saw since 1992. At first I thought Sawstop was a gimmick. Then a very experienced wood working friend tried to cut his thumb off. I can't begin to tell you about how many one way, two hour trips, he took down two the university hospital in Iowa city. I started woodworking in 1973 and seriously in 1975 when I bought a Shopsmith. It doesn't matter how experienced you are. I got an eight inch jointer in 1996. Not my first jointer and I some how managed to cut off the tip of my index on my right hand about 3 years ago. Simple things like picking up a pencil off from a table, let alone off from a floor I can't do anymore.

An other Tool Maker friend told me he ad bought a Sawstop and that he thought it was a very good saw. Given his recommendation and my experiences I bought a Sawstop PCS. It is a great saw. It has all the bells and whistles I need and I couldn't be happier with the saw.

Maybe Sawstop does give the you tubers saws. If they do it for advertising good for them. I am sure it is cheaper than a small add in a magazine. As far as You Tubers go, most of what I see is regurgitated comparisons between different models of whatever. After watching most of them, using different process, I I doubt that most of them can build anything. I strongly like videos from Frank Klausz, Willian Nu and Rob Cosman. I mention Rob only because he does a good job of selling what he sells. And makes it so you want to try. I take them with a lot of salt and usually do not get through the whole video.

If Saw Stop furnishes them with saws it is wise marketing. A Saw Stop doesn't cost Saw Stop anywhere near the retail price. No profit margins for them or the retailer. And no sales tax because it was given and not sold. Wise cheap marketing if that is what they are doing.

At 77 I chose the Saw Stop because of the safety features. And I got a great saw to boot. I never would have considered a Harvey, because I had a General 350 I wouldn't have even considered let alone buying a new or different saw. Same goes for all the major brands.

[Cliff Polubinsky]

In a related situation, Nikon got the reputation of being the professional photographer's camera by giving free cameras to all the AP and UPI photographers. Got the jump on Canon who they had been battling with for market share.

Cliff

[Andrew Hughes]

If I was given a sawstop I would sell it and buy a table saw with a minimum 12 inch blade.
Im not afraid of table saws so I don’t need electronic safety.
Good Luck

[Richard Coers]

It would naive to think tools and machinery aren't given to YouTube influencers. Note the new word for internet woodworkers, influencers. If the influencer doesn't say I bought this, it was free or seriously discounted. And it makes it easy to say they bought it, when we have no idea how much they paid. Even a post like this keeps the Sawstop name floating around on the internet. A guy in our turning club gained a bit of notoriety with his colored hollow forms. It wasn't long before he brought a 5 gallon bucket full of Glaser tools to a demo. All free. As a reference, why did every actor in Hollywood smoke cigarettes in the movies decades ago? Sales and marketing! And those companies knew they were killing people.

[Patrick Varley]

Wood Whisperer spoke to some of this when he lost Powermatic as a sponsor last year.

https://thewoodwhisperer.com/videos/...or-powermatic/

I have no doubt that SawStop was sending out tools in exchange for exposure at some point. And it probably is convenient that they started right around the time YouTube, etc. started growing. However I wouldn't be surprised if they're no longer doing that as actively. They've established themselves, based in no small part by that initial marketing push, as "name" brand. Coupled with the fact that the safety feature remains very attractive to some people and I think there's ample explanation why they seem so commonplace.

[Michael Burnside]

Mark over at Wood Whisperer has integrity and would not be a shill to any sponsor.

SawStop is a good saw, period. The tech is worth it to me and if it were available on every other high end tool I use I’d buy it there too.

Missing out? Probably not, but I’ve never used the saw you have.

[Warren Lake]

I bought six new general machines in 81. Support canadian and good value at the time. Two are 350's and they have been fine. One for ripping one for cross cutting.

Few years ago bought a small used SCM. probably five times better than the generals.

Hey Andrew. After the old guy passed his niece called and offered me his pretty new low mileage Equinox. I told her no that I would only sell it and buy a better wally wagon so instead you sell it and put the money in the estate. Through his hospital stuff he told me to use his Equinox. First night I showed up at the hospital he asked "did you come in the truck" I said no wally wagon and he got mad. So for four months of his surgery and recovery I drove the Equinox. He didnt trust my old cars. One day towards the end I got him out in the wally and first thing he said was " oh this is nice" It was a shock to drive the wally again after four months in an Equinox.

[Ray Newman]

I have been following the SawStop Saga since about ’02 after reading a Fine Woodworking article. I was very skeptical of its performance and value. Today, I think what we are seeing is woodworkers realizing the value of the SawStop safety feature. Like many of them, I bought a SawStop ICS after a near miss or accident.

From 1987-2016, I ran a 3 HP Uni-saw with the Uni-guard with the disappearing splitter, Uni-fence with 52” table. We were old friends, great machine, solid, robust, and hard working. In 2015, I prepared to do a cross cut and I aligned the board cut mark with the kerf in the mite gauge sub-fence. The work was about 12” wide and my hand was close to the board cut mark and blade. My hand was on the stock and I heard a loud distracting noise in front of the shop as I reached over to fire up the saw and push the stock into the blade. Then for some inexplicable reason, the Little Voice said “Look”! Stopped and looked at my hand’s position – I could have amputated/severely cut two fingers.

Being a bilateral above the knee amputee, I just sat back in my wheelchair and thought about what I almost did. At the time, I was almost age 70 and realizing reflexes/reaction time, etc., were not as sharp as they once were, I needed to think all of this through. Could it happen again, was this a one–of-a-kind lapse? After carefully considering the situation, I bought a SawStop ICS.

The only regret I have was not keeping the Uni-fence for possible mounting on the ICS. I found the High/Low Uni-fence positioning valuable. If SawStop would market such a fence, I would purchase one in a heartbeat.

Reasons why noted woodworkers C. Schwarz, Chris Becksvoort, and Cossman bought a SawStop:
https://blog.lostartpress.com/2016/0...ith-a-sawstop/
https://blog.lostartpress.com/2013/0...top-table-saw/
https://chbecksvoort.wordpress.com/2...st-shop-notes/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSvoV_DWjAE&t=2s