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Thread: What crosscut configuration do you use?

  1. #31
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    One more vote for 8 points for most of my framing carpentry. I have cut 4X4s with one with no problem if the 8 point is sharp. When I was young and working for a carpenter, the 8 point was the type used by most of the carpenters around, as far as I know, for most carpentry involving framing, siding, etc. Almost everything except finish work.

    For finish work I use a 12 point. Back when I worked for the carpenter, some of the guys used 10 point saws for finish work, probably it was 50/50 on the 10 points and 12 points, but don't know for sure.

    Unlike Tom, we did not use much hardwoods, so I can't comment on other saws for carpentry for oak, etc. However, now I tend to use a 12 point on the hardwoods I use, because any time I am cutting hardwoods quality of the cut is the important thing, and i get smoother cuts with a sharp 10 or 12 point, although such does make for a somewhat slower cut.

    That said, the main point is SHARP for good cutting action.

    Regards,

    Stew

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
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    Israel
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    I cant really complain. I have my dream job, helping people, and I m going into orthopedics, which is basically woodworking with a lot of anatomy (much less talented handwork). And i gwt a chance to scratch a (for me) very expensive itch in this hobby. Just had my first born too. A crazy, demanding, exhausting and wonderful time in my life right now.

    It is a bit of a bitter pill that most of my friends are out of there starter homes and into there second as home owners, but i imagine the money will come in a few years.

    In the meantime, this weekend i start my benches leg joinery!

  3. #33
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    5-1/2 ppi crosscut?!?!

  4. #34
    A lot of guys in this thread are using table saws and the like for ripping and crosscutting and just using open hand saws for carpentry work. You will notice that Lie Nielsen and Lee Valley only make back saws of various kinds, no open saws.

    In hand work we usually true up a board with a trying plane. Then in cutting to length we knife the piece all the way around (four sides), and cut with a crosscut saw about 0.3 mm from the line (depending on skill). The knife cut keeps the wood from breaking out at the edges. Then we put the piece in the vise and plane the endgrain to the line.

  5. #35
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    Yeah im aware. I started oyt a semi reluctant Neanderthal. Im doing all my work in a small apartment balcony less than 10 feet long. It makes moving longer boards through a table saw unpractical. Also i can but quite a few hand tools for the price of a table saw. I do own a tracksaw which does most of my edge jointing (i finish up with a no. 8). LN used to make panel saws.

    I do use the knfe wall method.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
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    Pittsburgh, PA
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    There's an UK maker, spear & jackson, that makes panel saws (22", 24"), I don't know if they make hand saws.

    In the US one can find a ton of old saws, but most are rusted and if refurbished, they're absurdly expensive.

  7. #37
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    There is a SHARP Disston D8 panel saw hanging on the outside of my Tool Cabinet....right beside the Bishop No. 10,, a Jackson Backsaw, a Disston 7ppi D-112, And that Disston D8 Rip saw, 5-1/2ppi....I think that about covers all the saws I need to have handy.....That Panel saw is 20" long,10 ppi...and works quite nicely whenever I need it...
    A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use

  8. #38
    Join Date
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    And, the ones just hanging around the work area...
    Saw Collection hanging around .JPG
    Question was about Panel saw..
    Saw Collection, D8 Panel saw .JPG
    This D8...20" long, 10ppi...the 8 is inside the "D" in the very readable etch

    Jackson?
    Saw Collection, Jackson Backsaw .JPG
    Have to get a tooth count, sometime...maybe while I reset the "set" of the teeth..12" long
    Saw Collection, Disston No. 4 Backsaw .JPG
    And this is a Disston No. 4 Backsaw 9 ppi, 14" long...


    I do have a couple 8 point D-8s in the til...just happen to like that 7point D-112....fits the hand better, too..
    A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Assaf Oppenheimer View Post
    5-1/2 ppi crosscut?!?!
    Assaf, don’t fear the unknown- think about all the grand structures built in the pre- electric era (e.g. Factories, ships, Barns, homes, etc.). All those required crosscutting Timbers >3” thick- all done with handsaws. Try it you may find easier than you anticipate.


    Congrats on doing the hard work of investing in your career education!!!! As a certifiable old fart with 40 years in bio tech, you’re payoff is coming- hang in there

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
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    New England area
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    Vintage Spear and Jackson: 7 pt. crosscut, 10 pt. panel, 5 pt. rip. The 7 pt. crosscut is great for ripping thin stock.

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
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    Hey Assaf. Late to the party. I recently changed specialties and haven't had much free time.

    For handsaws and many other hand tools, Tom King knows more than me.

    I have about 2 dozen handsaws in my saw till and only have a few observations.

    If you are dealing with much plywood, I like the modern/current production hand saws with the Japanese tooth profile and induction hardened teeth. They are essentially disposable, but cheap as chips to purchase at the home store, team blue, team orange and etcetera. The main thing on those is the set of the teeth. If you are choosing among three at the store, buy the one with the most uniform feeling set according to your fingertips.

    As above, with 24 hand saws to choose from, for utility crosscuts in solid wood (versus laminated plywood) I invariably reach for a saw with 8 teeth per inch.

    For utility crosscuts I reach for 8-14-23-0-015, as in 8 teeth per inch, 14 degrees of rake, 23 degrees of horizontal fleam, zero degrees of vertical fleam and 15 thousandths of one inch set, comparing plate thickness just above the teeth to the width of the tips of the teeth. This recipe, this grind, puts me within one degree on every parameter of utility crosscuts suggestions from Rob Lee, Pete Taran, the guy at Bad Axe Saws (sorry, I cannot afford your products) and Rob Crosman and that English guy with the paywall. It works good, I probably do 75% of my crosscutting with this one saw, even though I have two dozen saws in my till.

    For finer cross cuts, like making the hardwood legs of a piece of furniture even so the piece sits level, I reach for 11-13-18-0-007, 11 teeth per inch, 13 degrees of rake, 18 degrees of horizontal fleam, zero degrees of vertical fleam and 0.007 inches of set as above. This is a recipe, or saw grind, I got from Pete Taran that I find completely satisfying.

    For ripping I generally reach for something that runs on electrons, rip oversize (one quarter to one half inch), let relax at least a week, and then trim to final dimension. For medium rips in medium stock I like 8 teeth per inch, 11 degrees of rake zero horizontal fleam (Rob Lee suggests ten degrees) zero vertical fleam, and just 0.003 thousandths of set. For really short rips I like the 'carcass' saw in the back saw family from Lee Valley.

    These three saws pictured are the ones I would keep if I had to let go of the other 21 saws in my till, if I was making furniture.

    So for furniture I would want these three saws, the three saw group of back saws from Lee Valley; and something electric (track saw, or circular saw with guide, or table saw) for long rips.

    The trouble with vintage saws is rust pits. I can generally get most of the rust out of the cutting surfaces of the teeth with the first or second sharpening, but getting an even set on the teeth of a vintage saw is a crap shoot even after aggressive rust removal in the restoration phase. I have sent more than a half dozen saws to a local (paint) artist after busting a few teeth off an otherwise clean plate trying to even out the set.

    To get the smoothest possible cut with any tooth count you need an even tooth set. I have (six bitten, twelve shy) become extremely picky about the vintage saws I bring home, busting teeth off at the rust pit on the gum line is heart breaking.

    FWIW if you are looking to timber frame a building out of softwood I like 5-20-20-20-020 for crosscut and 5-8-10-0-020 for ripping tenons. For mortises, dead electrons or dead gasoline for rough cuts.

    I do agree with Pete Taran that n00bs to ripping should start with 8 degrees of rake, move to 4 degrees rake when they get comfortable and then move to zero degrees rake when the ducks are all in alignment. I am still using 8-11 degrees rake on my rip saws, because I got power tools for the intimidating stuff.

    I do have a saw that can sever (crosscut) a 2x4 in 5 strokes, as Tom King likes. Mine is 8-15-45-45-010. I have a ways to go to file away the rust pits in the gum line, but hopefully it can cut more than 1-2 sticks between resharpenings before I cast off this mortal coil. It was a rust bucket in the door, a bit of a lark, grind parameters from Rob Lee.

    20230316_233811[1].jpg

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