Laguna Dust Collectors, X Flux 5

[Jim Becker]

Unless you have fan curves, you really cannot trust the CFM ratings for any of these systems. I'm very sceptical that the Laguna will perform anywhere close to those numbers for sure in the "real world". The Harvey may be closer, but still...

[Aaron Inami]

Jim is correct. I didn't look closely at those numbers, but 3093 CFM is definitely an "escalated number". That being said, I believe the Laguna will pull 50-60% more CFM than the Harvey G-700/800 models. Another point to look at is that ALL the Harvey dust collectors are restricted by a 6" inlet. The Laguna has a larger 8" inlet (which means your main can be 8" with 6" drops).

[Kevin Jenness]

This is just another LT tool fueled more by marketing wank than real engineering in my opinion.

It’s basically one of their short cyclones set in a hush cabinet. You can build your own hush cabinet pretty easily. What you can’t do is make up for the inefficiency of the short cone design - which clogs the canister filter faster than a traditional length one.

Actually it appears to be a single stage unit with an automatic cleaning cycle to keep the undersized (32 sq ft) cartridge filter clear - except that the filter will have to be manually blown out regularly per the manual. Anybody who has had to clean out a packed pleated filter knows that is a far from pleasant task, so the design seems problematic to me. A common rule of thumb calls for 1 sq ft of filter area per 10cfm. Plus, without a fan curve plotting airflow vs static pressure it's hard to know quite what the performance is.

[Dave Sabo]

Good points! I have a hard time buying into Harvey with the price plus CFM ratings. I do like how quiet the Harvey is, but I'm not convinced the Harvey has the power to run multiple machines at once.

um……….how many machines can you operate at once ?

[Bryan Hall]

um……….how many machines can you operate at once ?

Commonly 2 and occasionally 3 machines going in my shop.

[Jim Becker]

Commonly 2 and occasionally 3 machines going in my shop.

The larger (and considerably more expensive) Harvey "might" work for that, but no way that a single G700 would. It kicks hiney for single tool use, IMHO, and I'm glad I switched to it and got the lower noise profile, as well as the lower space profile that I took advantage of in my shop. But for commercial use like you have going, I personally believe you'll be better served by a larger system that can actually move a lot more air. (fan curves matter...) The alternative would be two or more G700s placed in the shop so that they can service certain tool island in an efficient way that works for your workflow. At about $2600 each...they are pretty affordable.

[Dave Sabo]

Commonly 2 and occasionally 3 machines going in my shop.

So, is this a professional shop with multiple people working at the same time with tools connected by a sizable duct system ?

If so, neither the LT or the Harvey are suited in my opinion. You should get over to Oneida and stop wasting time dreaming about creature comforts. You should also have pause about LT’s track record on design problems and ongoing support of their dust collection program - what are ya gonna do if they don’t sell the filters for that puppy in 5 years , or get in one of their infamous customer no service ruts ? What if the thing just doesn’t live up to their hype ?

[Stephen Bandirola]

Just buy a ClearVue and build a cabinet around it.

[Aaron Inami]

Based on my testing with my 5HP Clearvue Pentz EF5 with a 16" impeller, it will support two 6" drops at the same time (this is the same as four 4" hoses) -- as long as you are running an 8" main duct. If you are using a 6" main attached to the cyclone, it will be less CFM overall.

The Oneida 5HP or 3HP will likely to somewhat less because they are using a smaller 15" impeller and also a smaller 7" inlet to the cyclone.

[Bryan Hall]

I’m not married to the Laguna but I am limited by a sub 8’ ceiling so long cone cyclones are commonly out of the question.

[Aaron Inami]

yeah, the cyclones are going to require 8.5 to 9 feet of ceiling space. If you are concerned about Laguna design and support problems, the alternative to this type of dust collector is the Felder RL series. However, they start at around $5k for the RL 125 bare bones single phase version. I think the 125 is pretty much a single machine dust collector. It stands at 6.3 feet high.

A 2-machine Felder would be the 5HP RL 160 model which starts at around $7k for the single phase versions. These are a little taller at 6.75 feet high. The RL 160 has an "automatic cleaner" feature that costs another $1100, but it also requires massive amounts of compressed air. You need a giant air compressor to really support this properly.

[Phillip Mitchell]

I agree that the Laguna is not the right choice. Do you have the option to install a cyclone on the exterior of the building under roof cover to be able to make the height work?

Or - You can install a ClearVue cyclone in sub 8’ ceiling (and build a closet around it), but would mean a shorter chip collection container, which could be a shorter but wider/deeper rectangular or square bin that’s shopmade and on casters. The air sealing would have to be done properly but no reason you couldn’t design a box out of plywood, etc that could hold 55 gal or more of chips.

[Steve Wurster]

I’m not married to the Laguna but I am limited by a sub 8’ ceiling so long cone cyclones are commonly out of the question.

Only if you require a large (e.g. 55 gallon) waste drum. I have an Oneida V-3000 3HP mounted to the wall in my low ceiling basement shop with a 35 gallon waste drum. Of course I'm the only one ever working in the shop and never run more than one machine at a time.

[Kevin Jenness]

The best small shop setup I have seen had a cyclone outdoors with a rotary airlock dropping into a dump trailer. Expensive, but so is the labor of handling chips and dust and keeping track of bin levels in a busy shop, not to mention the safety aspect of dust exposure.

Here's my more primitive outdoor setup with airflow returning to the shop. I use 6 mil bags inside the drum with an insert to keep the bag open. The long drop below the cyclone provides a safety buffer in case the bin overflows. I replaced the canister filter that came with this unit with a bank of tube filters.

My bin is around 30-35 gallons and at my age is about all I want to handle. Tussling with 50 gallon bags was no fun at all.

new DC.jpgAttachment 493881

[Phillip Mitchell]

Thanks for sharing photos Kevin.

I think I understand the concept of the rotary air lock and that’s the direction that I’d like to be able to move in one day with a non basement shop.

Couple questions - if you have a totally external cyclone then how is make-up air handled inside the shop, especially a conditioned space?

The other option would be something like what you shared where I’m assuming your filter stack is inside the shop space on the other side of the wall or?

I guess what I’m wondering is how an exterior cyclone with air lock, etc but still having filters in the shop space is healthier/better for fine dust management than having it all inside? I can see the convenience factor immediately of chips+dust already being outside which is huge, but maybe I’m missing something in my understanding as to how it’s any different than a totally interior collector in regards to filters. Thanks