White Oak is dear and it creates issues - - - Wood in the Shendandoah

[Thomas Pender]

Yesterday we drove to Northland Forest Products in Troy, VA (Exit 136 - I64). Bought some nice 4/4 QS White Oak that was priced OK. But also needed some 10/4 or thicker to make some legs. They had some 10/4 WO that was cut 7’. (Picture attached). Bought a few for about 125 each. Wow - means whatever I build with this stuff I cannot make a mistake. (Note the 12” wide 8/4 WO (originally 13’ long) on top of those two - got it at Blue Ridge Lumber - Mule Academy Road in Fishersville - courtesy of the great manager there Kenny.

Plan to build a mid century modern bookshelf to honor my great friend David Longacre who recently passed and sell it at the MCC Relief Sale later in 2023 in his honor (he was a very skilled WW and aged 91). (Attached is an earlier one built for my son - waterfall QS WO on it.). I had usually cut mortises for the straight back and cheated a bit with Kreg Screws for the slanted front legs on the bottom of the shelves - super strong or so it seems. Now with the price of what we use being so high I am tempted to Kreg Screw it all the way (the lateral supports will still be mortises - angle of front leg will be 5 degrees). Would appreciate any alternative thoughts.

Also bought some maple this week. Went deep into Dayton Old Order country off of Silver Creek Road on a one lane rutted road (Rockingham County) where I picked up some very clear straight grained FAS hard maple 4/4+ At around $6/ BF - cash only. As we were loading it up with some walnut, we had the company of various beef steers who licked me and my truck (parked in front of the cattle guard) Nelson also had some beautiful cherry - all the way up to 16/4 and QS WO, etc.

Bottom line is I do not want to be looking to buy wood once I get deep into winter. I have several places to buy stuff within a half hour (Northland is about 80 minutes away) and while the wood is not bargain priced, the other places in Fishersville, Dayton, and Timberville with their short drive and good quality make it worth it. (Alexander Bros. In Timberville, VA - he has beautiful stuff.)

[Richard Coers]

I'd be real nervous about that 10/4 WO. White oak is incredibly hard to dry and especially at that thickness!

[John TenEyck]

I hope only that one board is cracked like that. White oak is notorious for that; they typically happen during the early stages of drying, though sometimes they aren't visible until later on. Not sure how you missed them though.

John

[lou Brava]

Just curious as to what your paying for it ? Out here on Left Coast It's not consistently priced from one vendor to another sometimes not even close. 2 vendors that are aprx. 100 miles apart same State pretty much same land & tax values both are fairly large hardwood suppliers. I just bought 150 BF of 5/4 white oak at $7.23 a BF. the other vendor closer to home is selling for 11.19 ? It makes no sense to me except I guess if people are willing to pay it why not charge it.

[Mitch schiffer]

It looks like that white oak was dried too fast or in the sun. Hopefully it isn't case hardened but I would guess it is.

[Tom M King]

Check to see what "Southside" has. I was thinking he is not that far from you (edited to add: I was thinking Buckingham instead of Rockingham).

https://whiteoakmeadows.com/

I built houses, including the one we live in and our barn in 1980, with White Oak siding. I bought it by the semi-truck load for $100 a thousand back then.

[Ron Citerone]

White Oak has become very expensive. Back in the late 70's early 80's when I first started buying wood in Southeastern PA, white oak was way cheaper than cherry and I believe cheaper than red oak too.

The only air dried lumber I ever bought that had living worms in it was white oak purchased in Woodstock VA. when my daughter went to school there.

When I read posts about acclimating not needed I would say white oak is one wood if air dried needs some serious acclimating compared to wanut or cherry. And then there is the surface cracking issue.

If it hadn't gotten so expensive I would use it more though. I love it!

[Mel Fulks]

I’m thinking the only way to make white oak cheaper is for us to stop drinking whiskey. Yes ,the science is solid but no one wants to believe it.

[John TenEyck]

I’m thinking the only way to make white oak cheaper is for us to stop drinking whiskey. Yes ,the science is solid but no one wants to believe it.

That's going too far, Mel. My approach to lowering my cost for WO is to mill my own. I just about 250 bf of it from two nice logs I got from one of my arborist friends. I found that it's best to mill it in early Spring or late Fall to slow down the initial drying. I lost several hundred BF to cracks just like those in the OP's photo when I cut some in mid Summer. Big mistake. The only way I'd do that again would be to put into my kiln, immediately, where I can control the drying rate which, for WO, is really, really slow in the beginning.

John

[William Lessenberry]

Central Arkansas white oak (& Persimmon) 4/4 FAS/Sel S3S is $10.40 bf. 4/4 FAS/Sel Rift sawn is $10.90 bf. 4/4 FAS/Sel Quartersawn is $11.85 bf. 5/4 FAS/Sel S3S is 11.40 bf. This is at Les Steen Hardwoods, a small retail outlet here.
BillL

[Jeff Bartley]

Thomas, you’ve found my lumber stomping grounds! Nelson Martin is a great dude, I always enjoy a visit with him. Where are you located?

And Ron, did your daughter go to MMA? Sorry you acquired some bugs from Woodstock! Who did you buy that lumber from? I live in Woodstock.

I have in one of my stacks a bunch of short slabs of WO. I plan to just let them be for as many years as I can then I’ll get them kiln dried.

[Jeff Bartley]

I’m thinking the only way to make white oak cheaper is for us to stop drinking whiskey. Yes ,the science is solid but no one wants to believe it.

John is right, that is going too far Mel! 😁

[Tom Bussey]

I went to an auction yesterday and they sold quarter sawn white oak, kiln dried, and skip planned at 1 inch. One bundle was 260 Bf and the other 3 bundles were 160 BF. It went for around $1.25 a board foot. I bought 2 white oak, freshly sawn 2x10s I believe about 14 foot long for 2 dollars. I have a older Ford Ranger so I couldn't bring it home. I am going back up Monday with a saw to cut into lengths I can haul. I will get some pictures and actual dimensions before I cut it. I can also post a picture of the sales receipt As proof.

I plan on making an apple press for a young lady I know. which is why I bought it. I probably have enough to 2 presses, and for 2 grinders. Also I went with White Oak because it will probably stay outside. I will dry it along side of my Ash over the winter and the moisture content should be down enough to build it's intended use. Apple presses go for a fair price in this part of the country. When you are making Apple Juice or whatever the moisture content of the wood isn't really that important.

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The boards are 19 inches wide. The moisture was at 30 percent when I stacked it. That is a little low per cent but was an already dead Ash tree. I will get it kiln dried in the spring, probable in the middle of April. If wood gets stacked out of the weather with good air flow around it it only takes it about 6 months to get the free moisture out of it. Disclaimer I said free moisture not completely air dried. Removing moisture in a kiln is not free.

[Thomas Pender]

Jeff-We live in Rockingham County, just outside Harrisonburg near W 33. Also have a farm and orchard in the NE corner of Rockingham just south of New Market. I enjoyed the time I spent with Nelson. He has some real period WW equipment he uses with his business and the cows were a bonus. His small operation seems better stocked than some of the larger ones, although if you make friends with Kenny (a very worthy person) at Blue Ridge you can get some great stuff. (BTW - Kenny sells end pieces for burning like $50 or so for enough wood to almost fill the back of my 8’ bed.)

To others-

I was and am concerned with the cracks in the 10/4 white oak I just bought. Will see how it cuts. If not well, I will laminate 4/4 with 8/4. I can also laminate 4/4 to the cracked stuff and use it like I would for 16/4 - bed posts. Funny, but the 8/4 I bought has almost no cracks. A few years ago I got hold of some great 16/4 white oak (almost brown in color) and it was the cleanest stuff I ever bought. It is my observation that the darker the WO is the fewer cracks. But who knows?

[Ed Aumiller]

FYI, just west of Timberville./Broadway, VA (in northern Rockingham County, VA) is Neff Lumber Mills, 12110 Turleytown Rd, Broadway, VA 22815
540-215-8113... They mill and kiln dry oak, cherry, walnut, poplar and other species... call them and check there prices...
they are MUCH cheaper than your prices in the same area... and they are great to work with.... and very honest...

Bought a LOT of beautiful cherry, walnut, poplar from them... not sure of current prices but it will be way less than you are paying...
No affiliation, just a very satisfied customer...