Telescopes

[David Bassett]

I remembered another astronomy activity we (successfully!) did with the kids, though it's not observing. The activity is described by Guy Ottewell in this book "The Thousand-Yard Model, or, The Earth as a Peppercorn". (https://www.universalworkshop.com/gu...-a-peppercorn/ also some version on Amazon, though their pricing is massively weird for this item.)

It is a demonstration of size versus space for our solar system. The activity leader places scale objects to represent the Sun and our planets over a 1000 yard walk to give a sense of large space is. My wife did the activity several times. Once with our kids for practice, again with one of the kid's 5th or 6th grade class, and also with a Girl Scout troop. Someone, probably Professor Ottewell, said they always do it early in their college intro to astronomy class and even new grad student TAs appreciate the perspective it provides.

... I am struggling with wanting something good, but also affordable. ...

Remembering my struggle with similar goals and knowing how quickly a budget is used up, I would suggest you start with:

- Planisphere (for 40-degrees latitude, or 30-50, or similar, any full-size / large one.)
- The Bright Star Atlas, by Wil Tirion & Brian Skiff
- one of the H.A. Rey books, probably The Stars
- Turn Left at Orion, by Guy Consolmagno & Dan M. Davis

and a decent set of binoculars. (Looking at Orion Telescope, I'm disappointed in the starter binocular selection they have. The one I'd choose of theirs is the Orion UltraView 8x42 Wide-Angle Binoculars. We have (a 30 year-old version) and it is very nice for casual observing, works really well with glasses on, and doesn't explode your budget right off the bat.) Any binocular of the 7x35 or 8x40 size should work for you though.

That starter set will give you enough to get an idea of how you'll like this activity and which aspects you are interested in. Learn a little bit, add a green laser pointer, and maybe some cheaper 7x35 binoculars to share and you'll be able to lead the Grandkids on observing tours.

If all that goes well, you'll then be more knowledgeable, and will have even developed some likes & dislikes, when you continue shopping for a telescope. (And maybe you'll have rolled into a new budget year! )

[Malcolm McLeod]

Sorry, I guess I'm bored. .......

Hardly bored. You sound just like my son. He took a college astronomy class ....and fell in.

He'd skip a beer to go to class, but skip class to go to a 'star party'. They used a 24" scope on campus, but get better dark skies at the 'parties' near head of Lake Texoma - where they used a Celestron 6se. He has now graduated and on top of his career, taken a part time gig doing maintenance for a small club of amateur astronomers on their 24" observatory in southern Oklahoma, with a focal length of f/16 (I get the look if I forget to state the focal length.) It comes with a little observing time as a perk, and he's currently designing an under-chair, red LED lighting scheme to illuminate when they get up - - and need to re-find all their chairs in the dark.

On his professor's recommendation, SWMBO and I got him the same Celestron and optics set-up as a graduation present.

As I said, he fell in. (And maybe I got my feet wet, too?)

[Tom M King]

f/16 24"?? That's a long telescope.

[Alex Zeller]

I would try to get in touch with that local club. Even if they aren't planning any parties it doesn't mean that there aren't members who will gladly have you join them some night. I have an 8" Meade that my father bought. It was missing a couple cables so I didn't bother getting them until not too long ago. I'm sure everyone is different but for me looking though the scope didn't do much for me. It's kind of like looking up at the sky and seeing more points of light. My 27 year old Meade can be controlled by an app on my phone and go to anything visible in the sky once properly aligned. It wasn't until I mounted a full spectrum mirrorless camera to the telescope that I became more interested in using it. But it can be an endless hole. The more you like it the more you will want nicer equipment. That's why I said, talk to the local club. Make sure this is something that will interest you. You may even find one in the club who has something used that could be your best option.

[David Bassett]

...and fell in. ...

Not me! My detailed interest only lasted as long as my kids remained interested. I'm remembering memories of that period fondly now and trying to provide Stan the advice I remember as helpful hoping he can avoid some of the frustrations I also remember. (Yes, your telescope is seriously cool. But no I'm not getting one like that because I'm basically shopping for a 9 year old!) These days I enjoy it differently and only participate enough to follow the popular news on new technology and discoveries.

f/16 24"?? That's a long telescope.

Makes me wonder if it's one of the classic refractors? They are seriously cool, even if not cutting edge anymore. I double checked, the Lick 36" refractor is about f/18, so similar ratio though much bigger.

[Tom M King]

My best friend did his PhD work at Yerkes. I went up to visit him then, and we played with the 40" refractor one night. A memorable experience in an old observatory.

https://yerkesobservatory.org/learn/legacy/

[David Bassett]

My best friend did his PhD work at Yerkes. I went up to visit him then, and we played with the 40" refractor one night. A memorable experience in an old observatory.

https://yerkesobservatory.org/learn/legacy/

Those are the jerks that unseated us as the biggest refractor!

It wasn't a private tour, but I got a chance to view through the James Lick 36" scope here and it was mind blowing. I'd love to get to Yerkes someday too, but it doesn't seem in the cards at least for now.

[Stan Calow]

As the OP, I appreciate the lively discussion that's occurred, and I've been given a lot to think about. I'll admit that part of my motivation in asking now was in anticipation of some good Black Friday / Cyber Monday deals. I've joined an online forum, and looked into the local astronomical society. Unfortunately they seem to meet infrequently and their dark park is about 80 miles from my home. This old man not exactly up for nighttime trips in the winter.

It's kind of an interesting parallel to starting out in woodworking as a hobby. You have to make choices on whether to jump in and start buying tools and making things, or to learn through classes and education before buying your first table saw, for example. I guess I'm looking for the middle road - willing to buy into the hobby to a certain point, on the hope it will take.

[David Bassett]

... This old man not exactly up for nighttime trips in the winter. ...

You are only imagining part of it! While California isn't known for terrible weather, I used to ski (back when the knees still worked) and thought I had a handle on dealing with cold. But it was serious amateur astronomers that told me about battery powered snowmobile suits. Sitting very still, not generating any heat, in the dark... the really serious folk pulling all night sessions really geared up.

OTOH- you can see many interesting things in 30 minute sessions in a dark backyard or campsite, just not as many as they will.



This I can't edit anymore and I thought of a change and a addition to my list:

(Delete an activity)

Remembering my struggle with similar goals and knowing how quickly a budget is used up, I would suggest you start with:

- Planisphere (for 40-degrees latitude, or 30-50, or similar, any full-size / large one.)
- The Bright Star Atlas, by Wil Tirion & Brian Skiff
- one of the H.A. Rey books, probably The Stars
- Turn Left at Orion, by Guy Consolmagno & Dan M. Davis

and a decent set of binoculars. (Looking at Orion Telescope, I'm disappointed in the starter binocular selection they have. The one I'd choose of theirs is the Orion UltraView 8x42 Wide-Angle Binoculars. We have (a 30 year-old version) and it is very nice for casual observing, works really well with glasses on, and doesn't explode your budget right off the bat.) Any binocular of the 7x35 or 8x40 size should work for you though. ...

On further thought I'd change my suggestion of "Turn Left at Orion" for binocular observing. I still think it's a great book, but it's intended for a small telescope which is much bigger than a starter / general purpose binocular and will talk about things not (easily) visible with them. I think I should have suggested a book targeting Binocular observing as a first guide. I don't have a specific recommendation, though I did notice a review saying the one by Tirion is the best because it provides more context to aid finding objects. Binocular Astronomy by Craig Crossen & Wil Tirion is the only book I've found that Tirion is credited with (on Amazon. Note their pricing is insane, there has got to be a better source.)

Also, I should have suggested a (dim) RED LED Flashlight. If you are going to look at charts or guides when observing you'll need a light and red is the traditional way to maintain your night vision. Sadly, I didn't find anything cheap to suggest. Way back Orion carried a cheap 2AA flashlight w/a red (5mm) LED replacing the incandescent bulb. (I think I paid about $10 and the incan equivalent was about $3 at Target.) It work really well for our casual use. Sadly all I found with a quick search were pretty deluxe, with extra features, or targeting hunters and far too bright for observing. (It'd be pretty simple to cobble together something if you have electronics experience.) So searching harder or busting your budget a little, seem the best idea.

[John K Jordan]

…
Also, I should have suggested a (dim) RED LED Flashlight. If you are going to look at charts or guides when observing you'll need a light and red is the traditional way to maintain your night vision. Sadly, I didn't find anything cheap to suggest. …

Red light is so important for preserving night vision. I have several red light flashlights. But what works just as well is a red plastic filter on the front of the light. Maglight used to sell a red disk that but be placed under the removable bezel and over the lens of their mini lights, as did Fenix. And red plastic will do, even taped to the front, two or more layers if needed. And a low brightness light is best, or maybe add grey or neutral density filters.

A quick Amazon search gave many options. Some brag about high power. Maybe some have low power modes.
The last one I bought from them is no longer available but I found this (can’t vouch for it):

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07KJMFH47/

JKJ

[Derek Meyer]

When I was in high school I wanted a red flashlight for night vision purposes. I took an inexpesive flashlight with a plastic outer lens and colored it red with a permanent marker. Probably not ideal, but it worked and it was cheap and redily available.

[Stan Calow]

Well I came across a Black Friday deal and bought a Celestron 130mm reflector with Starsense (the phone app) for $400. I needed to have something to play with to get motivated. I'm going to spend the winter getting educated and hope to be ready for the summer season. I'm kind of thinking this might be the hobby to take the place of woodworking as I phase out of that.

[David Bassett]

Well I came across a Black Friday deal and bought a Celestron 130mm reflector with Starsense (the phone app) for $400. I needed to have something to play with to get motivated. I'm going to spend the winter getting educated and hope to be ready for the summer season. I'm kind of thinking this might be the hobby to take the place of woodworking as I phase out of that.

Good luck & have fun!

ETA: I should have started with Congratulations! (Then good luck & have fun.)

Plus: I looked up the scope and it sounds nice. And it's at the bigger end of "small scope" territory, so should be capable of a lot of things.

I'm completely unfamiliar with the guidance app, it sounds like a nice addition (but ads always would.) Come back and let us know how the scope and app are in real life. Especially, how is the set-up? How accurately does the app point? What does it do to your phone's charge? How is the list of objects in its database? (And everything I haven't thought of yet! )

[Bill George]

Wow so much good advice I had a nice setup and sold.... it all at a great loss. Tall trees and Neighbours with the lights on all night was not fun. The IPhone star apps are great but I can not find the one I used right now. If your phone as GPS and outside at night it can give you great star maps for locating your target or just general star gazing. Cloudy Nights is a great forum and they have a buy / sell section where you can get bargains. The local Facebook ads are usually full of department store used scopes, but once in a while a real bargain on a quality one comes up. Good Luck!

[Roger Feeley]

Visiting a local club is an excellent suggestion. A while back, I flirted with the idea of building a telescope. A local club website had a page with a sampling of images I might get. I’ve been spoiled all these years by images from various big scopes, Hubble and orbiters. Those samples were a great reality check.