What Is The Most Difficult Power Tool In The Wood Working Shop?

[Alan Lightstone]

I've seen way too many patients with missing digits from table saws. Way too many. So, I guess, I'd have to put that at the top of the list.

Personally, I'd say it's the router, although a disc sander is what got me recently. And shapers - never bought one. They really do scare the crap out of me.

[Mike Cutler]

He said they learned it half a century ago. That is not possible. You can't learn today's safety methods half a century ago.

Criticizing what I say is more appropriate than criticizing me. If what I say is wrong, it should be easy to disprove.

Steve
I understand your position, but must disagree with your 1st statement.
I was 11 years old in 1970 when I first started using machinery and power tools in a classroom/ industrial environment.
The rules then, are no different than today. Here they are;
All machine guards in place.
No wearing of rings, watches, or exposed jewelry.
Long hair, this was the 60’s and 70’s, tied back in a ponytail and stuffed down your shirt.
No long sleeve shirts,
Shirts tucked in.
Safety goggles worn at all times. Face shields when operating the lathe.
Every machine had a qual card for it. Until you were signed off, you couldn’t use it. Period.

Between “metal shop”,and “wood shop”, I spent the next 6 years learning these machines, and how to operate them safely.
Routers were not a common tool yet, we used the shaper for most of what people are doing with a router. We had them, but they were used infrequently.
I work in an industrial environment today, at 63 years old, and the rules are essentially the same. The world hasn’t changed that much, and neither have the machines.

[Edward Weber]

I don't use guards. I'm neither arrogant or lazy. Suggesting I am, or others are, without fully understanding the "why" is a more accurate demonstration of arrogance. I use splitters, riving knifes, board buddies, feather boards, etc. Guards can actually create their own hazards. I also make sure my head's in the game before I use power tools. Stop, think, analyze what the task is and how to do it safely - then act.

I'm glad someone said this. Thanks

I have a few, NIB (new in box) "safety devices" that would be more of a hindrance than a help.
The giant birdcage that came with my lathe, the ridiculous guard that covers the chuck on some drill presses, and so on. Many "safety" devices are there only to meet obligation, not improve the safe operation of the tool. Knowing when something that is deemed "safe" is actually not, is something you should inherently know, or you really shouldn't be using the tool in the first place.

If you find yourself constantly distracted by something that is supposed to keep you safe, it might be time to do something about it.

[Steve H Graham]

I wear safety glasses when I'm using tools that might require their use. I do not use goggles unless they are needed. Goggles are for use when using a grinder or some other tool where you can expect things to be bouncing around and entering the eye at an angle. And even then, a face shield works better, as it won't fog up on you like goggles do.

I don't use guards. I'm neither arrogant or lazy. Suggesting I am, or others are, without fully understanding the "why" is a more accurate demonstration of arrogance. I use splitters, riving knifes, board buddies, feather boards, etc. Guards can actually create their own hazards. I also make sure my head's in the game before I use power tools. Stop, think, analyze what the task is and how to do it safely - then act.

Safety is not a device. It's a state of mind. Air bags won't help much at a 150mph.

You are representing my position in a very inaccurate way. You seem to think guards are all I'm talking about, when in fact failing to use guards is just an example I used. There are plenty of other stupid things overconfident people do around tools. Turning off wall switches instead of breakers when working on wiring. Using isocyanate paint without the proper lung and skin protection. Welding for long periods without sleeves. Working with heavy objects without safety-toe boots. Pulling stumps with nylon ropes. Attaching chains and tow straps above the level of a tractor's rear axle. Mounting bench grinder wheels without ringing them. Using cutoff wheels that have been dropped. Buffing inside corners. Hammering on mushroomed chisels. Running a chainsaw without ear protection.The list of stupid practices is extremely long, and yes, arrogance is one of the big reasons these things happen. Sure, there are times when you can't do things exactly right. How does that excuse the hundreds of thousands of experienced people who have thrown away grinder and saw guards as soon as they bought their tools? You know perfectly well that there are many, many pros who do things wrong every time, not just occasionally. And they walk or are carried into emergency rooms every day.

If you never use guards, you are part of the problem, not someone to give advice. It's bad enough if you're doing it alone, but if you're working with others, you're endangering them, too. A grinder disk can hit other people when it explodes, and someone other than you can run his hand through your table saw. Featherboards and riving knives are great, but kickbacks aren't the only problem with table saws. Plenty of people have had their hands pulled into them or simply slipped.

You also imply I think goggles are all that's needed for eye protection. Not true at all. I wear glasses and a face shield when using a wire knot wheel or a cutoff disk, and once I got wire in my eye anyway.

I didn't realize what I said would provoke people, but I should have, because the world is full of people who think reasonable safety measures are huge, unrealistic impositions. I still remember the folks who used to claim seat belts killed more people than they saved.

A buddy of mine used to say he wanted to ride my motorcycles. I told him no one who hadn't taken the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course was going near them. He tried to tell me he was an expert because he had ridden all his life (with no endorsement on his license). I asked him a simple question: "How do you turn a motorcycle?" He couldn't answer it. Just about no one who hasn't taken a course knows the correct answer, and this is just as true of experienced riders as it is of new ones. They don't know the proper way to sit at a traffic light. They don't know motorcycles cause hearing damage with or without loud pipes. They don't know what to do when they find themselves headed for a big bump at speed. They don't know what a decreasing-radius turn is. People often think they know a lot more than they do, because they've been lucky.

As for people who reject safety rules and never have injuries, that's actually normal and proves nothing at all. You measure danger by the people who get hurt, not the lucky ones who don't. After all, 85% of people who smoke cigarettes all their lives DON'T get lung cancer. It's the other 15% that prove smoking is stupid.

Experience is a great teacher, but education is better, because it helps you avoid bad experiences other people have had.

[Steve Demuth]

Uhgggg...... That made me physically ill. I only use a 4" grinder with a 3.5" blade, and only when I just figure out a better way to make the cut. Sometimes, I use it when I'm working with aluminum, and that's when things get real sketchy.

+1 on that. I just quit watching his series after that episode.

[Steve Demuth]

Well, the one in my shop that gives me the most difficulty is a Delta 31-255X Drum Sander. Not because it's particularly dangerous, or difficulat to understand or handle, but because it requires about an hour of maintenance for every half hour of productive use. Never met a machine so impossible to keep in fettle.

The scariest tools in the shop, though, are any of my handheld routers.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

I am hoping for a really good drum sander or a small wide belt sander as an early retirement present to myself. Reading these posts and thinking back, the router does rank high in wrecking projects.

[Michael Drew]

You are representing my position in a very inaccurate way. You seem to think guards are all I'm talking about, when in fact failing to use guards is just an example I used. There are plenty of other stupid things overconfident people do around tools. Turning off wall switches instead of breakers when working on wiring. Using isocyanate paint without the proper lung and skin protection. Welding for long periods without sleeves. Working with heavy objects without safety-toe boots. Pulling stumps with nylon ropes. Attaching chains and tow straps above the level of a tractor's rear axle. Mounting bench grinder wheels without ringing them. Using cutoff wheels that have been dropped. Buffing inside corners. Hammering on mushroomed chisels. Running a chainsaw without ear protection.The list of stupid practices is extremely long, and yes, arrogance is one of the big reasons these things happen. Sure, there are times when you can't do things exactly right. How does that excuse the hundreds of thousands of experienced people who have thrown away grinder and saw guards as soon as they bought their tools? You know perfectly well that there are many, many pros who do things wrong every time, not just occasionally. And they walk or are carried into emergency rooms every day.

If you never use guards, you are part of the problem, not someone to give advice. It's bad enough if you're doing it alone, but if you're working with others, you're endangering them, too. A grinder disk can hit other people when it explodes, and someone other than you can run his hand through your table saw. Featherboards and riving knives are great, but kickbacks aren't the only problem with table saws. Plenty of people have had their hands pulled into them or simply slipped.

You also imply I think goggles are all that's needed for eye protection. Not true at all. I wear glasses and a face shield when using a wire knot wheel or a cutoff disk, and once I got wire in my eye anyway.

I didn't realize what I said would provoke people, but I should have, because the world is full of people who think reasonable safety measures are huge, unrealistic impositions. I still remember the folks who used to claim seat belts killed more people than they saved.

A buddy of mine used to say he wanted to ride my motorcycles. I told him no one who hadn't taken the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course was going near them. He tried to tell me he was an expert because he had ridden all his life (with no endorsement on his license). I asked him a simple question: "How do you turn a motorcycle?" He couldn't answer it. Just about no one who hasn't taken a course knows the correct answer, and this is just as true of experienced riders as it is of new ones. They don't know the proper way to sit at a traffic light. They don't know motorcycles cause hearing damage with or without loud pipes. They don't know what to do when they find themselves headed for a big bump at speed. They don't know what a decreasing-radius turn is. People often think they know a lot more than they do, because they've been lucky.

As for people who reject safety rules and never have injuries, that's actually normal and proves nothing at all. You measure danger by the people who get hurt, not the lucky ones who don't. After all, 85% of people who smoke cigarettes all their lives DON'T get lung cancer. It's the other 15% that prove smoking is stupid.

Experience is a great teacher, but education is better, because it helps you avoid bad experiences other people have had.

There is simply too much to unpack there, and I'm not inclined to argue with you over semantics and words chosen.

I did not say I "never" use guards. I was referring to table saws. I should have been more clear. I have not found one that works well, and does not get in the way. I am however going to try an overhead guard for the new saw. Guards on other power tools, however, usually stay on my tools until I have to remove it for an unusual need.

There is a reason why I, and others took exception to your comments and inspired responses. You painted us with a wide brush - and that we are all arrogant or lazy, or both. What did you expect?

[Mark Hennebury]

This should be on the "time for some levity" thread.

You are representing my position in a very inaccurate way. You seem to think guards are all I'm talking about, when in fact failing to use guards is just an example I used. There are plenty of other stupid things overconfident people do around tools. Turning off wall switches instead of breakers when working on wiring. Using isocyanate paint without the proper lung and skin protection. Welding for long periods without sleeves. Working with heavy objects without safety-toe boots. Pulling stumps with nylon ropes. Attaching chains and tow straps above the level of a tractor's rear axle. Mounting bench grinder wheels without ringing them. Using cutoff wheels that have been dropped. Buffing inside corners. Hammering on mushroomed chisels. Running a chainsaw without ear protection.The list of stupid practices is extremely long, and yes, arrogance is one of the big reasons these things happen. Sure, there are times when you can't do things exactly right. How does that excuse the hundreds of thousands of experienced people who have thrown away grinder and saw guards as soon as they bought their tools? You know perfectly well that there are many, many pros who do things wrong every time, not just occasionally. And they walk or are carried into emergency rooms every day.

If you never use guards, you are part of the problem, not someone to give advice. It's bad enough if you're doing it alone, but if you're working with others, you're endangering them, too. A grinder disk can hit other people when it explodes, and someone other than you can run his hand through your table saw. Featherboards and riving knives are great, but kickbacks aren't the only problem with table saws. Plenty of people have had their hands pulled into them or simply slipped.

You also imply I think goggles are all that's needed for eye protection. Not true at all. I wear glasses and a face shield when using a wire knot wheel or a cutoff disk, and once I got wire in my eye anyway.

I didn't realize what I said would provoke people, but I should have, because the world is full of people who think reasonable safety measures are huge, unrealistic impositions. I still remember the folks who used to claim seat belts killed more people than they saved.

A buddy of mine used to say he wanted to ride my motorcycles. I told him no one who hadn't taken the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course was going near them. He tried to tell me he was an expert because he had ridden all his life (with no endorsement on his license). I asked him a simple question: "How do you turn a motorcycle?" He couldn't answer it. Just about no one who hasn't taken a course knows the correct answer, and this is just as true of experienced riders as it is of new ones. They don't know the proper way to sit at a traffic light. They don't know motorcycles cause hearing damage with or without loud pipes. They don't know what to do when they find themselves headed for a big bump at speed. They don't know what a decreasing-radius turn is. People often think they know a lot more than they do, because they've been lucky.

As for people who reject safety rules and never have injuries, that's actually normal and proves nothing at all. You measure danger by the people who get hurt, not the lucky ones who don't. After all, 85% of people who smoke cigarettes all their lives DON'T get lung cancer. It's the other 15% that prove smoking is stupid.

Experience is a great teacher, but education is better, because it helps you avoid bad experiences other people have had.

[Michael Schuch]

I often hear people talk about the dangers of Radial Arm Saws. I grew up learning woodworking from my father and the only stationary saw we had was a Delta Turret Arm radial arm saw so that is what I learned to use. I have never considered a RAS dangerous... but many do and I believe that they were never taught how to use one properly.

So my answer is the most dangerous machine in the shop is the one you don't know how to use properly!

[Maurice Mcmurry]

I think it was Michael Shuch who pointed out the importance of a proper blade for the RSA. A non climber is on my list of urgent tool needs. Lack of common sense and lack of training seem to be a consensus.

[Dan Friedrichs]

You are representing my position in a very inaccurate way. You seem to think guards are all I'm talking about, when in fact failing to use guards is just an example I used. There are plenty of other stupid things overconfident people do around tools. Turning off wall switches instead of breakers when working on wiring. Using isocyanate paint without the proper lung and skin protection. Welding for long periods without sleeves. Working with heavy objects without safety-toe boots. Pulling stumps with nylon ropes. Attaching chains and tow straps above the level of a tractor's rear axle. Mounting bench grinder wheels without ringing them. Using cutoff wheels that have been dropped. Buffing inside corners. Hammering on mushroomed chisels. Running a chainsaw without ear protection.The list of stupid practices is extremely long, and yes, arrogance is one of the big reasons these things happen. Sure, there are times when you can't do things exactly right. How does that excuse the hundreds of thousands of experienced people who have thrown away grinder and saw guards as soon as they bought their tools? You know perfectly well that there are many, many pros who do things wrong every time, not just occasionally. And they walk or are carried into emergency rooms every day.

If you never use guards, you are part of the problem, not someone to give advice. It's bad enough if you're doing it alone, but if you're working with others, you're endangering them, too. A grinder disk can hit other people when it explodes, and someone other than you can run his hand through your table saw. Featherboards and riving knives are great, but kickbacks aren't the only problem with table saws. Plenty of people have had their hands pulled into them or simply slipped.

You also imply I think goggles are all that's needed for eye protection. Not true at all. I wear glasses and a face shield when using a wire knot wheel or a cutoff disk, and once I got wire in my eye anyway.

I didn't realize what I said would provoke people, but I should have, because the world is full of people who think reasonable safety measures are huge, unrealistic impositions. I still remember the folks who used to claim seat belts killed more people than they saved.

A buddy of mine used to say he wanted to ride my motorcycles. I told him no one who hadn't taken the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course was going near them. He tried to tell me he was an expert because he had ridden all his life (with no endorsement on his license). I asked him a simple question: "How do you turn a motorcycle?" He couldn't answer it. Just about no one who hasn't taken a course knows the correct answer, and this is just as true of experienced riders as it is of new ones. They don't know the proper way to sit at a traffic light. They don't know motorcycles cause hearing damage with or without loud pipes. They don't know what to do when they find themselves headed for a big bump at speed. They don't know what a decreasing-radius turn is. People often think they know a lot more than they do, because they've been lucky.

As for people who reject safety rules and never have injuries, that's actually normal and proves nothing at all. You measure danger by the people who get hurt, not the lucky ones who don't. After all, 85% of people who smoke cigarettes all their lives DON'T get lung cancer. It's the other 15% that prove smoking is stupid.

Experience is a great teacher, but education is better, because it helps you avoid bad experiences other people have had.

Steve, I just want to say what an wonderfully thoughtful and wise post this is. Several of the examples you cite were not known to me, and I learned new safety behaviors by reading about these hazards (which is proving your point: education is a better teacher than experience).

I can't believe anyone would argue with any of this.

[Mark Hennebury]

Listing a bunch of stupid things that people do that have nothing to do with the topic is simple trying to manipulate the conversation. Wall switches, Isocyanate, safety boots, welding, motor cycles...and the classic... seat belts Wow! amazing sh*t it's all just BS.

If you want to talk about shop safety, lets talk Facts about shop safety not BS.

I guess that you learned something during your career, maybe some of us woodworkers did to! worth considering , don't you think?
Old Steve here still hasn't told us how many years experience he has or how many tens of thousands of board foot of lumber he has dressed on a jointer, but you would take his advice; step back and think about that for a minute.

Steve, I just want to say what an wonderfully thoughtful and wise post this is. Several of the examples you cite were not known to me, and I learned new safety behaviors by reading about these hazards (which is proving your point: education is a better teacher than experience).

I can't believe anyone would argue with any of this.

[Greg Funk]

because the world is full of people who think reasonable safety measures are huge, unrealistic impositions.

And this is the crux of the argument. What's reasonable for you might not be reasonable for an experienced woodworker. No different than any other activity. I'm not going to take a young child riding a bike in the city where I go because they lack experience. I'm also not going to follow the same safety measures a child would need to in order to remain safe.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Listing a bunch of stupid things that people do that have nothing to do with the topic is simple trying to manipulate the conversation. Wall switches, Isocyanate, safety boots, welding, motor cycles...and the classic... seat belts Wow! amazing sh*t it's all just BS.

If you want to talk about shop safety, lets talk Facts about shop safety not BS.

I guess that you learned something during your career, maybe some of us woodworkers did to! worth considering , don't you think?
Old Steve here still hasn't told us how many years experience he has or how many tens of thousands of board foot of lumber he has dressed on a jointer, but you would take his advice; step back and think about that for a minute.

Mark, having seen some of your machinery restoration, I have quite a lot of respect for your work - it's work I know I don't have the skill to do, and I admire it. If you'd be willing to take the time to explain what you're finding disagreeable, I'm sure I'd be far from the only person interested in learning from you. From your replies, I'm not sure what your disagreement is.