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Thread: salad bowl finish

  1. #1

    salad bowl finish

    I just finished turning a set of salad bowls out of walnut for a family member. Wanting to be absolutely sure of a food safe finish, and also wanting a "natural" look, I finished them with a homemade mineral oil/beeswax finish (4:1 ratio. I know this is not a terribly durable finish so I plan to hand the bowls over with a jar of the oil/wax mixture for future repairs, but is there any thing to be gained by applying additional coats of the finish at this point? With the oil/wax on there now, it's not clear to me that another coat would actual sink into the wood enough to make a difference. Thought, anyone?

  2. #2
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    Additional coats will feel sticky to the hand. Neither of your materials ever cure.

  3. #3
    Best finish out there, as far as I am concerned is the walnut oil from The Doctor's Woodshop.

    robo hippy

  4. #4
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    BTW - The walnut oil finishes I am aware of are treated to address concerns about allergies. I use Mahoney's Oil Walnut. Walnut oil is a great looking natural finish and it's easy to use.

    From Mahoney's site:
    "The oil has been heat-treated to make the oil dry faster and to remove any possible allergens."

    From The Doctor's Woodshop:
    "Walnut allergy is elicited by the proteins in the nut, wood and leaves. The walnut oil I use is treated and filtered such that no protein is detectable by the most sensitive methods in my lab (mass spec and colorimetric). I can find no data on cross reactivity between nut allergens. I do not guarantee that there is not risk of allergy, but the risk is as small as I can make it."

    Apparently walnut allergies are also much rarer than peanut allergies.
    Last edited by Richard Dooling; 08-02-2022 at 4:58 PM.
    RD

  5. #5
    I tried one of the commercial walnut oil products once. After a week for curing I placed the bowl on a display shelf and a couple days later there was an oily ring on the shelf. Gave away the rest of the product,

  6. #6
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    Interesting. I've not had that problem but as I said, I've only used the Mahoney's.
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Stephan View Post
    I tried one of the commercial walnut oil products once. After a week for curing I placed the bowl on a display shelf and a couple days later there was an oily ring on the shelf. Gave away the rest of the product,
    RD

  7. #7
    In my experience there isn't much point to finishing a salad bowl that will actually be used. The only benefit is that is looks nice at first.

    Hand-washing with soap & water will remove any sort of wax or oil.

  8. #8
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    Olive oil applied on a daily basis (in the form of salad dressing) will keep the bowl in great shape. Avoid soap, a quick wipe with a damp sponge or rag will do the trick for cleaning.

    I also like the Mahoney's for a bowl that's going to be used.

  9. #9
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    I agree with others that Mineral Oil never cures, and as soon as you wash the bowl you wash off the mineral oil and wax. IMO both are a poor choice for a utility bowl. I've also tried Mahoney's and Doctors Woodshop walnut oil and found that they took forever to cure. Weeks later I'd pick up the bowl and still get oil residue on my fingers (I had a Maple bowl that believe it or not it took 6 months to cure). I don't want customers to get oil on their fingers every time they touch my bowls and I certainly don't want to leave a ring on their table. I know you can put it in the sun to help it cure but what a pain if you have a batch of bowls. Also beware that if you put it on a table outside the squirrels will chew on your bowl because of the Walnut oil! You can put a paper towel on the table and set your bowl on it, then check it after a day or two. The paper towel will show an oil ring if not cured.

    For these reasons I stopped using Walnut oil and now use either Danish Oil or Odie's Oil. Most of the bowls we use in our home have been finished with Danish Oil. We wash them in the sink with warm soapy water and towel dry or prop them against other dishes to drip dry overnight. I've maybe had to reapply finish once or twice to our most used bowls in 10-15 years (it's that durable). I had a Mahoneys walnut oil bowl that would look dry after only a couple of washings and I finally got tired of refinishing it so used Danish Oil the last time. Danish oil is dry to the touch overnight but takes longer to fully cure.

    I've only been using Odie's for a few years but so far those items are holding up well. With Odies you have to let the bowl sit for 3 days before use, with Danish Oil I wait a week or two for the smell to dissipate (manufacturers say wait a month before using a bowl finished with Danish Oil). So there are pros and cons to any finish.

    I took Mike Mahoney's 5-day Signature Class at Craft Supplies in 2010. Obviously there was a lot of discussion during class about finishes, and I talked to him in-depth about it. He wants any of his customers - even his 80 yr old grandmother - to be able to reapply finish when needed to one of his bowls. For ease of application that's why he uses Walnut oil. No skill is involved, just wipe on/off. He acknowledges that Danish Oil and some other finishes require more skill or time and he doesn't expect his customers to have that skill. When I got home from Mike's class I made wooden plates that we use every day and were finished with Danish Oil. These plates are washed in the sink with other dishes and since making them I've retreated them once with a new application of Danish Oil.

  10. #10
    My personal plate that I have used for 5 or more years was finished with the Doctor's oil. I haven't treated it since the original application. Yes, the walnut oils do take a bit of time to dry. UV light and some heat will speed up the process, but within a week, it should be done. As for olive oil, everyone used to say that it will go rancid on your bowls. Then I ran into a guy and that was all he put on his bowls and he had no problems. As near as I can tell, if your bowl does go rancid and smell, you can not get that out of the wood other than by burning it. As for the cause, I figure that any build up of food on the bowl will cause it to go sour. So, if your bowl feels kind of gooey around the edges, for some reason more common on edges than the bottom, then you need to hit it with soap and water and a plastic scrubby. That doesn't hurt the bowls at all. Most of the time I just rinse my bowl or plate off and use a rag or plastic scrubby. Put it in the dish rack to dry, or some times I will towel dry it.

    I had considered the Danish type oils for my bowls. I was chatting with a woman at a show who was sensitive to the driers in that type of finish. Supposedly when fully cured, all that is left is 'inert materials'. She said that was not totally true and she would react to it. That conversation kind of led me to the position of only wanting finishes on my bowls that I could eat straight out of the can. Not sure about Odie's oil, never heard of it. I have heard of using grape seed oil, which I have no clue about. If you use the walnut oils in the stores, I am fairly certain that they are also heat treated to break down the proteins that can cause allergic reactions, but the process can vary a lot from different manufacturers. Some of them will set up and cure, some won't.

    Never heard of squirrels eating wood bowls..... They might be after what ever foods had been eaten in the bowls rather than the walnut oil.

    Side note, I remember Mike saying that for his personal bowls, he doesn't put anything on them.

    robo hippy

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat Scott View Post
    For these reasons I stopped using Walnut oil and now use either Danish Oil or Odie's Oil. Most of the bowls we use in our home have been finished with Danish Oil.
    There must be a dozen products out there called "Danish oil" that range from varnish to BLO in composition. Which is the one you like?

    My experience with with Mahoney's walnut oil is quite different to yours. I wonder if it is a function of the wood you put it on? I have only used maple, cherry, and walnut and never seen any evidence of residual oil; the bowls are dry to the touch overnight and have never left a ring on anything. I do apply fairly sparingly and wipe off the surface thoroughly after a few minutes with a clean rag.

  12. #12
    When I oil up my bowls, I slop it on. If I could, I would have a vat and soak them for an hour or two. I will sand out another bowl and then after slopping oil on it, I will apply another coat to the previous one. I will let them sit for a day or three before I give them a wipe down. I think the biggest difference between the Mahoney and the Doc's oils are the 'microaggregated' carnuba wax that the Doc uses. He explained it once, but his wax goes on and flows evenly without needing heat or a solvent. I wish the Doc made a wax for my plane soles!

    robo hippy

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reed Gray View Post
    I was chatting with a woman at a show who was sensitive to the driers in that type of finish.
    Not sure about Odie's oil, never heard of it.
    If you use the walnut oils in the stores, I am fairly certain that they are also heat treated to break down the proteins that can cause allergic reactions, but the process can vary a lot from different manufacturers.
    Never heard of squirrels eating wood bowls..... They might be after what ever foods had been eaten in the bowls rather than the walnut oil.
    Side note, I remember Mike saying that for his personal bowls, he doesn't put anything on them.
    robo hippy
    I also have had several customers that were super sensitive to any type of finish. They know more about how they will react to certain finishes than I ever will, so in those cases I'd sell them a bare wood bowl and let them put their own finish on it which they were happy to do.

    Odie's Oil is worth checking out. I don't know what's in it as the manufacturer keeps that top secret, all I know is it's a blend of oils and waxes but I don't know what kind. Their website says the finish bonds with wood fibers, won't yellow, no solvents, is food safe, etc. It's used on wood flooring, leather, metal, all kinds of surfaces other than wood. Its pricey but a little goes a long way. A mistake often made is to use too much, you'd be surprised how little it takes to cover a bowl. If you wait 3 days after application like the directions say, water just beads up on the surface. I like their Super Penetrating or Super Duper as they are a thinner mixture and much easier to apply. I only do one coat, wipe on/wipe off. When I'm in a hurry this is the finish I use.

    I thought I read that Walnut Oil in the stores is not polymerized (heat treated)? The squirrel didn't eat the bowl, he gnawed on the edge. I had just finished making the bowl and set it on the patio table thinking the breeze would help the Walnut Oil cure. Maybe the squirrel was just licking the oil but his teeth got in the way!

    Agreed, Mike says he prefers no finish at all but he has to use something for the public. It's all marketing as it's easier to sell a bowl that looks pretty. When I took his class he still lived in Provo, and one day he invited the class to his house for lunch. We got to see his house, shop, wood collection, and eat pizza off his wooden plates. What a treat! Memories I'll never forget.


    Quote Originally Posted by roger wiegand View Post
    There must be a dozen products out there called "Danish oil" that range from varnish to BLO in composition. Which is the one you like?
    There's probably more than a dozen! Danish Oil is a broad term for a mixture of oil and varnish. Watco, Salad Bowl Finish, Waterlox, Arm-R-Seal, etc., are all Danish Oils. I make my own by mixing equal parts of gloss Poly, Tung Oil, and Mineral Spirits. I used to buy my finish and tried a bunch of brands before making my own. My favorite was Minwax Antique Oil because it didn't look plastic like some other finishes and the smell went away quicker than others.

  14. #14
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    My preferred "food safe" finish is paraffin. The stuff your granny put in the top of her jelly jars. You can find it at the local grocer. Put it on like you would beeswax: while spinning at enough rpm's to melt. Repeat until the wood is saturated. Go back with a small butane torch and touch up any cracks with more wax. Buff to a matte finish. Water will bead in the bowl now. I have an oak cutting board I finished 40 years ago with paraffin and it's almost like new (minus the knife marks).

  15. #15
    With the store walnut oils, I am fairly sure they are heat treated in some way. I do know some are pasteurized. I am guessing that the reason some will cure and some won't is because of the different ways they treat it. I did find some walnut oil in a art supply store once. It was used, along with linseed oil for the oil based paints.

    Would you happen to mean Osmo oil? I have seen that at a local hard wood and flooring supply store. I have heard a lot about it, but never tried it.

    robo hippy

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