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Thread: Consistent Domino Problem. Help!

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
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    Portland, OR
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul F Franklin View Post

    You could try doing a bunch of side grain to side grain joints and a bunch of end grain to end grain joints and see if/where the problem shows up.
    Paul is on to something here, I grabbed some soft maple scraps, 8/4, and did 4 mortises. 2 side grain, 2 end grain. Side to side grain matches perfectly. End to end grain matches perfectly. Side to end grain does not match up.

    I also made note that the end grain mortises were slightly loose, while the side grain mortises were a tight fit for the domino.

    Dan mentioned multiple passes, which is not the norm for me, so I went back and ran a few extra passes in each mortise. Every one ended up sloppy loose. I figured this was an unfair test, removing the machine and reboring, so I redid all four mortises with multiple passes, everything was slightly looser than a single pass, with only 1 mortise now out of place, a side grain.

    IMG_0074.jpgIMG_0075.jpg

  2. #17
    Possible your fence or baseplate is not flat?

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Millstone, NJ
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    1,590
    You are letting the bit do the cutting correct? My first mortise I cut I ended up pushing a little too hard and raised the domino of the work piece a bit. It made the mortise not square. afterwords I took my time and let the bit do the cutting.

  4. #19
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    Mar 2003
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    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    Quote Originally Posted by George Yetka View Post
    You are letting the bit do the cutting correct? My first mortise I cut I ended up pushing a little too hard and raised the domino of the work piece a bit. It made the mortise not square. afterwords I took my time and let the bit do the cutting.
    This is good advice...I was "shoving it in" when I first got my DF700 but learned that slow and steady was a lot more accurate. Holding the fence down on the material securely, pushing from the back and letting the cutter have time to penetrate, cut and evacuate the chips make for the most consistent cutting. Side grain and end grain place different stresses on the cutter, too, so slow and steady also helps with that.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Edmonton, Canada
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    Which domino model is it? 500 or 700? I've had both and proper holding/plunging technique can contribute to proper/improper fittings.
    Whenever I want absolutely perfect (like zero error) joint I use doweling jigs (e.g when wanted to join 48" wide pieces of plywood to get 60" wide) but still with domino you should be able to get near perfect joints. Here are some of the things that can contribute to poor joint:
    - plunging too fast, contributes to vibration (especially when doing end-grain, as it's more difficult to cut)
    - pressure on the fence should be solid
    - for plunging into very narrow boards (think end grain of a 2"x0.75" board) it's best to have a jig to hold the piece, sometimes I holed the piece against the fence with hand and actually plunge the piece/fence into the bit (instead of moving the machine).

  6. #21
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    Mar 2003
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    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    I'm going to add that the reason for the recommendations to gently push from the cord end of the Domino tool (regardless of which version) is that we can sometimes have a tendancy to slightly lift while "fully gripping" the tool. The same is true, honestly, with biscuit cutting machines, too, although there is often a little more wiggle room there because of the nature of the fastener. Domino tenons (and correspondingly dowels, too) that inadvertently have even a slight angle to the precisely fitted mortise can then produce a noticeable offset in material height of two pieces being joined. Care must be taken to insure that those mortises are cut without any up or down deflection because one's hand is physically exerting vertical pressure through the cut.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Lebanon, TN
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    I think I had similar issues. I made myself a little clamping jig that attaches to the miter slot on my tablesaw.

    I reference all my Domino cuts off the surface of my tables saw and the base of the 500, so the domino fence is not used for height setting. If I want my mortise a little higher on the side I put a spacer piece under the Domino base.


  8. #23
    dont have a domino but have had a lamello forever. At one point I bought a second one as it was not accurate bang on and the second was just the same Questioned answered first one worn out., I never clamped stuff didnt have the time as some work was production stuff. Its not practical but I can see it eliminating some possible error in the handling aspect. I never used the shoe you put on just worked face side down off the base of the machine. IF I needed to change placement for some reason then just put a shim under the machine or the work being lamelloed. If I had tons to do and really needed then id get an air piston triggered a foot pedal, done that for other jigs and its fast good.

    Error can be induced in different places. If I clamp the clamp hard on my mortise machine with a dial I can see I deflect it .003 to .005 so doing doors if too much force then the rail and style can be out of flush. Part of that is the design and had the clamp come off the back fence there would be no deflection.

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
    Location
    Portland, OR
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    Alright I think I may have identified the issue.

    Domino 500.

    The pin that holds the fence is sloppy the whole way across the machine. As a result, it doesn't consistently land at 90 degrees. It looks like 90, but I have to hold a square to it and clamp the fence in order to get it to perfect 90. It naturally goes to about 91 degrees if I don't back it up. I re-ran the test after clamping the fence with a square and sure enough, everything came out perfect.

    Anyone else having to mess with this on theirs?

    IMG_0078.jpg

  10. #25
    not at ALL. It should not be sloppy. I would contact Festool. I suspect they may help you.

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Northern Illinois
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    943
    No, there were no issues right out of the box for me. Everything was square and tight. I guess I probably have never checked the squareness of the fence but I've never had a problem either unless I've made the standard user mistakes - Domino resting on the table instead of the plate, not referncing the correct side of the board, sometimes plunging too fast, and not holding the tool securely enough so it moves while plunging. Otherwise, the result is generally perfect; so perfect, I rarely use anything but Domino loose tenon joints.

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Perth, Australia
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan Hall View Post
    Alright I think I may have identified the issue.

    Domino 500.

    The pin that holds the fence is sloppy the whole way across the machine. As a result, it doesn't consistently land at 90 degrees. It looks like 90, but I have to hold a square to it and clamp the fence in order to get it to perfect 90. It naturally goes to about 91 degrees if I don't back it up. I re-ran the test after clamping the fence with a square and sure enough, everything came out perfect.

    Anyone else having to mess with this on theirs?

    IMG_0078.jpg
    A work-around this would be to use the Seneca Domiplate.



    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  13. #28
    why do that and use it upside down when you can just set it on the base like I do with the lamello. Never used it once the proper way.

  14. #29
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    Feb 2004
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    Perth, Australia
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Lake View Post
    why do that and use it upside down when you can just set it on the base like I do with the lamello. Never used it once the proper way.
    Because you cannot always rest the machine on a flat surface in front of the workpiece.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  15. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Atlanta
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    1,592
    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Cohen View Post
    Because you cannot always rest the machine on a flat surface in front of the workpiece.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Great if all you do is edge work. The second you want mortise a face , the plate becomes a liability and takes more time to remove.

    To each , his own. Seneca has sold a lot of em.

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