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Thread: Bench vs Butt Chisels?

  1. #1
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    Bench vs Butt Chisels?

    I'm relatively new to chisel work but am getting more and more personal time in the shop and appreciate not using power tools for everything. I've started to get my hands on a few chisels and found that I greatly prefer the shorter length of a butt chisel, but want to ask if I should be getting general bench chisels over the others? As I develop skill and use them more, am I going to discover that the full lenth is beneficial? Or is this just a personal preference?

    Thanks for helping out with a simple question.

  2. #2
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    I too thought that I preferred butt chisels at first. They feel easier to handle (especially if you have cheaply made chisels to compare them to, which are often really handle heavy and unbalanced, in stark contrast to good chisels) at first, and are compact and fit nicely in a toolbox or tool roll.

    And, I still like butt chisels for their compactness.

    But, over the years I've really come to appreciate full sized bench and firmer chisels. That length is not only necessary for chopping deep holes (when you need one, you need one), but more importantly, it helps you to be much more precise and accurate.

    The longer your chisel, the more you will be able to feel when the chisel is not perfectly straight up and down. Any minor error in angle is multiplied over a greater distance, and you can feel it in the balance of the tool. The same goes for paring -- the longer the tool, the more noticeable any slight changes in angle are.

    The chisel, along with the plane, are the two tools in your toolbox capable of the greatest precision. No saw or hand drill can come close. So it's a very good thing to have long and well balanced chisels if you want to do good work. It's not necessary, of course -- you can do good work with Butt chisels, and I still use mine on occasion. But if I have a choice, I usually reach for the longer and more ergonomic chisel.

    You'll find longer chisels to be much more ergonomic if you get some with slender, light-weight wooden handles, not the large, bulky wooden handles on most low end chisels, and especially not the ultra heavy plastic and metal handles.

    When you are chopping straight down, hold the chisel like a pencil down near the cutting edge. When you are paring, hold the blade of the chisel as you would hold a fan (or pointing a knife with a thumb grip, or remote controller -- the thumb on the flat of the chisel and the index finger at a 90 degree angle underneath), and only as deep as the maximum depth of the cut, so your index finger acts as a "stop", both to keep you from going too far and ramming into the wall of a tenon or something, and also as a safety habit to stop the chisel should you slip and lose control. When you do this, you can easily feel minute changes in the angle of the tool over the greatest length.

    The same applies with saws, especially Japanese saws. Those handles are long for a reason! Hold them gently towards the end, and you have much, much more control over the angle and precision of the cut.
    Last edited by Luke Dupont; 04-21-2022 at 3:19 AM.

  3. #3
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    At some point you will find both useful. The same for long paring chisels. I use bench chisels most of the time and other types when it makes the task easier. The same thing applies with other tools, the work indicates the tool.
    Jim

  4. #4
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    You'll need a longer chisel from time to time, but otherwise if you like butt chisels use them. They're not "starter" chisels or "rookie" chisels. No shame in having them as your go-to.

  5. #5
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    Some may argue that Japanese oire nomi are short like butt chisels. Some Japanese videos show artisans with chisels that have been sharpened down to nubs, and they continue to work.

    Hand tools are very personal. What may be the best tool in the world for one, is not necessarily so for another. Use what feels right. It is the outcome that speaks for you.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  6. #6
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    The reason there is such a thing, and the reason they are called "Butt chisels" is for cutting the mortises for hinge butts on house door jambs in place. A bench chisel is too long to clean out the bottom of the upper hinge butt mortise, and the top of the lower butt mortise if you need to make a cut in line with the length of the jamb.

    I keep one Stanley no. 60 1-1/2" just for that purpose, and it's the only short chisel I want, or need.

    copied and pasted: Butt-hinge definition
    (carpentry) A kind of hinge used in hanging doors, lid, covers, etc.; so named because fastened on the edge of the door, which butts against the frame, stop molding, and casing, instead of on its face, like the strap hinge; also called butt.

    House door hinges are called hinge butts, or butt hinges.
    Last edited by Tom M King; 04-21-2022 at 12:38 PM.

  7. #7
    As everyone has said in one way or another, use what works for you.
    All I can add is that most Butt chisels are sharpened at a 30 degree bevel while bench chisels are more likely to be at 25 degrees. At least that my experience.
    This can influence which one you choose beyond it's physical length.

  8. #8
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    Having found many types of chisels useful is one reason there are many types of chisels in my shop.

    My butt chisels tend to be those found in the wild that have lost length over time. They are preferred for close work such as cutting hinge mortises.

    Longer bevel edged chisels are used for paring.

    Flat sided chisels are often used for clearing waste from dados and occasionally used for mortising if the mortise is a different size than one of my mortise chisels.

    As others have said, use what works for you. It doesn't matter what works for anyone else.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Weber View Post
    As everyone has said in one way or another, use what works for you.
    All I can add is that most Butt chisels are sharpened at a 30 degree bevel while bench chisels are more likely to be at 25 degrees. At least that my experience.
    This can influence which one you choose beyond it's physical length.
    All my bench chisels, Western and Japanese, are sharpened at 30-32 degrees. Only my paring chisels are sharpened at 25 degrees. The latter are never hit with a hammer.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Cohen View Post
    Some may argue that Japanese oire nomi are short like butt chisels. Some Japanese videos show artisans with chisels that have been sharpened down to nubs, and they continue to work.

    Hand tools are very personal. What may be the best tool in the world for one, is not necessarily so for another. Use what feels right. It is the outcome that speaks for you.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

    I've actually contemplated buying some of those oire-nomi that have been sharpened down to nubs! (Second hand, for cheap, of course)

    Precisely because I do sometimes want a really short and stubby chisel...

    The point of my post wasn't to say that butt chisels or bad or don't work, but rather to offer a contrasting opinion for the OP to consider what he really wants. I still do reach for my longer chisels when I want to be really sure that I'm chopping very accurately at 90 degrees, or when paring. They're also nice for paring downards using your shoulder.

    But I do like and use some pretty short oire-nomi too, and they work just fine. They were all I used until more recently when I bought some longer Japanese and Western chisels.

  11. #11
    What I hear a lot is I have X chisels but I use them while holding the blade, or the ferule. So one wonders what the deal is when in effect they prefer to use chisels that are a few inches long.

    I probably have 7 different lengths in multiple sets, stuff accumulates over the decades. I use the standard length bench chisels the most, assuming stuff in the cabinetmaking range And for the most part I would use about 4 sizes of the bench chisels.

    In lengths I have mini, bench, mortising, long bench, timber framing, Japanese push, timber framing struck chisels, timber framing slicks, and something with a shovel handle on it. Stuff can get out of hand.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom M King View Post
    The reason there is such a thing, and the reason they are called "Butt chisels" is for cutting the mortises for hinge butts on house door jambs in place. A bench chisel is too long to clean out the bottom of the upper hinge butt mortise, and the top of the lower butt mortise if you need to make a cut in line with the length of the jamb.

    I keep one Stanley no. 60 1-1/2" just for that purpose, and it's the only short chisel I want, or need.

    copied and pasted: Butt-hinge definition
    (carpentry) A kind of hinge used in hanging doors, lid, covers, etc.; so named because fastened on the edge of the door, which butts against the frame, stop molding, and casing, instead of on its face, like the strap hinge; also called butt.

    House door hinges are called hinge butts, or butt hinges.

    Interesting, I had not heard that before, thanks for posting that.

    ---------------------------------------------------------

    Though I can't seem myself stuck on a desert island if the only way to get off was to make that cut with a bench chisel. What does he do if the grain confounds that angle of approach. And it does not explain the sets of butt chisels, at least as far as I can see.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------

    The mini chisels I have are in a set of 10, but I own 2 classic plastic handled butt chisels largely because they carry nicely in my framing bag. I also use them with their file sharpenable steel to do dovetail demos in woods up to cherry where their lack of hardness is not a terrible limitation.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Luke Dupont View Post
    I still do reach for my longer chisels when I want to be really sure that I'm chopping very accurately at 90 degrees, or when paring. They're also nice for paring downards using your shoulder.
    That is a beginner concern, which may be just what the doctor ordered, But the vertical thing is not really an issue. As Franz Klausz used to say "if you are very beginner", you may want to draw a line for your saw to cut to for a square cut. Same here it isn't really tough to do. Not to mention that undercutting works for a lot of pros, and it could be half a degree, just not too much in the intruding direction. Plus a lot of the best chisels do not cut straight down. And a lot of the best users work off the bevel not the back for most of their cuts. And the handles on many chisels, including some I have seem that cost skiilsaw prices per chisel, are not on straight. And the handle when it is straight, is not like looking down a gun barrel, there are bulges and asymmetries. So I probably would not worry too much about.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roderick Gentry View Post
    That is a beginner concern, which may be just what the doctor ordered, But the vertical thing is not really an issue. As Franz Klausz used to say "if you are very beginner", you may want to draw a line for your saw to cut to for a square cut. Same here it isn't really tough to do. Not to mention that undercutting works for a lot of pros, and it could be half a degree, just not too much in the intruding direction. Plus a lot of the best chisels do not cut straight down. And a lot of the best users work off the bevel not the back for most of their cuts. And the handles on many chisels, including some I have seem that cost skiilsaw prices per chisel, are not on straight. And the handle when it is straight, is not like looking down a gun barrel, there are bulges and asymmetries. So I probably would not worry too much about.
    All true!

    The only bit I don't get is "And a lot of the best users work off the bevel not the back for most of their cuts." I'm curious to know what you mean, as I generally use bevel down for inside curves / convex work and long dados, etc., and flat down for flat work / convex ... Do you have any specific examples of what you mean?

  15. #15
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    As you push the chisel into the wood, if the bevel is up, the chisel may dig in. With the bevel down, you can control the cut so that does not occur. As the chisel digs into the wood, the bevel pushes the chisel opposite it, like when you cut mortises. I don't know about the best users, but you just need to know how the chisel will behave and position it to get the cut you want.
    Last edited by Rafael Herrera; 04-21-2022 at 10:21 PM.

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