Oneida High Vacuum Dust Collector

[Thomas Marr]

The dust collection topic is hard to discuss. There's a lot of variables and the "correct" answer is dependent on the installed duct work and machines. It's a chicken and egg problem...you don't know which DC you need until you build and measure the system. Yes, you can calculate things in advance, but a calculation is a guesstimate at best when dealing with fluid mechanics in a hypothetical setting. This is one reason the topic is so controversial. But, I have a question and need some advice.

One way to be "safe" is to buy the strongest DC you can afford (I realize this isn't always true, but let's assume it's true for my situation). I currently have the original ClearVue DC. I've never felt it provides the necessary dust control in my shop (verified by a Dylos monitor). I'm renovating the shop to add a CNC and will repurpose the ClearVue to another application. I bought the unit "new" but damaged from a shop going out of business for $150. So, it paid for itself several times over.

I was settled on the 5HP Dust Gorilla Pro with SmartBoost until I started looking at fan curves (let's ignore ClearVue options for this discussion). Assuming my static pressure is 11", the SmartBoost unit will provide around 700 CFM's. This is below the minimum recommended CFMs for a lot of tools. On the other hand, the 5HP Oneida with High Vacuum will deliver more than 1100 CFMs at the same static pressure. In fact, the High Vac unit will deliver much greater CFMs at ANY static pressure, compared to the 5HP with SmartBoost. Connect the High Vacuum unit to a 4" port and it will provide more CFMs than the SmartBoost unit (perhaps due to its significantly larger impellor).

At 11" SP, the High Vacuum unit delivers over 50% more CFM's than the SmartBoost unit for just over 11% more money. I know the $500 price difference is significant, but the performance difference is so extreme that it seems like a much more capable unit.

But I may be missing something. And I don't see any reviews on the High Vacuum unit, so I guess it isn't very popular (if anyone has this DC, please chime in). But, what am I missing? Why are people choosing the Smart Boost DC over the High Vacuum DC?

[Jim Becker]

Part of it may be how the HiVac is marketed. A lot of the sales for these higher end systems are not going to folks who hang out online in discussion forums, I suspect, too. Something that might be good is to launch the question directly to Oneida about why to choose one over the other. There may be details that are not evident from just the fan curves.

BTW, don't underestimate 700 "real" CFM and Oneida's numbers have held up well to independent testing historically, not that a lot of that happens out there with the general demise of many publications that used to do the testing.

[Thomas Marr]

Thank you Jim,

You could be correct about marketing, but both units are listed under their "professional" systems. Maybe the description "High Vacuum" is a bit confusing. But, in essence, this just means it performs well at all reasonable static pressures. Afterall, a DC is just a vacuum cleaner in the end (hint: tell your wife you're just buying a bigger vacuum cleaner for the shop...I worked in marketing too).

I did ask Oneida before I composed my post. I'm not sure it's appropriate to post their (his, the salesguy) response from a single call. Since the person I reached is in sales, I'm wanting a more neutral opinion as I have not researched this topic as much as many contributors here.

I guess the price difference between these units was greater in the past. Perhaps that's the issue.

[Andrew Seemann]

What equipment you have and how it is set up for dust collection comes into play as well, as does duct length size, etc. If your table saw or planer can only functionally use 300 cfm or 500 cfm, it won't matter that your dust collector can pull 1100 cfm or 11,000 cfm. Same thing with duct size. If your system is all 4" you can only draw so much air through it. After you get a certain amount of volume and static pressure through your ducts, the limiting factor is usually how well the machine captures dust. Increasing cfm and sp only helps so much after a point.

I've got a 3HP Oneida Dust Gorilla from about a dozen years ago plumbed up with 6" mains (max duct length ~40'), and some 4" & 5" drops and hoses. For me, the main limitation is how well the machines collect. For example, I don't have blade guard collection on my table saw, so even if my dust collector pulled a full atmosphere of vacuum, it still wouldn't stop the saw from throwing dust at me. The edge sander and combo sander have bad collection as well. No amount of cfm or sp would fix their bad designs. That said, the planer, jointer, drum sander, and even the homemade dust shroud on the SCMS actually work quite well.

The biggest improvement in dangerous dust abatement in my shop I have recently made is, ironically, getting a Festool vac and a Mirka Deros sander. I think most of the ~2.5 micron dust that hovered in the air and eventually settled out (only to be stirred back up when I moved something) was caused by my old random orbit sanders and inadequate downdraft table. I've noticed a marked reduction in the amount of settled fine dust in the shop since upgrading my ROS/vacuum setup.

[Dave Burson]

Thomas,
I have had the Oneida 5hp high vac unit for about 18 months. Love it!! I generally leave at least 3 gates open all the time, and whatever else I use is more than enough volume to handily pull all the dust. I got the single phase, so did not get the smart boost option, which was 3 phase. I think it shows the REAL CFM of that unit over 2000 cfm, and I'm guessing it's really more than that. I used to have the old 2 hp Oneida unit of 20 years ago, and this is another world's technoiogy here! Feel free to message me if you'd like more info.

[Jim Becker]

Afterall, a DC is just a vacuum cleaner in the end

It might seem like that, but...normally DC systems don't replay on "vacuum" (high static pressure)...they move volumes of air which in turn moves the material. These units from Oneida being discussed are starting to split that realm because of the realities of modern tools where shear air volume is a tougher row to hoe. A CNC machine is a good example. Outside of the really huge industrial machines, most of the CNCs in "general" production shops don't really support large drops to the cutting area and also have to have a "focused" collection of fast moving debris coming off the tooling. Being able to support higher static pressure hells increase the collection efficiency in these situations sine one really can't increase CFM the "normal" way by increasing the diameter of the collection source. My impression, without consulting with Oneida, is that the HiVac system just takes things further than the other unit. Which one is best for your shop probably needs to be discussed with the horse's mouth just to be sure as the advantages of HiVac in some situations just might be detrimental in others. Either one is a great system, however...I've been a happy Oneida customer, have owned two cyclones plus the current SDD in my temporary shop and I intend to get another from them for the new shop building unless I opt for the Harvey for some strange reason. (unlikely) They were very helpful when I was making previous decisions, too. (Both of the old cyclones are still in use in other shops...the 1.5hp at a friend's shop for many years now and the 2hp Gorilla at relatively local professional shop that a 'Creeker works at.

[Tom Bain]

I have the 5HP Dust Gorilla Pro (it’s been great, btw) … I looked at the High-Vac at the time, but it is taller than the Pro and would not fit within my ceiling height. I just mention that if you have any height restrictions.