Is there a market for basic cars, appliances,etc?

[dennis thompson]

I was reading the thread about the GE refrigerator which had a chip in the water filter that didn’t work. We all hear that the car makers can’t make cars because of a chip shortage. I have a washing machine with a menu I’ve never used. I have two cars , a 2015 Honda Pilot and a 2017 Nissan pickup, they both have buttons I’ve never used. I have tools for 20 years with variable speeds which I’ve never changed
How about a washing machine the has one button, on/off. Or a car sold with no options , one color , one engine,a/c, auto trans,, etc. ( now that I think of it, didn’t Henry Ford offer that)
is there a market for basic stuff, no bells or whistles?
( Maybe this question should be in the “ you know your getting old when” thread:

[Anthony Whitesell]

There is for me. If the computer manfuacturer stops supporting your computer it is because it is too old and technology has moved on. OK, fine. A computer costs what? $1k? When a car manufacturer stops supporting a part for your car what are you supposed to do? Buy another car? For what $20k? $30k? $68k? The $68k figure is listed for a reason. My truck is a 2016 Ford F350. It came with Ford Sync. On July 1, 2017 (yes, at most one year after it was built) Ford discontinued the Ford Sync service. I did not buy the truck in 2016 and new. I purchased it in 2018 used. So the fact that Ford discontinued the Sync service doesn't bother me. But what about the original owner and every other owner of 2016 Ford vehicles, they all just got a feature they paid good money for shut off with nothing they can do about it. I recently worked on a car where the brake line between the master cylinder and the ABS manifold rusted through. There are two lines. GM discontinued one but not the other. I ask service advisors and/or service techs at four different dealerships what they would do if I dropped the vehicle off and asked them to repair it. Two of them told me since the part were not available they would not be able to repair it. So yeah, for the smart people out there, there is a market for basic cars/appliances.

As far as I can tell, my car only needs to have a few things:
1. decent acceleration
2. good gas mileage
3. fog lights
4. cruise control
5. standard transmission
(6. sunroof would be nice)

They can keep all the rest of the "emmenties". I don't need ABS (I know how to actualy drive and not just make the car go down the road). I don't need TPMS. I don't need a built in GPS that I have to pay for updates or may break and cost tons of money to have repaired (smart phone + dash mount = GPS that I don't have to pay extra for current maps which I am gauranteed to be able to get). I don't need the extra expense of an automatic transmission. If the past 507k miles (257k on one car and 250k on this one), I have spent a whopping total of $7.95 of the transmission. That was because the CV boot joint died and I had to replace the axle (because they didn't make a repair boot that fit) and in doing so I lost a quart of gear oil which cost $7.95 to replace.

As for applicances. I fear the same and similar things to the OP reference (GE water filter chip). What if GE stops making the water filter? Then what? Buy another new fridge? Everyone is so worried about the amount of trash being created and the manufacturers are one cause of it. Perhaps the fridge has a design flaw and the water line is routed too close to the freezer and freezes shut so the water dispenser won't work (I know two people that bought similar model Whirlpool fridges that had the same problem). Convienent, but what if it breaks? What if they don't make the parts for it any more? Too bad they don't have you-pull-it yards for applicances (LOL). Someone local tried to start one for lawn equipment. I liked the idea, but it didn't last long.

These are valid things to consider during your major purcahses. So go basic and save yourself the headache in the long run.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

I am starting to think seriously about making myself a utilitarian electric vehicle. Either an old VW, Isuzu Pup or Chevy Luv conversion, or something bicycle based. Street legal is big a challenge. It needs to have wind and rain protection, carry one adult, a dog, and some tools. with a range of 30 miles and a speed of 20 MPH or more.
Mostly dreaming, and doing research.

[dennis thompson]

I am starting to think seriously about making myself a utilitarian electric vehicle. Either an old VW, Isuzu Pup or Chevy Luv conversion, or something bicycle based. Street legal is big a challenge. It needs to have wind and rain protection, carry one adult, a dog, and some tools. with a range of 30 miles and a speed of 20 MPH or more.
Mostly dreaming, and doing research.

The electrician who has done work for me is in the process of converting a Volkswagen Beetle to electric

[Dave Fritz]

My answer, sign me up, yes.

[Roger Feeley]

A repairman told us once that we should never let go of our washer and dryer. He said that we had the last of the fully electro-mechanical machines and that anything newer would have electronics. We moved and let the machines go with the house. We have compact machines now that are heavily electronic. We pay $7/mo each for extended warranties. We pay the same for our fridge and range. I used to scoff at extended warranties but I’m a believer now.

but count me in for a simpler car. My hope is that the electric ones will be simple.

[Maurice Mcmurry]

We searched thoroughly for a non digital gas range back in 2002 and it was hard to find back then. In many ways our technology has out-paced our common sense. Grandma's neighbor made himself an electric car when my mom was little. I think it is still in the museum in Corydon Iowa. Those electric VWs sure are neat!

[Maurice Mcmurry]

We searched thoroughly for a non digital gas range back in 2002 and it was hard to find back then. In many ways our technology has out-paced our common sense. Grandma's neighbor made himself an electric car when my mom was little. I think it is still in the museum in Corydon Iowa. Those electric VWs sure are neat!

Here is the car. Mom was a young lady (rather than little).

received_1445008685915801.jpg received_647988779599293.jpg

[Malcolm Schweizer]

I am starting to think seriously about making myself a utilitarian electric vehicle. Either an old VW, Isuzu Pup or Chevy Luv conversion, or something bicycle based. Street legal is big a challenge. It needs to have wind and rain protection, carry one adult, a dog, and some tools. with a range of 30 miles and a speed of 20 MPH or more.
Mostly dreaming, and doing research.

EV West makes kits for old school VW conversion to electric. Base price $7500
https://www.evwest.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=40

[Kev Williams]

I bought a 2004 chevy van back in 2015 for my wife's dad to drive around. Paid $1300 for it from a dealer. Dad failed the driving test (he was 88 at the time I think) so I got it back. Our son-in-law used it for nearly a year, a granddaughter used it for about 8 months, I've driven in between and ever since. I paid my cousin the mek-a-nick a couple hundred bucks to change the thermostat and fix a loose ABS wire. That's the extent of repair bills...

Had a bought something more in the mid $20k range, I'd have shelled out probably $380-ish a month for 6 years, or about $27,500.
Average gas prices in the last 2 years appear to be about $2.85 a gallon. Average now is around $4.50-ish, about $1.70 extra...
15,000 miles a year / 18 mpg = 833 gallons..
At $2.85 = $2375 per year
At $4.50 = $3750 per year
difference: $1375, / 12 months = $114.53 extra per month...
that's about 1/3 of a car payment

Now, think about how many cars get ONLY 18 mpg, and at that rate @ 15k miles yearly, even $115 a month doesn't sound that all that bad. (I know several people who are paying more than that in CC interest every month)

I just got my new electric equal-pay bill for the next 12 months, dropped $77 per month

All I'm driving at is, there are ways, aside from home-building a new vehicle, to whittle down the outgo

[Maurice Mcmurry]

EV West makes kits for old school VW conversion to electric. Base price $7500
https://www.evwest.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=40

Right On! Thanks. I just need to find a VW Thing, Or Karmann Ghia

[Scott Winners]

I will go with yes and no. I used to own, exclusively, first generation small block Chevy engines (1955-1992) in all my vehicles. It has been 30+ years since the kids at Jiffy Lube sent a stranger to my driveway with a carburetor problem, but I knew that engine family inside and out. In 2004 I bought a new GM vehicle with an LS1 (third generation) V8 in it. Within 20 miles of driving that car off the dealer lot I resolved to sell off all my old iron. And I did sell every bolt.

With the chips and the metallurgy and the ongoing engineering the Gen III motor was just a better all around motor. Port fuel injection. Factory stock that thing was a beast when I beat on it, but it could also do real good on gas when I was gentle with it.

On the other hand, I only buy two kinds of clothes. I have stuff that is dry clean only, and all the rest of my clothes can be washed in cold water on regular cycle and dried in the dryer on regular/hot. I only use the 50% and 100% power setting on my microwave oven. I am opposed to ice makers and water dispensers in refrigerators. But I am married. My washing machine has many settings, my microwave probably has enough processing power to land a space shuttle, and the darn filters for the water dispenser on my fridge are unspeakably expensive. But my wife is happy. Can't put a price on that.

I do like the back up camera in my current truck, it especially nice to see my hitch and the receiver for my boat trailer on the same screen, but there is plenty of things in my SR-5 trim level Tacoma I could do without.

[Ron Citerone]

Yes, within reason. I stated in another thread, I am philosophically opposed to ice makers, water at fridge door and garbage disposals. Most people think I’m crazy. I suspect on this forum many would agree that simpler is better in many ways.

I am all for progress, but marketing ploys that make things complicated to a fault are making things and our lives way more complicted than they need to be.

[Jim Becker]

Vehicle manufacturers often do offer "base" versions of many models, but there's limited demand for them. And even those really need to have current generation safety features which require some level of electronics. EVs will be "mechanically simpler", but obviously will be more complex electronically, even for base models.

There are basic appliances available. There's a limited market for them, too, and a lot of that goes into low-end apartments and in "builder special" packages that often get upgraded by the folks actually buying a home.

Personally, I like the bells and whistles...

[Andrew More]

I think the answer to this, like a lot of things, is it depends.

I can't help noticing how many people want a simplier car, but then ask for good gas mileage. We'll ignore the issues with the complexity built into the ICE engine itself, and point out that one of the uses for chips on cars is good gas mileage, so there are trade offs. Not so sure I'd want electric seat heaters.....

Also I have buttons on my 2016 car that I haven't used, starting with the trip tracker, and also the emergency blinkers.

The reason they're there is that it's easier to just include them, same with power windows, power breaks.

While it sound reasonable to have a "simplier" car for people who like that, the truth is that it's simplier for the manufacturer to build one model, or a couple of models that have more features and not have to track the additional skus. So simplier for whom? There's a reason why you can't get the "simplier" manual transmissions anymore, not enough demand. Also a lot of options that weren't standard have become so over time. Does anybody really want a car without a radio, ac, or an electric starter?

@Maurice - what you've described is a golf cart. No joke, look it up, they're relatively cheap, and in demand for the uses you're talking about.