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Thread: Relocating: South Dakota?

  1. #61
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    Black Hills of South Dakota
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    11
    Hello Michael,

    If you grew up in Montana, why forsake where you were raised? As someone raised in the Black Hills and now returned from the mid-Atlantic region for retirement life, I'd venture that the two states share many similarities. Montana's way more impressive by many measures. I'd also suggest more of the Treasure State has been discovered by big city folks with money - tons of it. But you have asked about South Dakota.

    Weather: Be prepared for "authentic" experiences across all seasons. Don't, like we did, forget about the wind. The truck-tipping zephyrs far out number days of calm or gentle breezes.

    Taxes: No income tax (whoopee, if that's your thing), but property taxes will grab your attention and wallet, harder than you might imagine. Sales tax is calculated for almost everything, 4.5 percent for the state and often another 2 percent for local needs, and higher yet for purchases related to tourism.

    Hunting/fishing: Better than some places in the High Plains region, but locals grumble that deer hunting isn't what is once was. Rural landowners are quickly catching on to offering experience-flavored hunts with posted land (the good stuff), guides, resort-style cabins, etc. Fishing opportunities are more abundant, likewise boating and even sailing (remember, it's windy) on the big reservoirs.

    Tourism: We're not quite there, but signs of "loving South Dakota to death" are starting to show. There's the bike rally in Sturgis, known as the world's biggest, noisy party/flea market/rock concert. If you're into burning hydrocarbons on two wheels (or three), then party on. Otherwise, join the locals who endure the crowds and possibly figure out some way to make a little (or a lot) of money by serving the visitors.

    Real estate: Others have already commented about this question. The Black Hills region and major population centers across the state, especially Sioux Falls, have been discovered. The bargains are gone. That said, if you can afford it, real estate agents have big portfolios of property with anything you could want. Just be prepared to pay. Shop carefully lest you buy your dream acreage in a beautiful place where zoning regulations (or lack thereof) might put you next door to current or future neighbors who think, act and behave in ways you find offensive. More affordable properties are out there, but be ready to move to a small town or rural place far out on the prairie.


    Bonus: Sawmill Creek is about woodworking. Since moving back home several years ago, I've filled our garage to bursting with affordable woodworking tools of all types that I've purchased at auctions. Good deals in this arena remain as the population of local woodworkers dwindles. If you are a skilled woodworker and want to remain in the workforce in South Dakota, bring your tools and your best game. As with many other parts of the country, craftspeople of all disciplines are in short supply. Whether you're a nailgun shooter who can frame houses or a skilled remodeler who isn't afraid of tackling complex projects for homeowners, there's plenty of opportunity. Don't forget to pack your long underwear and a warm hat.
    Last edited by Lee Schierer; 02-11-2022 at 8:01 AM. Reason: Removed political comment

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    711
    Thanks for the informative post David. Very helpful.

    A couple thoughts..... I love Montana. My father owned a road construction and logging company. We lived throughout the NW area (Whitefish/Kalispell/Seeley Lake). I have three sisters still living in Billings. I won't say never, but it's unlikely that I return to the state to live full time. I just don't want to deal with the winters anymore.

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    711
    Anyone have any personal experience on Maine's northern coastline? I have only drove this route once, many, many years ago. I remember it been a very pretty drive with a few small coastal fishing towns. We did not linger though..... I was surfing a couple of the online realtor websites and there are a few nice sized lots on the coast at what seems very reasonable price points. I was looking near the boarder town of Lepoc and south towards Belfast. I imagine the winters can get pretty harsh with winds off the Atlantic. Taxes are not all that appealing for the state either.

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    N CA
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    1,279
    I did a lot of business in Maine. I lived in MA, but 25 yrs of a lot of business to attend to in dealing with Mainer’s gave me a great appreciation of the country and its people. Yes, you can get hammered weather wise when a Nor’easter (low pressure) spins all that moisture off the Atlantic, but it is not that common. One or two per year…well unless the are three or four. Now you live in Alaska so it’s kinda silly to talk about isolation, but you are pretty remote up there Lubec way. Belfast area is terrific, but I imagine costs increase substantially as you move south from Lubec. Some crazy tides up Lubec way. Check out “Tides in the Bay of Fundy.” Very close to Atlantic Canada is a bonus. As I said before, sounds like you need a long term road trip to help you out in this decision.

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    65,685
    I can tell you that that part of Maine is truly beautiful. The downsides are "fart from everything" which could be an up-side from some folks. The weather can be pretty challenging sometimes because you have both "north" and "coastal".
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
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    Alaska
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    711
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Frederick View Post
    I did a lot of business in Maine. I lived in MA, but 25 yrs of a lot of business to attend to in dealing with Mainer’s gave me a great appreciation of the country and its people. Yes, you can get hammered weather wise when a Nor’easter (low pressure) spins all that moisture off the Atlantic, but it is not that common. One or two per year…well unless the are three or four. Now you live in Alaska so it’s kinda silly to talk about isolation, but you are pretty remote up there Lubec way. Belfast area is terrific, but I imagine costs increase substantially as you move south from Lubec. Some crazy tides up Lubec way. Check out “Tides in the Bay of Fundy.” Very close to Atlantic Canada is a bonus. As I said before, sounds like you need a long term road trip to help you out in this decision.
    Thanks Jack.

    To the point in bold, yes - I agree. Slight problem though. I have a job and need to be strategic with my vacation days. I will plan two or three trips this calendar year, scouting different areas of the country that has enough boxes checked for me to visit. Hence all the dumb questions.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Northern UT
    Posts
    762
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Drew View Post
    Thanks for the informative post David. Very helpful.

    A couple thoughts..... I love Montana. My father owned a road construction and logging company. We lived throughout the NW area (Whitefish/Kalispell/Seeley Lake). I have three sisters still living in Billings. I won't say never, but it's unlikely that I return to the state to live full time. I just don't want to deal with the winters anymore.
    Michael, the only thing keeping me from moving back to Montana is the winter.....OK and that four of my five kids live close in Utah. The winters can be, well difficult as you know. Yet the same applies, perhaps even worse, in SoDak. And while the wind blows in central MT, it blows worse in both N & S Dakota.

    Good luck finding a place.
    I am in love with Montana. For other states I have admiration, respect, recognition, even some affection, but with Montana it is love.... It seems to me that Montana is a great splash of grandeur....the mountains are the kind I would create if mountains were ever put on my agenda. Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans. Montana has a spell on me. It is grandeur and warmth. Of all the states it is my favorite and my love.

    John Steinbeck


  8. #68
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Alaska
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    711
    To update this and give a shout out to those who helped me with tips and comments, I did end up travelling in Maine this summer. We spent about 10 days on the coast the later part of May, first week of June. Started in Portland, and went north to Lubec. Stayed in Portland, Camden, Bar Harbor and Lubec on the way up the coast, and then in Belfast on the way back down. Stayed a night in Portsmouth NH on the return and visited friends who live there.

    Loved the state. Found a few properties overlooking tidal waters I could most definitely see myself building a house on. Portland was nice, kinda quirky, but it's not for me..... No point in saying why without getting political, so I'll just leave it at that. Too crowded as well. Really liked the town of Camden. Very quaint, clean, friendly. Bar Harbor is a nice town as well, but too touristy. Lots of old money in Bar Harbor too. Lubec and Eastport were both very pretty, and not as remote as I thought they would be. We drove around Bangor for a few hours, and did not see anything there to convince us to stay and hang out.

    Taxes in Maine are high though. Not sure if want to saddle myself with a home in a state that has as many taxes as Maine. I need to chew on this for a while.....

    My next trip in Tennessee and the surrounding states. I feel like I need to put an X in a few boxes before making any big moves. I did list my Colorado property though. Took about 20 days to get an earnest money check.

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
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    Longview WA
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    Taxes in Maine are high though. Not sure if want to saddle myself with a home in a state that has as many taxes as Maine.
    There are only seven states that do not have a personal income tax: Wyoming, Washington, Texas, South Dakota, Nevada, Florida and Alaska.

    There are five states without sales taxes: Alaska, Delaware, Montana, New Hampshire and Oregon. Some of these states may have taxes on some sales. If my memory is working Oregon has a Luxury tax on some items.

    Hawaii has the lowest property taxes. Many states in the south have low property taxes. I'd rather live in earthquake country than hurricane and tornado country.

    Wyoming may be the most "tax friendly" state for middle class folks.

    When the wife and I settled down we were more concerned with our local medical care than our taxes. I didn't realize Washington doesn't have a personal income tax until after moving here and filing taxes our first year. People often say they are being "taxed to death." Though most of them keep getting up and going to work or doing whatever else it is they do.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    324
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Koepke View Post
    There are only seven states that do not have a personal income tax: Wyoming, Washington, Texas, South Dakota, Nevada, Florida and Alaska.

    There are five states without sales taxes: Alaska, Delaware, Montana, New Hampshire and Oregon. Some of these states may have taxes on some sales. If my memory is working Oregon has a Luxury tax on some items.

    Hawaii has the lowest property taxes. Many states in the south have low property taxes. I'd rather live in earthquake country than hurricane and tornado country.

    jtk

    New Hampshire doesn't have personal income tax either.

    Ironically I grew up in Vancouver, WA and was about 5 minutes from I-5 and 10 minutes from I-205 once it was built so it was a quick jump across the river to Portland for no sales tax!

  11. #71
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    Sep 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Stiefel View Post
    New Hampshire doesn't have personal income tax either.

    Ironically I grew up in Vancouver, WA and was about 5 minutes from I-5 and 10 minutes from I-205 once it was built so it was a quick jump across the river to Portland for no sales tax!
    My information came from a Google search.

    Also from a Googles search New Hampshire may not have a tax on earned income. They do tax some income:

    New Hampshire has a flat 5.00 percent individual income tax rate which is levied only on interest and dividends income.
    That may be why they were not on the no personal income tax list.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  12. #72
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
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    Somewhere in the Land of Lincoln
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    2,546
    When you use only one factor to figure out where the lowest cost of living is found you get skewed results. Real estate or income taxes or personal property taxes alone don't give you the big picture. Here is a link that ranks states on an average for several categories. Notice Hawaii is dead last for affordable living. So much for low real estate taxes. I'm not putting this here as an argument, just that you need a broad based analysis of things and not a single point measurement.

    https://usabynumbers.com/states-rank...ost-of-living/

    Here is another index link that has about the same results.

    https://worldpopulationreview.com/st...index-by-state
    Last edited by Ronald Blue; 08-07-2022 at 4:43 PM. Reason: Added Link

  13. #73
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    65,685
    For the OP, Hawaii has a similar issue to Alaska where he lives now...almost everything has to be shipped in. Different climate, but similar challenge from a cost of living standpoint. But I suspect that the islands are not on his short list anyway.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  14. #74
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    711
    I actually was looking for land on the big island a few years back. Just couldn't find one in my budget that fit the criteria wouldn't compromise on.....

    One thing I did notice in Maine, and I suspect it's in all the east coast states, is the number of roads and villages. They are everywhere. Maine is considered rural, with a low population density, but it sure didn't feel that way to me. Probably due to spending the build of my life in the North West.

    I'm not only focusing on taxes. I realize that taxes are only a data point that needs to go into the formula. But, if I'm paying 20 mills on property taxes, another 6% sales tax on everything, and a 5% state income tax, the three combined cannot be ignored, even if the cost of living in lower.

  15. #75
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    SE PA - Central Bucks County
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    On the roads, it's true that even in rural and more undeveloped areas there are what appears to be more roads and towns compared to the great northwest. I think a lot of that is a "scale" thing...our "out in the sticks" is a much smaller area and there are also less natural geography features the intrude like say, the Rocky Mountains and other things do out west. There are definitely areas that are pretty "remote" here in the northeast, but it's a very different "remote" compared to some of those other places!

    And yes, true cost of living takes on many different factors, so that's all relative to comparisons. In the end, you'll likely pick the place that you actually "liked" the best, however, even if it's not the lowest cost of living...subjective things can overrule objective things for sure.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

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