[OP]
Member
Hello,
Has anyone bought/used one of the new stanley bailey planes that are being sold (made in Mexico)?
I was curious how they compared to a general, run-of-the mill vintage bailey #4 that would be bought on an auction site. I don't rust hunt (no time), so online auction/marketplace searching is really all I can do. It sounds like the new model's handles are a poor plastic, but I plan to put new ones on either way.
Thanks!
Contributor
Don't do it. Wait for a vintage. Trust me.
I have tried buying several newer "budget" versions of hand tools when the vintage were hard to find and they are a waste of time and money. The quality is not there, and you will likely spend just as much time tuning up a new budget plane as you will a vintage one. I haven't bought the Stanley no 4 but I tried the Irwin record no 4 and the Lowes kobalt no 4. Both are junk.
It doesn't say where you are located. If you are near Wisconsin I have a few no 4's I'm willing to part with, no charge.
+1. If looking for a new plane there are a few quality makers working today. Lee Valley and Lie Nielsen are common names around here; both high quality. Mainstream products aren't included in that list. Some folks have made the new Stanley or Woodriver tools workable but, if I have to put that kind of effort in I would just as soon do it to a 70+ year old product from Stanley, Millers Falls, Sargent or the ones made by the older quality names for Craftsman, Penncraft or Monkey Ward. The prices have really gone up on used planes but still offer a higher quality for a lower price than a lot of the 'new versions' of old standards. I would check the classifieds here and at other quality forums before the bay or the list sites.
Last edited by glenn bradley; 01-29-2022 at 9:31 AM.
"A hen is only an egg's way of making another egg".
– Samuel Butler
Contributor
If you are referring to the Stanleys with the black plastic handles, they are not meant to be comparable. They are what they call "contractor grade." Meaning, if you are trying to fit a door in a rough opening or shave down a bowed 2x4 before drywalling, it will work, but if you try and build furniture you will be miserable. The Stanleys that are supposed to be comparable are the "Sweetheart" ones. I think they only make a block, no. 4, and no. 62 LAJ. I have the no. 4 and it works fine, although I really dislike norris adjusters. I use my 36 transitional smoother about 75% of the time compared to the Sweetheart.
Contributor
Hi Justin, even in the vintage planes there are ones some feel should be avoided. My personal choice would be anything before 1929. After that was when a raised ring was added around the base of the knob. My preference is for a short knob. Other than that my next cutoff date would be 1933. That is when the ogee style frog was introduced. It may just be my luck, but this style of frog has not been as good for me as the older style frog used from 1907 through 1932. Though a type 9, 1902 to 1907 is also fine.
Type 10 Frog & Cap .jpg
This is actually an 'old style' frog on a type 10 #4 sold years ago. The face of the frog was lapped.
Recently a type 16 was purchased and it has been a bit of a stinker trying to tune up to a good user. It may get a frog transplant to see if that works any better.
jtk
Last edited by Jim Koepke; 01-29-2022 at 1:43 PM.
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
Contributor
Lots of plane bias going on here.....by some who never even had one of the "New & Improved" Stanleys....
Have seen the new ones...don't like that style of adjuster...would buy a new one from Sabo Ind of India planes...before I'd buy the new Stanleys....
Right now, I am well stocked up with Stanleys (T-11 to T-19) and Millers Falls planes....to worry about a New & Improved Stanley....
Maybe look up Rex Krueger's videos...as he did a very long series about choosing hand planes..AND..even a review of those Made in India planes....
Hmmm, as a certain Major Hogan said about Sharpe sitting around in the Officer's Mess..." Being "snobbed" by Snobs". Plus, everytime someone asks a plane to buy question around here, there seems to be someone trying to be a Salesman for 2 certain brand names.....no matter what the OP's budget..you'd think they get a commission for such a sale...
Last edited by steven c newman; 01-29-2022 at 1:17 PM.
A Planer? I'm the Planer, and this is what I use
Contributor
I bought a new Stanley no. 4 from Homedepot to try. It didn't take a lot of effort to get the sole flat, the iron sharpened and the chipbreaker setup to use it as a smoother. The plane is a little larger than a vintage one, the mouth is wider. The casting and machining are not as refined. I removed the frog adjustment screw since it was causing the frog to misalign, but it's not an essential part. The conclusion is that it works as well as a vintage plane.
Compared to a vintage Stanley plane. The fine fitting of the frog is noticeable in the vintage plane. However, given the forgiving nature of this plane design, it does not make the new one fail.
20220129_134058.jpg20220129_134151.jpg20220129_134230.jpg
The plane has been sitting on the shelf for a while, but it was still setup. Here's a piece of hardwood, still in its raw milled state.
20220129_134427.jpg
Planed smooth (board was flipped so as to plane with the grain), clean glossy surface. Showing some of the shavings from the final passes.
20220129_135120.jpg20220129_135130.jpg
Last edited by Rafael Herrera; 01-29-2022 at 2:23 PM.
Contributor
Some of us have actually written about our plane biases many times > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread....ne-information < This is just general information. Some of the links have broken over the years. There is a good link to Record planes.Originally Posted by steven c newman
In this link > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?116419 < Planes and a Few Things to Look For, My preference (bias) is stated a few times:
Of course this was posted more than a decade ago. Only a few non-Stanley planes have been purchased and rehabbed since then.Most of this is personal preference. My experience is with Stanley/Bailey planes. There are many other fine planes available, I am not very familiar with them.
Much of my life before retirement was usually spent in a less than steller financial situation. This led me to purchase my tools at the lowest possible prices. This called for getting up early and going to estate sales, flea markets, yard sales and any other place one could make a deal to save some money.
There are many other folks who may have worked twice the hours as me and spent a lot of hours at time and a half or even double time. It was rare, but on one special circumstance day my hours were paid triple time.
Other folks who spent a lot of time at work and didn't have time to spend in the shop felt it was a better option to pay up for something that would work right out of the box. Hence the recommendation of Lee Valley (LV) or Lie-Nielsen (LN) as sources for instant gratification.
One merchant, not to be named, tried to copy LN's castings and foist them off on the public. My recollection is it took them a few redesigns to produce a product that wouldn't get shipped back right after it was delivered.
Both of these companies make excellent tools. There are a few in my shop. Mostly my preference is for the appearance of the Stanley/Bailey plane. The flat top Bedrock (LN) doesn't appeal to me. The sleek look of the Veritas Planes is nice, but not for me.
Those design features do not give me any reason to be upset about others who do prefer them or do not want to spend time working with metal.
Much was learned from fixing up old planes and the story of restoring one was shared > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?114373 < This and other useful posts are archived at > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?103805 > Neanderthal wisdom FAQs
There was a time when fixing up old planes was a way for earning extra money to buy newer tools. Things like a #62 Low Angle Jack Plane and a new 14" bandsaw.
Though looking back there is some times a bit of seller's remorse. This type 10 #4 is one of those:
Attachment 472653
The type 10 only has two patent dates even though some folks are in error saying the only difference is the marking on the blade.
jtk
Last edited by Jim Koepke; 01-29-2022 at 2:31 PM.
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)
Contributor
Around me. you can pick up a vintage #4 for half that if you add the Home Depot sales tax.
[OP]
Member
Thanks for all the replies!
I guess I should have been more forthcoming with info on the original post. I do have a pretty good set of nice planes, but was looking for one I could take to wood that could hurt my other planes (pretty sure there would be a grown man crying), but not one that would lose setting in the cut and cause more work later on.
The one at HD had caught my eye for the bailey pattern adjustments I like, but if the blade wouldn't stay set during the cut it would be a no-go.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
