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Thread: What am I missing? 12" Jointers

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Doylestown, PA
    Posts
    6,926
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Jenness View Post
    I operate on the principal of not crosscutting unless and until I have to. I can glue rips together but once the crosscuts are made, that's it. If I can flatten a full length 8' or 10' board or rip I will do it and leave my options open, so a long bed jointer (mine is about 84" overall) is helpful.
    True as long as the board isn't bowed. Early on, I had a bowed poplar board and a shiny new Jointer/planer. I got the board flat but by the time I was done the center was 3/4" thick the ends were 3/8" thick. Oops. Lesson learned and didn't cost much at all.

    As far as jointer bed length and max board length, a rule of thumb I've seen is the board no more than 1.5 X to 2 X bed length. My Jet JJP has a 55" overall jointer bed length. Using the rule of thumb my max board length would be 82" (1.5X) to 110" (2X). For me, 7' is plenty without auxiliary support. I don't do large projects so that works for me. If I routinely did dining tables, entry doors and beds I'd probably think differently.
    Last edited by Curt Harms; 01-02-2022 at 9:51 AM.

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Curt Harms View Post
    True as long as the board isn't bowed.
    Or twisted or crooked. When blocking out parts I typically cut off checked ends, rip to rough width, then decide whether I can get the target dimension from each rip once flattened. I will crossscut at that point if necessary. Occasionally a piece will go wild or show some other defect after milling - leaving everything as long as possible gives options for substitution.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2021
    Location
    Southwest WI
    Posts
    245
    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Fulks View Post
    Mitch, Iím not a fan of SCM stuff either, but many find them a good value. I like the old stuff. One thing that doesnít get mentioned much
    is the old machines will take off 3/4 ď in one pass. Some will take off a whole inch. How do you know a good one? It doesnít look like
    itís been used as an anvil. I like 2 knife or 3 knife Ö.4 knife is too slow.
    I'm have nothing against the old machines but for me I prefer to buy new or lightly used. I don't have the time or desire to restore old iron. I much prefer to just use the tools. My newer powermatic jointer will take as heavy of a cut as I would ever want to. It will go to 3/4. The most i have taken off is 3/8 at about 6" wide or 1/4" at about 13" wide both these were pretty easy cuts. I really can't ever see a 3/4 cut on a joint unless you are using it to make a rabbit.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Selzer View Post
    Mel, what makes a 4 knife slower?
    Thanks
    Ron
    Same thing that makes an 80 tooth circular saw cut slower than a 20 tooth

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch schiffer View Post
    I'm have nothing against the old machines but for me I prefer to buy new or lightly used. I don't have the time or desire to restore old iron. I much prefer to just use the tools. My newer powermatic jointer will take as heavy of a cut as I would ever want to. It will go to 3/4. The most i have taken off is 3/8 at about 6" wide or 1/4" at about 13" wide both these were pretty easy cuts. I really can't ever see a 3/4 cut on a joint unless you are using it to make a rabbit.
    Deep cuts are useful for “straight lining” edges and removing sap wood. I can work alone and straight line on a jointer faster than many
    two man crews using a straight-line saw

  6. #36
    the rule of thumb for the jointer is dont put your thumb in the jointer. Good I didnt read the internet or there was work that would not have got done.
    Last edited by Warren Lake; 01-02-2022 at 4:22 PM.

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch schiffer View Post
    I did look up the scm mini max 16 inch combo it is about half the weight and has about 40 percent less hp then the grizzly, laguna, or powermatic stand alone. Scm does look like they make a heavy duty model but that is still 500# less and the hp wasn't listed. I didn't see the specs or price on Felder just a marketing page. Maybe I'm missing something too. I'm not sure.
    There are a few differences to consider. They're not apple to apple comparisons. The Hammer I have has one motor, for both the jointer & planer. The motor is European, which is to say 50hz 220v vs 60 he. Of you wanted a 5hp Felder, I think they need a 3 phase power or a variable speed drive converter (I don't recall the term). There is less cast iron, as the tables lift to access the planer function.

    A more accurate comparison would be the aforementioned Felder AD741 or AD941. They have powered lift tables, so you just set your planer depth, say 4" Ļ⁵/Ļ⁶ and then press a button & it automatically sets your tables for that cut. But then your in the land of buying two separate machines, a 20" jointer & a 20" planer.

    My 16" Hammer has a long enough bed for almost all my work. But a couple months ago, I was jointing an 8/4 by 10"x6', which was too heavy to move easily (I'm partly disabled). I just added my extension tables, which added about 12" to each side of the jointer bed and took about 1 minute to put on.

    I had the Jet 12" J/P HH and it was a nice machine. It took up about the same space as the 6" jointer (about 6" wider) I had about 20 yrs ago. I'm in a smaller 2 car garage now, so I prefer the combo machine.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    SE PA - Central Bucks County
    Posts
    60,614
    Rod, I believe that Euro machines intended for and delivered to North America through normal distribution channels come with 60hz motors in most cases, but I could be incorrect on that.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Central WI
    Posts
    5,667
    One of the misconceptions about old iron is that you need to spend lots of time rehabbing. An old cast iron jointer with flat tables and a big heavy fence that is running when you buy it, will likely need less work to keep in adjustment and operating than a newer machine. 10K for a decent level new vs 3-4K for a plug and play Oliver 166 or equivalent and same amount of work. I just sold a very nice 166 for 3500 and it will still be alive after the new machines ( and I ) are long dead. Dave

  10. #40
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Alberta
    Posts
    2,149
    A couple years ago I was looking for a 12'' jointer. I found a Cantek that the owner wanted 3500 for. I kept looking and about 2 weeks later found the machine I now use ,it is a Paoloni 16'' with 89'' bed length. I paid 2400 for it. Al this machine needed was a guard. I played around with how to make one and eventually welded one up from steel with a section of heavy 10''' diameter plastic pipe as my bridge guard. I have 2400 in this machine.

  11. #41
    A bit more feedback from another voice that has several older machines in service in my small full time shop...I bought a very nice condition, fully functioning 1940 Oliver 166 BD (12Ē) with Terminus head that needed absolutely nothing except a VFD in my case at the time. This was 3-4 years ago and it cost me $1250 for the jointer. Granted the shop that was selling it needed it gone by a specific time and was running out of time and was asking twice that price in their ad, but I didnít know that and offered what I could afford at the time and somehow ended up with the machine which will be in my shop forever unless I stumble into a larger jointer of equal quality for a good deal. The jointer has lived an entire human lifetime thus far and may outlive me, and I am fairly young.

    You donít have to spend $5k + and wait months for a machine from Taiwan or Europe as the only option. The old iron option does typically require some common sense and willingness to learn about how to properly move them and power them if 3 phase, but itís not rocket science and typically a fairly small hurdle to learn how to jump for the quality payoff at the end. Itís not for everybody, but often times you would have to spend ~10x the amount of their purchase price range to acquire a new machine of equivalent quality.
    Still waters run deep.

  12. #42
    Jim, you're correct. 60hz in US market.

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