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Thread: Rubio Monocoat - The answer to your finishing prayers?

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Weber View Post
    Is this the first hard wax oil type product you've used?
    Just wondering if you had already used something like Fiddes or similar to compare it to in terms of durability.
    https://fiddes-usa.com/shop/floor-fi.../hard-wax-oil/
    First one, so I only can compare it to traditional finishes.

    john

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamie Buxton View Post
    Rubio has a big collection of stains. Final sanding at 150 might be to leave lots of scratches for the pigment particles to lodge in.
    Maybe, but their instructions are the same for all versions.

    So here's something you might find interesting. A friend stopped by this afternoon and I showed him the stereo cabinet I used the RM on. He ran his hand over it and said "Wow, that's smooth.". I then started comparing it to my collection of finish samples. Rubio has the about the same tactile feel as several projects I've finished with Arm-R-Seal satin. When I use ARS satin I sand to 150 grit, apply dye or stain, or not, and then 3 or 4 wiped on coats of finish. After all that it feels very much like one coat of Rubio, and is only slightly higher in sheen.

    John

  3. #18
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    That sounds promising, John...and it's also a big time saver, too, when a matte finish is the look looked for! (And I happen to like that look, personally)
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  4. #19
    Blacktail studio who has used RM extensively sands to 180. Also, RM does not recommend Mineral Spirits, use Acetone instead.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by John TenEyck View Post
    No, it won't make it any smoother. As I mentioned earlier, I created a repair spot on my sample board where I sanded that area with 325 grit sandpaper. It felt decidedly smoother on that section after I applied the second coat. To Ed's question about sheen, however, it made no difference.

    I have not yet tried making a new sample that I sand to 325 or even higher grit. I'm sure it will feel smooth, the repair on the first sample proved that. What I'm most interested in seeing is if the durability drops off. Guess I'll go make another sample.

    John
    Kraft paper smooths finishes that are a little rough with dust nibs. Would that work on the finishes like Rubio or Osmo?
    Rustic? Well, no. That was not my intention!

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by John TenEyck View Post
    Rubio makes a big point of telling you to clean the wood before applying the finish. Vacuum then wipe the surface with their cleaner (or mineral spirits). If you do that there will be no dust, and no slurry. You see the grain clearly but since Rubio is very much a matte sheen you will not get the depth of a high gloss finish. On the left side of the closeup photo above there is some curly grain in the walnut. Under the Rubio it's not nearly as noticeable as it would be had I used a higher gloss finish.

    I saw on Osmo's website that they offer a gloss sheen in addition to the matte version. That may be something you should look into if you want more depth to the finish. I wasn't concerned about it with this project but I'm sure I will be in the future.

    John
    The local hardwood supplier here has the different osmo sheens up on display. It's a barely noticeable difference in their and my opinion. Add the small amount of VOC content in, plus the need for a second coat and I'm not sure it's worth it. (I've been using osmo exclusively for about a year, switching to rubio for 2022 and will decide one way or another for 2023 I expect).

    Someone else mentioned Cam at Blacktail Studio who does most everything with rubio. He seems to get a nice sheen out of a 3 coat process if I remember correctly? He points out that it's against rubios recommendation and details it all on his youtube page.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Utterback View Post
    Kraft paper smooths finishes that are a little rough with dust nibs. Would that work on the finishes like Rubio or Osmo?
    I doubt it Dave. There aren't any nibs to deal with. And the word smooth means different things to different people. As I said at some point in this string a friend ran his hand over the stereo cabinet surface and said it felt oh so smooth. It also depends upon what wood you apply it to. The Baltic birch plywood feels much smoother to me than the walnut, yet both had been sanded to the same grit. Why? Walnut has much larger pores than birch.

    Regardless of the grit you sand to Rubio leaves a level, dust and nib free surface.

    John

  8. #23
    If 150 grit is supposed to be the limit then I wonder how well RM and other hardwax oils adhere to a surface finished with a smoothing plane rather than sanded.

  9. #24
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    Rubio bonds just fine to hand planed wood. I’ve used it on walnut,eucalyptus maple all finished with a blade no grinding with rocks glued to paper. It goes deep into the pores much further then I expected.
    Last edited by Andrew Hughes; 12-01-2021 at 5:07 PM.
    Aj

  10. #25
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    My first try with Rubio after a month or so I started noticing the end grain actually pulling a little in. This went on in 2 coats as there were a few spots that looked dry after it dried. I had used Osmo a bunch on epoxy boards and coasters but found this very easy for the size of the table. It basically took down the entirety of the smaller sized Rubio set. My niece makes a mess with food and crayons on this thing and have had 0 issues

    20211201_165831.jpg20211201_165841.jpg20211201_165849.jpg

  11. #26
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    John,

    thanks for taking the time to do some tests and start the thread. I resisted Rubio for a long time, due to my inherent distrust of social media and its marketing. The various platforms push Rubio/Osmo and Sawstop A LOT. An overwhelming amount, in fact. However, it looked easy to apply and the no VOCs is an enormous benefit. I went ahead and ponied up for the 1.3 Liter of 2c, wood cleaner, and the maintenance oil. Ive since used it on two walnut islands that were 3x8, 12 walnut stairtreads, a walnut desktop and base, walnut monitor stand, and a walnut kitchen island with inset doors. On large horizontal surfaces, the application is killer. It is beyond easy, you save time on sanding to 150 versus my normal 320, and buffing it on with a white scotchbrite on a ROS sander is very simple. When its fresh, it looks great. The next day it dulls a bit, and frankly, looks like it needs another coat. I think the youtuber might be onto something with multiple coats on walnut. I read several comments from floor finishers that use multiple coats of Rubio on certain species. Walnut being one of those species. A coat of the maintenance oil over top of the 2c definitely helps with the depth of the wood and taking away the 'dry' walnut look. On more intricate projects like five piece cabinet doors etc, i found applying it with a white scotchbrite to be a little tedious. In those instances id rather go full throttle with a spray gun and be done in 20 seconds.

    Good to hear it protects well. For me, its a really fast/easy/safe finish that doesnt look as good as my old work sanded to 320 and finished with the previous formula of General Finishes Endurovar. It doesnt feel as smooth either. I assume its not as bombproof either. I understand the reason for not sanding past 150, but anyone that has sanded anything knows the wood really starts to gain clarity and depth at 220-320. I have a festool etc 150/3 and it leaves a swirl less finish at 150, but its not as good as 220+. That is my take on the finish, which is sorta what i expected at the onset. Not a disappointment, but not a panacea either. Lastly, my take on the price of it is its not more expensive than a quality film finish. Endurovar II is $115 a gallon or so now, and this 1.3 liters of 2c has definitely lasted more than a gallon of poly. Everything i mentioned above has only used roughly half of the 1.3 liter 2c.

  12. #27
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    Thanks for your post, Patrick. Good to see that the Maintenance Oil helps improve the look.

    As you said, the EnduroVar is no longer the EnduroVar many of us counted on for nearly bulletproof performance. I say nearly, because it can be damaged by nothing more than hot/cold tea if you leave it on the surface long enough, as my friend found out after finding a leaky teapot several hours later, on his now not quite so beautiful mahogany dining table. We've discussed trying to repair the damaged area and using RM to refinish the top if the repair is unsuccessful.

    The best performing film finish I've used lately is EM-8000CV. It takes a month to really cure, however, and the color leaves something to be desired on English walnut w/o dying the piece first. Prashun showed a beautiful white oak table a few months ago done with EM-8000CV. I don't think he dyed it first either but can't remember with certainty. EM-8000CV is at least as durable as the old EnduroVar, so that's something to consider if you are looking for a film finish.

    John

  13. #28
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    I have a 4x9 ft curly maple island top in my kitchen that is nearing time for a refresh. In the past I've applied either tung or walnut oil to it. It gets lots of stuff spilled on it as the primary food prep surface in the kitchen, and wiped down with damp sponges many times a day. We don't cut directly on it. The tung/walnut oil finish doesn't particularly hold up to that treatment, quickly becoming dull and blotchy, and lots of things stain the surface.

    I'm intrigued by using something more resilient as a finish; I don't want a film finish on this working surface, I'm sure that would quickly look terrible. Do you think Rubio would be a good bet to try in this application?

  14. #29
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    Rubio sure looked awesome on the Birdseye maple specimen I applied it to in the other post on sheen. Take a look. My belief at this point is that it has the better protection than any of the in-the-wood finishes we used to use.

    John

  15. #30
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    I haven’t used Rubio but recently used Osmo PolyX for the first time on a large project and was really happy with how it turned out. I do think the hard wax-oil finishes have some serious advantages over more “traditional” finishes. Namely (1) ease of application and (2) repairability. Personally, I also think the wax content gives them a really nice feel to the hand. I did a little sample testing with Osmo before embarking on the full project. Water had no effect (left on overnight), however, red wine (also left on overnight) did leave some discoloration. I just lightly sanded and put on another coat over the discolored section and voila it’s completely repaired and unnoticeable.
    There is a very fine line between “hobby” and “mental illness.” - Dave Barry

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