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Thread: Air Dried Black Walnut

  1. #1
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    Air Dried Black Walnut

    A friend of mine, who lives in another state, was given a pick-up load of walnut.
    What is a good finishing schedule to use for furniture and turnings?
    I have read that orange dye is often used in the schedule.

    Thank you

  2. #2
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    i think it is orange shellac, but perhaps dye too?

  3. #3
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    Tung oil is one we like

  4. #4
    Orange shellac on walnut does look nice. Straight Sealcoat is good too. I tend to like an amber or orange finish on walnut to give it a more warm look. Some people like colorless finishes such as water base on walnut because they don't warm up the wood, but I don't care for that myself. Others like oil on walnut, I generally don't like oils as a finish, but it is just the thing for some folks.

    I'd go a coat or two of sealcoat with a couple coats of oil based poly on top, or else with a few coats of orange shellac if more protection isn't required. Again, that is just my preference.

    One thing to remember with walnut is that it will lighten with age, the exact opposite of cherry and maple. When you first finish it, the wood will be as dark as it will ever be (the finish could darken with age though, especially an oil).
    Last edited by Andrew Seemann; 11-19-2021 at 12:47 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Thompson View Post
    ...A friend of mine, who lives in another state, was given a pick-up load of walnut.
    What is a good finishing schedule to use for furniture and turnings?...
    I'm a fan of "danish" oil, in fact that's about all I use on walnut. It's not quick: wipe on/wipe off/dry overnight/repeat, 6-10 coats.

    I like the soft sheen, celebrates the distinctive texture (pores) of walnut, protects well I think.

    BOC_E_IMG_7162.jpg BOC_E_IMG_7171.jpg english_walnut_box.jpg

    acorn_ornament.jpg pencil_holder_IMG_7411.jpg penta_plate_walnut_IMG_46.jpg

    JKJ

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by John K Jordan View Post
    Just gorgeous! Hard to believe that is just Danish oil for finish.
    Brian

    "Any intelligent fool can make things bigger or more complicated...it takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." - E.F. Schumacher

  7. #7
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    Thanks, I think the oil brings out the wild figure nicely! I took that one to a friend in Italy. I am fortunate to have more of that wood, I really should make another one…

    Years ago I went to a stranger’s house to get a couple of old office desk giveaways and got to talking with the guy about wiodturning. He was moving out of state that weekend and gave me a bunch of wood he didn’t have room to take. This was from one of three thick slabs he thought his dad had acquired perhaps 40 years earlier! I thought long and hard before cutting into those since I didn’t want to waste any.

  8. #8
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    Oil, wax free shellac and then waterborne top coat is what I normally use. I do not ever put dye on air dried walnut...it's too beautiful with the rich colors in my eyes.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  9. #9
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    +1 on a real Tung oil product, like Sutherland and Wells. Very beautiful on Walnut.

  10. #10
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    I have been using 1/3 spar varnish, 1/3 boiled linseed oil (tung oil is an acceptable alternative) and 1/3 turpentine with a bit of Japan drier mixed in a jar for years on darker woods and think it looks nice and also protects well.

    The spar varnish dries slow and leaves a more flexible finish. A regular oil based varnish gives a bit harder not as flexible finish. It depends on what the project is and how much it will be handled.

    I agree with Jim, the reason to use dark wood is so you don't have to color it. It looks great natural.
    Last edited by Michael Schuch; 11-19-2021 at 1:31 PM.

  11. #11
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    The interesting thing about walnut, Michael, is that it tends to start of dark, but unlike cherry, it often gets more and more golden brown with age. I have a few pieces I've made (generally natural edge slabs) that have stayed darker, but much of the rest got noticeably lighter over time.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Schuch View Post
    I have been using 1/3 spar varnish, 1/3 boiled linseed oil (tung oil is an acceptable alternative) and 1/3 turpentine with a bit of Japan drier ...
    That's basically of several recipes I've seen for what is sometimes called "danish" oil, basically equal parts of some kind of polymerizing oil, varnish with resins, and solvent. Sometimes the varnish is spar, sometimes, poly, etc. I've used BLO and other oils. Solvent: turpentine, mineral spirits, etc. I haven't used the drier myself but might be worth trying.

    How much is a "bit" of Japan drier? Say in a pint of mixture would you use a few drops, a teaspoon, more?

    This typical recipe with variations has made me wonder: since one definition of varnish is "a combination of a drying oil, a resin, and a thinner or solvent plus a metal drier to accelerate the drying", does mixing with oil and solvent effectively just dilute the resin component? Maybe that's what lets me add many coats without building up a glossy finish? Maybe I'll check some of my finishing books to get their opinions. Comments from Creekers?

    JKJ

  13. #13
    Honestly, I'm finding it a bit difficult to answer your question with a one-size-fits-all answer.

    Walnut can be made to look very traditional (this might be a case where you introduce amber).
    It can be made to look ultra natural (think of what the live edge slab table makers do).
    It can also be made to look contemporary (think of the use of walnut in mid-century modern furniture).
    And then there are also functional demands such as the protection level for a dining table top which is not a factor in a decorative turning.

    For these reasons, I now think of the finishing schedule as part of the design aesthetic of the project as well as serving the functional needs. Long winded way of saying there's no single "best" answer.
    It's good to have a variety of finishing techniques in your arsenal so you can deploy the one that's right for your particular situation.
    If you have more specifics on the project at hand, please share, and I can be more committal with a suggestion.
    Last edited by Edwin Santos; 11-19-2021 at 4:26 PM.

  14. #14
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    I will confess that most of the large walnut projects I have made have used steamed walnut from a hardwood lumber yard instead of air dried.

    I did make a several handgun grips out of a walnut tree a friend cut down that I cut and dried myself as well as a few boxes. They are noticeably lighter than steamed walnut but still look very nice with an oil based finish. I still have a few boards from that tree that I need to find the right project for.

    MANY years ago I gave up on staining and dyeing wood as I was never happy with the results. I decided to just appreciate the wood for what it is and find the finish that complements it the most. For lighter woods like maple (which I like a lot) I found that an oil based finish is too yellow for my liking so I use something else. Water based poly is great protection but flat so I usually use a very thin coat of blonde shellac to bring the grain out before using poly. On less handled projects I often use a lacquer top coat instead of poly. I have not tried oil then shellac then poly. Does this usually cast a heavy yellow hue?

    I have experimented with fuming oak with ammonia which I was quite pleased with the results. I don't use a lot of oak though. This will probably have to change as I picked up a huge haul of oak veneer from a retiring wood worker a while ago.

    I never liked cherry when I was much younger. I just don't like dark, dark finishes. When I saw a cherry rocking chair with a natural finish I was hooked! Cherry with an oil finish is beautiful and like you said only gets prettier over time. My daughters bedroom has all cherry furniture some I made and some store bought. I like the looks of the pieces I made and finished with an oil based finished much more than the commercially finished pieces.

    Many years ago I found a surplus shed that sells a good amount of Ipe'. They have a lot of very figured deck planks that aren't desirable for decking because of the figured wood warping. Ipe's is now one of my favorite woods because it looks so nice with an oil finish. I find that I will often use Ipe' where I would have used walnut previously. The 1/3 linseed (or tung) oil, 1/3 oil based varnish and 1/3 turpentine looks extremely nice on the Ipe. When I rebuilt the stairs in my house 18 or so years ago I used slate framed in Ipe'. After 18 years of heavy traffic the Ipe' still looks brans new. The oil/varnish/turpentine has held up extremely well!

    I think this might be the site that I read about the oil/varnish/turpentine finish MANY years ago (under a different user name) when I was looking for a Waterlox alternative.
    Last edited by Michael Schuch; 11-19-2021 at 6:54 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by John K Jordan View Post
    That's basically of several recipes I've seen for what is sometimes called "danish" oil, basically equal parts of some kind of polymerizing oil, varnish with resins, and solvent. Sometimes the varnish is spar, sometimes, poly, etc. I've used BLO and other oils. Solvent: turpentine, mineral spirits, etc. I haven't used the drier myself but might be worth trying.

    How much is a "bit" of Japan drier? Say in a pint of mixture would you use a few drops, a teaspoon, more?
    In a pint I use about a half teaspoon worth of the Japan drier. If I don't the spar varnish will take weeks to dry / fully cure. Regular (non-Spar) varnish dries faster and I have not used Japan drier with it yet. I only started adding the Japan drier a year or so ago.

    I am not surprised that oil / varnish / turpentine in not new to this board. I am pretty sure this board is where I got the idea / recipe when looking for a Waterlox alternative... maybe a decade or more ago. I posted here for MANY years under "Mike Schuch" instead of my current "Michael Schuch" but couldn't find my original account when I started posting here again. The 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 proportions are a guide and not a hard rule. I almost always start with a first coat around 1/4 oil, 1/4 varnish, 1/2 turpentine to get really good penetration on the first coat. Then switch to 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 for subsequent coats for a faster build up. Way back when I started using this finish mixture Turpentine was recommended for the better smell and as a more natural (not petroleum) solvent. It worked so I have been using it ever since without ever having tried an alternative solvent.


    Quote Originally Posted by John K Jordan View Post
    This typical recipe with variations has made me wonder: since one definition of varnish is "a combination of a drying oil, a resin, and a thinner or solvent plus a metal drier to accelerate the drying", does mixing with oil and solvent effectively just dilute the resin component? Maybe that's what lets me add many coats without building up a glossy finish? Maybe I'll check some of my finishing books to get their opinions. Comments from Creekers?

    JKJ
    I think you are on to something here. Thinning the oil and resin I would guess is for thin even coats? I don't believe that thinning with solvent makes a big difference on the sheen. But if you have many thin coats that don't completely fill the grain of the wood it does make sense that this would avoid the piece of plastic melted to the wood surface look. I usually select the varnish based on the sheen I want in the end product. I would also guess that thinned resins might also promote adhesion to the wood? Maybe?

    P.S. When I say linseed oil I mean BLO - Boiled Linseed Oil.
    Last edited by Michael Schuch; 11-19-2021 at 6:57 PM.

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