Computer guru's?

[Kev Williams]

I'm okay with computers but hardly a 'guru', and I need one...

I've been posting up lately about how all my win7's are acting like they're swimming in quicksand. So I picked up a nice used Dell Optiplex 790 off ebay. Been setting it up for the past week. I've installed Service Pack 1, no other updates whatsover. It's OFF the net except for whatever few minutes is needed to install/license programs from online, like Foxit PDF, etc... It's running 7 pro 64, only 4g ram (at the moment), and a 1tb hard drive. Pretty barebones. I've been xferring files & such, got most of my graphics, Office and normally-used programs loaded, still some to go, but as of now it's totally "usable"...

This new computer is SO much faster than my 'fast' T5400 computer it's hard to describe. What takes 5, 8, 20 seconds or more to happen on my T5400 is flat out instantaneous on this 'new' one. I know that Microsoft is still 'background' updating win7's and other computers with 'critical' security updates, regardless of the fact their 'support' ended almost 2 years ago, and also regardless of the fact my computers have been set up specifically to NOT update for YEARS. Sounds like a conspiracy theory, but I've read this online, and been told this by a couple of customers who 'do' computers for a living. And these updates are supposedly slowing the hell out of the computers, supposedly on purpose... I can't speak to the truth-or not- behind the talk, but I DO know that ALL of my win7 computers are so ridiculously slow that they're unusable. I swear, the characters "(Not Responding)" appear in the upper ribbons so often they're tarting to burn-in to the monitors! These computers used to be fast...

SO-- I now have a blazing fast Win7, that's going to take the place of every other computer, one at a time, one while I do a complete drive wipe and Windows 7 restoration on them all. Having just done the new one, it's fresh in my little brain what to do on the subsequent computers. My goal, have lightning-fast Win7 computers doing proprietary work running my programs and machines, while learning to put up with the nonsense and hassle of using a Win11 computer or two for all internet duties.

WHY I NEED A GURU-- Search engines, being geared for advertising for profit over locating actual useful information these days, are completely useless in finding an answer to THIS question:

WHAT do I have to do to firewall, block, keep-out, prevent, and/or otherwise just plain STOP Microsoft from invading my computers? While I can keep any or all of my computers off the INTERNET, I cannot keep them off my NETWORK, which IS on the internet... Are there any port-blocking protocols I can add, or firewall settings I can perform, or IP address or dot-com blocking procedures, 0.0.0.127 host-name blocks, router-based blocking, ANYTHING that will work--??? These old relic computers seem to work rather well before they're invaded with 'security' fixes. I'd like to keep 'em that way!

(for those who may not know me that well, no, I can't upgrade my computers, due to the machinery and programs they run)

Thanks in advance

[Lisa Starr]

Kev,

It has been too long since I've done this to give you steps, but the general method is to assign a static IP address to each computer you want to prevent internet access for. Then, assuming you have a fairly robust router, you can login to the router and set the router firewall to deny all internet access on those IP addresses.

[Rich Engelhardt]

click Start > Control Panel > System and Security. Under Windows Update, click the "Turn automatic updating on or off" link. Click the "Change Settings" link on the left. Verify that you have Important Updates set to "Never check for updates".

Or if you prefer gpedit.

• Click Start, and then click Run.
• Type gpedit.msc , and then click Ok.
• Expand Computer Configuration ▸ Administrative Templates ▸ Windows Components ▸ Windows Update.
• Select Configure Automatic Updates, choose Disabled, and click Ok.

You should also check from time to time to see if the setting holds. Sometimes other processes in Windows will alter that setting.

Lisa's method to deny internet access will also work.

If you can't access the router or if it doesn't support IP blocking, you can still assign a static IP address to the computer - but - leave the gateway blank. That way the computer won't be able to find a way off the local area network.

[Jerome Stanek]

You could also set up a subnet so the computers only see you lan

[Tom Stenzel]

Kev,

I don't know of a sure way to block Microsoft updates without using an external router. I've read that setting the HOSTS file to aim a domain to 127.0.0.1 will be ignored.

-Tom

[Kev Williams]

Kev,

It has been too long since I've done this to give you steps, but the general method is to assign a static IP address to each computer you want to prevent internet access for. Then, assuming you have a fairly robust router, you can login to the router and set the router firewall to deny all internet access on those IP addresses.

--My router, which is a 4-yearish-old Linksys EA8500, is already set up this way, using 'parental controls', I can block access to any computer 'always' or set certain times to block and allow. What I don't know is if an intruder can 'invade' a blocked computer by simply going thru an unblocked computer? I read recently that hackers have figured out how to install ransomware this way...

The router's firewall is totally vague and confusing to me--
here's the firewall settings (pg1) and the DMZ settings (pg2)- I have NO idea of what to do, change, etc... ?
firewall.jpgDMZ.jpg

click Start > Control Panel > System and Security. Under Windows Update, click the "Turn automatic updating on or off" link. Click the "Change Settings" link on the left. Verify that you have Important Updates set to "Never check for updates".

Or if you prefer gpedit.

• Click Start, and then click Run.
• Type gpedit.msc , and then click Ok.
• Expand Computer Configuration ▸ Administrative Templates ▸ Windows Components ▸ Windows Update.
• Select Configure Automatic Updates, choose Disabled, and click Ok.

You should also check from time to time to see if the setting holds. Sometimes other processes in Windows will alter that setting.

Lisa's method to deny internet access will also work.

If you can't access the router or if it doesn't support IP blocking, you can still assign a static IP address to the computer - but - leave the gateway blank. That way the computer won't be able to find a way off the local area network.

I've had Windows Update like this on all my computers for several years
updates2.jpgupdates.jpg

--leaving the gateways blank, THAT I've never heard of, I'm going to try that!

And Tom, I've had no good luck with the Hosts thing either...

So it seems I've been doing things right for the most part, but shutting down Windows Updates hasn't stopped the updates. Hopefully keeping my 7's off the net entirely will do the trick

[Jim Becker]

Setup MAC address filtering on your router that disallows any machine addresses you provide not have access to or from the WAN (Internet) port of the router. You'll have full functionality inside of your network, but nothing can pass in or out from/to the Internet from those specific machines. Parental controls often use IP addresses (software can vary) rather than MAC addresses (hardware and not generally changeable). The strictest corporate security arrangements tend to use MAC address filters as one of the important controlling data points since they are hardware interface addresses. To be complete, yes, there are ways to spoof alternative MAC addresses, but that shouldn't be a risk in your closed and personal environment.

[Anuj Prateek]

Kev,

I don't know of a sure way to block Microsoft updates without using an external router. I've read that setting the HOSTS file to aim a domain to 127.0.0.1 will be ignored.

-Tom

Router will be the easiest way. Block all internet traffic from MAC address.

[Kev Williams]

what started out as a pleasant surprise, in that the new computer build process was actually going rather smoothly- computer was doing what I wanted, printer installs only involved minor glitches, no major headaches like I normally get when doing 'anything computers'-- Well, my computer jinx let me know in no uncertain terms it was alive and well, in spades...

one problem I've had for some time: Gravostyle7, which is necessary for my business survival, for some reason is considered by many anti-virus programs to be a virus. Defender hasn't given me a problem because 'it' knows better. BUT- the version on my new computer, which I can't update because Microsoft won't let me, is several years old, and DOESN'T know better. In the middle of loading G7 to finish a job, which BTW I've ran several times in the past 2 days without issue, created a virus warning from Defender. So I immediately went in to Services and disabled Defender. Apparently, I did that while Defender was in the process of quarantining 'the virus', or so I assume-- anyway, THAT one stunt has completely fubar'd the computer as-it-was...

--Gravo7 will NOT fully un-install. And it will also not fully RE-install. System Restore won't work because (a) the restore points don't extend to before the initial install (my bad), and (b) most OTHER restore points won't take because of 'catastophic data errors'. I did find a restore point that worked, BUT- once I attempt another re-install of G7, upon reboot the computer hangs and goes into Startup Recovery mode, which doesn't work... so now it'll only boot in safe mode..

MEANWHILE, amongst the G7 trials, I found that the computer was ONLINE. Checked the router, it says it's blocked. Checked the DHCP table, and the computer is on there TWICE, with 2 different IP's AND MAC addresses-?? So to try a quick fix, based on an internet tip, I went into the internet settings/connections/LAN tab, unchecked automatic, checked proxy server, and VOILA! The computer went into an endless loop. Was an 8 minute or so wait for the loop to time out before any other window would appear... Took me nearly 3 hours just to undo that mistake. I also tried the wrong/no gateway idea, that didn't work - however, I found out later that the .198 IP address that I got from the first DHCP entry in the router was the erroneous one, computer itself says it's .146 -- So that may still work. I did at least get the endless loop issue fixed. Biggest problem now, while typing this I attempted a reinstall of G7 again, to again be greeted with a won't-boot situation... I'm now attempting a 'last known good configuration' boot... and, it just failed...

I CAN get the computer to work minus a working G7 program, but what I CAN'T figure out is how to remove a program that won't remove itself-- At one point last night I resorted to finding every instance of G7 in the registry and deleted them all. Didn't hurt anything, but didn't help either. I MUST have G7 on this computer, it's 100% necessary- I DON'T have a recovery disk of any kind to start over with the computer, and I don't have a Win7pro64 disk to reload Windows. Another anomaly of G7, it doesn't give me a choice of where to install it, much of it goes into Windows files, the rest on the default drive...

One option I have-? -- is I added a 1tb Sandisk SSD drive yesterday, maybe it's possible to boot up to it and install G7 on it?

AGGHH!! Meanwhile, I have to get into the router and figure out where the ghost computer came from and how to delete it! Among other things--

(and some people wonder why I don't want self-driving cars )

[Chuck Wintle]

what started out as a pleasant surprise, in that the new computer build process was actually going rather smoothly- computer was doing what I wanted, printer installs only involved minor glitches, no major headaches like I normally get when doing 'anything computers'-- Well, my computer jinx let me know in no uncertain terms it was alive and well, in spades...

one problem I've had for some time: Gravostyle7, which is necessary for my business survival, for some reason is considered by many anti-virus programs to be a virus. Defender hasn't given me a problem because 'it' knows better. BUT- the version on my new computer, which I can't update because Microsoft won't let me, is several years old, and DOESN'T know better. In the middle of loading G7 to finish a job, which BTW I've ran several times in the past 2 days without issue, created a virus warning from Defender. So I immediately went in to Services and disabled Defender. Apparently, I did that while Defender was in the process of quarantining 'the virus', or so I assume-- anyway, THAT one stunt has completely fubar'd the computer as-it-was...

--Gravo7 will NOT fully un-install. And it will also not fully RE-install. System Restore won't work because (a) the restore points don't extend to before the initial install (my bad), and (b) most OTHER restore points won't take because of 'catastophic data errors'. I did find a restore point that worked, BUT- once I attempt another re-install of G7, upon reboot the computer hangs and goes into Startup Recovery mode, which doesn't work... so now it'll only boot in safe mode..

MEANWHILE, amongst the G7 trials, I found that the computer was ONLINE. Checked the router, it says it's blocked. Checked the DHCP table, and the computer is on there TWICE, with 2 different IP's AND MAC addresses-?? So to try a quick fix, based on an internet tip, I went into the internet settings/connections/LAN tab, unchecked automatic, checked proxy server, and VOILA! The computer went into an endless loop. Was an 8 minute or so wait for the loop to time out before any other window would appear... Took me nearly 3 hours just to undo that mistake. I also tried the wrong/no gateway idea, that didn't work - however, I found out later that the .198 IP address that I got from the first DHCP entry in the router was the erroneous one, computer itself says it's .146 -- So that may still work. I did at least get the endless loop issue fixed. Biggest problem now, while typing this I attempted a reinstall of G7 again, to again be greeted with a won't-boot situation... I'm now attempting a 'last known good configuration' boot... and, it just failed...

I CAN get the computer to work minus a working G7 program, but what I CAN'T figure out is how to remove a program that won't remove itself-- At one point last night I resorted to finding every instance of G7 in the registry and deleted them all. Didn't hurt anything, but didn't help either. I MUST have G7 on this computer, it's 100% necessary- I DON'T have a recovery disk of any kind to start over with the computer, and I don't have a Win7pro64 disk to reload Windows. Another anomaly of G7, it doesn't give me a choice of where to install it, much of it goes into Windows files, the rest on the default drive...

One option I have-? -- is I added a 1tb Sandisk SSD drive yesterday, maybe it's possible to boot up to it and install G7 on it?

AGGHH!! Meanwhile, I have to get into the router and figure out where the ghost computer came from and how to delete it! Among other things--

(and some people wonder why I don't want self-driving cars )

Did you try safe mode yet?

[Kev Williams]

Before my last try with uninstall-install, I created a restore point, just in case.

Didn't do much good- at this moment I'm trying to create a USB boot disk, because: I can't even boot up to the cmd prompt in safe mode. And the startup-repair, while it USED to, will not NOW give me the option to use my last restore point. It just runs for about 15 minutes, then tells me it can't do squat.

Been trying for 2 hours to figure out how to simply get to a command prompt. I DO know how to run system restore FROM cmd, but I have to get there first... Tried booting up from another win7 disk I have, only it's a 32bit version, I'm running 64, so I get no options... And the operation to create a bootable USB, has been running for 15 minutes, and is only about half done according to the (lack of) progress ribbon...

waaayyy beyond frustrating... pullinghair.gif

[Chuck Wintle]

Before my last try with uninstall-install, I created a restore point, just in case.

Didn't do much good- at this moment I'm trying to create a USB boot disk, because: I can't even boot up to the cmd prompt in safe mode. And the startup-repair, while it USED to, will not NOW give me the option to use my last restore point. It just runs for about 15 minutes, then tells me it can't do squat.

Been trying for 2 hours to figure out how to simply get to a command prompt. I DO know how to run system restore FROM cmd, but I have to get there first... Tried booting up from another win7 disk I have, only it's a 32bit version, I'm running 64, so I get no options... And the operation to create a bootable USB, has been running for 15 minutes, and is only about half done according to the (lack of) progress ribbon...

waaayyy beyond frustrating... pullinghair.gif

do you have any other tools at your disposal?

https://www.diskpart.com/windows-7/c...1984.html#H2-2

[Chuck Wintle]

https://www.diskpart.com/windows-7/c...1984.html#H2-2

[Kev Williams]

I can't open a command prompt- whatsoever, no way no how- Trying to boot in safe mode with command prompt causes Windows to crash before the drivers are all loaded. The ONLY thing the computer will do is take me to the repair console, that can't repair anything...

The bootable USB I just made won't boot. I DO get more error messages though... Seems I need a Win7pro64 disk to boot, which I'm downloading now, about 20 minutes to go...

more to follow

>edit< dumass me, I didn't realize the repair console DOES give me the option to run system restore after the failed repair attempt- trying that --

<edit> - FINALLY found a restore point that worked-- next up, I guess, un-install all the hardware (output ports) and drivers, and a couple of programs that showed up on the 'why system restore didn't' lists..

Going to try to move the OS to the SSD drive, which supposedly the partition-fix program can do....

[Kev Williams]

Seems that when Defender flagged my G7 program as a virus, and I then went into Services and disabled Defender, it was in the process of quarantining and I interrupted the process. That's all I can figure as to why G7 was missing a critical start file afterwards. Then I went and corrupted the registry...

8 days of getting the computer ready- and it WAS ready- all for naught. Gave up trying to save anything, and put it out of its (and my) misery. And reformatted the drive...

I downloaded and ISO of Win7 Ultimate 64, burned it to a flash drive, the computer actually started installing it, no questions asked...

Woke up this morning to a fresh new computer that just needed some drivers loaded, found what I needed online-

Everything's loading up and working as it should, oddly enough! And since I just went thru the whole process it's still fresh on the brain what to do and not do...

So in a day or two I'll be right back where I started, trying to keep the thing OFFLINE....