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Thread: AFCI breakers in the shop?

  1. #1

    AFCI breakers in the shop?

    I am in the final inspection stages of my new shop (I didn't build it). It's an addon to my current house that's built to be either a workshop or a family room- basically, a family room with a bunch of big outlets and heavy duty floors

    The electrician put in AFCI circuits on the branches. As I understand the code, family rooms require AFCI protection of some sort.

    The problem is that, when I went to plug in my miter saw to install the flooring, I trip the arc fault breaker immediately. Running an extension cord to the next room works just fine, so I know the saw isn't broken or anything. It just looks like the universal motor in the saw is triggering an arc fault.

    What are my options here? Can I swap the breaker out with a regular one while I'm here using it as a workshop, then put the AFCI one back when I move out one day? I've seen you can use a "soft starter" to fix this, but those are $140+, and I'd prefer to not have to have one for each semi-permanent tools (like a miter saw/router table/etc) plus an extra for plug in stuff like routers or sanders that may or may not trip the breaker.

  2. #2
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    Swapping out the breaker is probably what I would do. If you've ever used a brush type motor where the brushes are visible there is often a tiny electrical arc between the brush and armature(not sure that's the right term - copper bars). I wonder if that tiny arc is enough to trip a AFCI.

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    I had/have this same situation. A couple years ago I added a new garage to my house. The electrician decided that the garage should be wired with AFCI breakers. They nuisance trip a lot.
    Now I'm building a attached shop and my "new electrician" doesn't understand why the garage was wired AFCI. He is going to use standard breakers and ground fault only (not AFGI) where needed. I'm also building with the future possibility of an owner that may want to convert the shop to living space. But I'm planning that if the living space conversion were to ever happen it wouldn't be much effort to replace the breakers with AFGI at that time.
    The Plane Anarchist

  4. #4
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    AFCI are horrible. As soon as the inspection is over, consider switching them out for a better breaker. Tech should make something better or safer, these do neither in my opinion. In my experience they will not work on cords, motors with brushes, vacuums etc, so they are unusable.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Rozmiarek View Post
    AFCI are horrible. As soon as the inspection is over, consider switching them out for a better breaker. Tech should make something better or safer, these do neither in my opinion. In my experience they will not work on cords, motors with brushes, vacuums etc, so they are unusable.
    This ^^^^!!

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    I had a similar situation in my son's shop after I wired it.
    I installed GFI's for all outlets and they too would trip. Could not figger out why!!
    Got on a contractors elec. forum and it turns out the breakers were all bad
    (Smart Electrician from Menards). I replaced them and no problems since.
    Had me going there for a while.

    Bruce
    Epilog TT 35W, 2 LMI SE225CV's
    CorelDraw 4 through 11
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    paper and pencils

  7. #7
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    I think arc fault breakers create more problems then they solve. A local college had them on all the dorm rooms. The nightmare was when the hall convenience outlets were on the same circuit. The vacuum when plugged in to clean the hall would trip the dorm room breaker. The students would return after a weekend away to find the mini fridge contents have spoiled. I had my kitchen redone and the microwave was on a dedicated arc fault. It tripped all the time. If it is tripping I would replace with a regular breaker or an GFCI if it is called for. Save all the arc fault breakers for when you sell the place so you can put them back in if the inspector flags it.

  8. #8
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    They would be changed here before the main breaker was cut back on the first time.

    They work okay on new construction, done properly, but the majority of old work is done with shared neutrals, which just won't work.

  9. #9
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    Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
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    Where I live the electrical code calls for GCFI's only for single-pole breakers. If it's the same for you and you have any machines that can be wired for it, a 240V circuit with double-pole breaker would be code-compliant and not a nuisance. Might be too late for you to take advantage of that, I realize -- thought I'd mention it for what it's worth.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Brodersen View Post
    Where I live the electrical code calls for GCFI's only for single-pole breakers. If it's the same for you and you have any machines that can be wired for it, a 240V circuit with double-pole breaker would be code-compliant and not a nuisance. Might be too late for you to take advantage of that, I realize -- thought I'd mention it for what it's worth.
    He would need to hurry before his locality adopts the 2020 NEC. Change is any outlet less than 250 volts and less than 50 amps.
    Comments made here are my own and, according to my children, do not reflect the opinions of any other person... anywhere, anytime.

  11. #11
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    Not sure where you are located but we are in the process of building a new home in Michigan and I don’t believe that arc fault breakers are required to be installed. In the past, they were required in I believe bedrooms, but is no longer the case. So if we don’t seem to need them in Michigan, I will assume you are ok to remove them and install new breakers. But as Scott suggested, save them and put them back in if required when you sell.

    And for what it is worth, don’t try to build a house during a pandemic, crazy lumber prices, and long lead times. We are still waiting for our front door and side lights (ordered in June).

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Colombo View Post

    And for what it is worth, don’t try to build a house during a pandemic, crazy lumber prices, and long lead times. We are still waiting for our front door and side lights (ordered in June).
    Being a homebuilder through this, I can sympathize. I just got notice that a batch of windows I ordered in August will arrive 22 Feb, 2022. They usually take 3 weeks.

  13. #13
    Maybe the reality about AFCI breakers has been heard by building inspectors. My electrician got approval for non-AFCI in my shop. The 110v are GFI and have not been a problem. The 220v are standard thermal overload breakers.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Rozmiarek View Post
    Being a homebuilder through this, I can sympathize. I just got notice that a batch of windows I ordered in August will arrive 22 Feb, 2022. They usually take 3 weeks.
    I build I'm following on the 'Tube has a similar issue with the Pella windows that were ordered. They are still a few months away. Lack of windows affects quite a bit of things for the build.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Velasquez View Post
    He would need to hurry before his locality adopts the 2020 NEC. Change is any outlet less than 250 volts and less than 50 amps.
    That's a bummer

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