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Thread: How fine do *you* sharpen?

  1. #16
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    Fine India if it needs more than a touch-up, some old unknown Ark that's finer than the India (I usually go straight to this), strop with green compound, back to work. When I do bother to test, this progression gets an edge that can pop hairs off my arm, and takes a minute or so if the edge isn't damaged.

  2. #17
    16K on both chisels and plane irons.

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by chuck van dyck View Post

    Someone made that argument of "that fine of an edge dulls quickly yada yada".
    It's called science, not yada yada
    If you're good with sharpening to that high of a degree, good for you.
    You just can't escape the scientific fact that when you use a tool it dulls. the sharper it starts out, the more quickly it begins the process.

    Also every alloy creates a different cutting edge, you can't just lump everything into the same box. There are just too many variables

    YMMV

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Weber View Post
    It's called science, not yada yada
    If you're good with sharpening to that high of a degree, good for you.
    You just can't escape the scientific fact that when you use a tool it dulls. the sharper it starts out, the more quickly it begins the process.

    Also every alloy creates a different cutting edge, you can't just lump everything into the same box. There are just too many variables

    YMMV
    When making half blind carcass dovetails, I usually sharpen after each corner (about 10 sockets) because I like the tool in nice shape. However one time I kept going and chopped out 40 sockets without sharpening. After that the chisel still cut end grain pine very nicely. So it would have been judged by many as still sharp.

    Part of the art of sharpening is producing an edge that is durable, not just one that passes some sharpness test before doing any work.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Weber View Post
    It's called science, not yada yada
    If you're good with sharpening to that high of a degree, good for you.
    You just can't escape the scientific fact that when you use a tool it dulls. the sharper it starts out, the more quickly it begins the process.

    Also every alloy creates a different cutting edge, you can't just lump everything into the same box. There are just too many variables

    YMMV
    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Mickley View Post
    When making half blind carcass dovetails, I usually sharpen after each corner (about 10 sockets) because I like the tool in nice shape. However one time I kept going and chopped out 40 sockets without sharpening. After that the chisel still cut end grain pine very nicely. So it would have been judged by many as still sharp.

    Part of the art of sharpening is producing an edge that is durable, not just one that passes some sharpness test before doing any work.
    In my sharpening the edge is sharpened for the purpose for which the edge will be used. My paring chisels are seldom used for chopping though my chopping chisels might be used for paring if a paring chisel isn't close at hand.

    Most of the time my paring chisels may need a little touch up during use, no big deal.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Weber View Post
    It's called science, not yada yada
    If you're good with sharpening to that high of a degree, good for you.
    You just can't escape the scientific fact that when you use a tool it dulls. the sharper it starts out, the more quickly it begins the process.

    Also every alloy creates a different cutting edge, you can't just lump everything into the same box. There are just too many variables

    YMMV
    No one is arguing the fact that it dulls quickly. I’m arguing that it can be worth it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

    To each his own my friend.

  7. #22
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    Aug 2012
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    Missouri
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    For chisels, hollow grind if needed, xxfine diamond and strop. I give them a few rubs on the strop before use and a few after or during use. Plane blades the same except sigma stones if needed. To me the strop is key. It’s more a mindless thing, I just do it out of habit. If the tool doesn’t perform when put to work I then investigate. Most of the time things go well for me. I very seldom go to the grinder.
    Jim

  8. #23
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    Nov 2006
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    Minnesota
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    I polish the micro-bevel on a 16000 Shapton stone per Rob Cosman's 32-second method.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyler Bancroft View Post
    After reading the many informative responses in the other sharpening thread currently going on, I'm curious: What fineness of stone/film/grit do you sharpen to? I usually go to DMT extra-extra-fine (3 micron/8000 grit), unless it's a roughing plane like my scrub, in which case I might stop at extra-fine. I'm generally happy with the performance of my tools at the 3 micron level, so I'm curious whether people who go beyond that notice a difference in performance.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bulatowicz View Post
    I sharpen everything to the highest level I can; a refined edge is a more durable edge as well as being more pleasant to use. I previously sharpened only as far as I deemed necessary for a task, erroneously trying to save time. Then, a while back, Tom King pointed out to me that there’s no such thing as “too sharp” in a woodworking tool, and after testing his assertion myself I believe he’s correct. For what is now only a little extra effort I get more (and more pleasant) use out of a tool before resharpening, even though I resharpen earlier in the wear cycle than I used to. Part of this is certainly technique and part of it is the more refined edge to start.

    Depending on the steel, I go to either a Sigma Power 13k or a Dan’s hard black Arkansas stone. Depending on the tool, I then either lightly use a buffing wheel charged with Formax green compound or a piece of flat (planed) hardwood charged with Autosol as a strop. I most often use the buffer much less aggressively than for David Weaver’s “unicorn method” but I have experimented with that as well.

    I originally purchased my Arkansas stones because I wanted to have something better than diamonds and more appropriate than waterstones for my carving tools (which can quickly leave a rut in a waterstone if you’re not careful to use the full face of the stone-DAMHIKT), but as I gain more experience with them I find that I am starting to prefer oil stones for most steels.

    I remembered this post the last few days, and I've been touching up my chisels a lot more often.

    It definitely helps and makes for a more enjoyable woodworking experience.

    I find that, because tools dull slowly, they can get really dull before I notice. Touch them up, and it's night and day.

    I don't know, I've been out of the swing of woodworking for quite a number of years now, so maybe I was already doing that before? Not sure anymore.

    But anyway, this is why simplicity is so important I feel. If you have a method that is simple and requires very little prep and complication, you can just hit the stone for a few minutes and get back to work with very little interruption. And if you don't let it get super dull, you typically have less work to do anyway.

    Planes are annoying because you have to reset them, though.

  10. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by chuck van dyck View Post
    No one is arguing the fact that it dulls quickly. I’m arguing that it can be worth it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

    To each his own my friend.

    If you read my posts, I'm not arguing either.
    I simply tried to point out something that some overlook. I also mention that, at times, it can be worth the effort.

  11. #26
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    I remembered this post the last few days, and I've been touching up my chisels a lot more often.

    It definitely helps and makes for a more enjoyable woodworking experience.

    I find that, because tools dull slowly, they can get really dull before I notice. Touch them up, and it's night and day.
    This is also my experience. It is easier to touch up the edge often instead of going on with a tool as it becomes duller and duller with each stroke.

    This bugged me about some of the premium plane blades at first. The wear pattern wasn't obvious and then it was a lot more work to reestablish a flat bevel. Now it has become second nature to test the blade during use to check on how dull it has become.

    A little sharpening often seems better than having to stop and spending a lot of time to set up for a secondary bevel or regrinding.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke Dupont View Post

    Diamond stones were my go to for a while but I got annoyed with them for a few reasons:
    1) they wear out quickly
    2) I couldn't find a liquid to float particles off of them that worked well, and didn't want to buy some specialized product to do so. Neither oil nor water work well on them.
    3) they don't "feel" good when in use
    4) they leave really deep, coarse scratch patterns, and hence a much coarser finished edge that isn't so nice as a finishing stone, and not so easy to refine on other types of stones within a progression. An india or especially a natural stone will cut much shallower scratches and leave a surface that is both much finer, and much easier to refine in a progression.
    If you are going to use water, add a few drops of dish washing liquid; I use Dawn. I usually use Smith's Honing Solution but have also been happy with Gatco. A little goes a long way, but I like the feel of these (usually Smith's for me). I have never tried Trend.

    I think that others like simple green on their diamond stones; I have never tried it.

    BTW, you had lots of nice information in your post, thank you!

  13. #28
    I don't recall who mentioned it in all the various threads about sharpening but,
    No matter what method you use or what micron or grit level you want to achieve, make a dedicated sharpening station.
    If the sharpening supplies are readily available to use, most people are more apt to do it more often. If all the supplies are in a drawer or cabinet out of sight, the tool tends to go longer in between sharpening.
    I use a granite surface plate which is not overly heavy but at 26 lbs you don't want to have to lug it out each time you need to touch up a tool. If it's out sitting on a cabinet ready to go, it's a different story
    Just a suggestion

  14. #29
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    Trouble with a dedicated sharpening station is the prime real estate it needs. Not an option in my 250 sq ft shop

    And can you really leave the water stones in water for years?

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Bender View Post
    Trouble with a dedicated sharpening station is the prime real estate it needs. Not an option in my 250 sq ft shop

    And can you really leave the water stones in water for years?
    I think it depends on the binder, it is one of the reasons why I use shapton stones that are spray and go.

    I also don't have room to just leave all my sharpening equipment out.

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