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Thread: Electric Cars

  1. #16
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    Our plan is that our next 'around town' vehicle will be an EV...likely the coming Subaru Solterra...and it will replace our MY20 Forester Limited. That gives us my larger Ascent for hauling and the smaller, EV for ratting around in. I think that will be a good combination for us. Charging at home will be no issue as I have an easily accessible sub-panel in the "garage" (currently my temporary shop) and can easily install both inside and outside 240v charging facilities.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by John Terefenko View Post
    ... your choice ...
    For your planning and shopping enjoyment, most if not all of the major oil and gas companies have business plans in place that project 100% of light utility vehicles sold worldwide will be all-electric by 2040-ish*. 'Light utility' defined as 1/2ton trucks or smaller. Obviously, O&G producers don't build or buy many** vehicles, but that is how production will be planned.

    *- posted this before, but threads always get nuked.
    **- their service fleets are small percentage of overall sales.

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Mich View Post
    Mike, your calculations are helpful and appreciated. Now I am wondering about mileage comparison: How far can one drive on $9 of gas vs. a $9 electrical charge? At $3/gal and 25 mpg a gas-fueled car would go about 75 miles. That seems to be far less than the miles an electric car might achieve on a 90% charge, which could be a cost-saver in a household of teens.
    Well. if we assume the same 0.25 KWh per mile, and 48.75 KWh between 90% full and 25% full, you could go 195 miles at about 70 mph.

    If it took 0.35 KWh per mile, you could go almost 140 miles at 70 mph.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  4. #19
    watched a you tube where an eel bit an aligator and it was electrocuted in seconds.

    Eel was over 800 volts. Eel didnt have a battery as far as I know. He wasnt even grounded. Not sure if he was a single phase Eel. Im going to skip batteries and go straight to eels. Might give Elon a call this afternoon.

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Lake View Post
    watched a you tube where an eel bit an aligator and it was electrocuted in seconds.

    Eel was over 800 volts. Eel didnt have a battery as far as I know. He wasnt even grounded. Not sure if he was a single phase Eel. Im going to skip batteries and go straight to eels. Might give Elon a call this afternoon.

    --Eelon.. lol
    ========================================
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  6. #21
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    While we have been considering a new vehicle and all but a few times per year our usage would easily fall under the maximum mileage of most EV's my concern on a trip would be availability of a charger when needed. I noticed a charging station at a fuel stop recently. Two connections and both in use. I see that as a problem if you try to use an EV for longer trips. I suspected they were "local" users and have no way of knowing if they were there 30 minutes or 10 hours. This is a rural area so car rental locations are a pain to access because they are close to an hour no matter what direction one goes. Can charging stations be reserved in advance? I see issues with that concept as well. How are those who would "camp out" at a charging station discouraged from doing such things? The idea of traveling and stopping every couple hundred miles is certainly doable but not if there isn't any charging capacity available when needed. Educate me please.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Blue View Post
    While we have been considering a new vehicle and all but a few times per year our usage would easily fall under the maximum mileage of most EV's my concern on a trip would be availability of a charger when needed. I noticed a charging station at a fuel stop recently. Two connections and both in use. I see that as a problem if you try to use an EV for longer trips. I suspected they were "local" users and have no way of knowing if they were there 30 minutes or 10 hours. This is a rural area so car rental locations are a pain to access because they are close to an hour no matter what direction one goes. Can charging stations be reserved in advance? I see issues with that concept as well. How are those who would "camp out" at a charging station discouraged from doing such things? The idea of traveling and stopping every couple hundred miles is certainly doable but not if there isn't any charging capacity available when needed. Educate me please.
    At the Tesla "supercharger" stations anyway there is a substantial surcharge added to your bill if you overstay the time needed to charge your car to ~80%, so there is a strong incentive not to leave your car there. I don't know whether the other charging networks work similarly.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by roger wiegand View Post
    At the Tesla "supercharger" stations anyway there is a substantial surcharge added to your bill if you overstay the time needed to charge your car to ~80%, so there is a strong incentive not to leave your car there. I don't know whether the other charging networks work similarly.
    The one I observed recently was a "generic" station. Whether there is feedback between the vehicle and charger would be interesting. I suppose the current draw could also be how it's monitored as well. Just the fact that this is a small rural town and nearly everyone would commute to their jobs makes me think they were camped but I don't know that. I actually will be in that town this week so I will check and see if it appears vehicles are "camped" there again. I don't recall what brand was there but I know neither were Tesla's. They tend to be noteworthy.

  9. #24
    Personally-- I don't see this ending well...

    Even with all the hybrid/EV/AF vehicles on the road, I can't remember the last time I went to a gas station that didn't have a half dozen or more cars filling up. Imagine if, right now, the ratio of gas/diesel to electric vehicles was flipped; what are the lines to get charged going to look like? And I don't see home-charging as much of an answer the moment, in many places it's hard to keep the central air running when it's hot, how's 'the grid' supposed to handle gazillions of cars constantly charging in addition to current electric demands?

    just wondering... but honestly, I see some major growing pains in the automotive future...
    ========================================
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    FOUR - CO2 lasers
    THREE- make that FOUR now - fiber lasers
    ONE - vinyl cutter
    CASmate, Corel, Gravostyle


  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kev Williams View Post
    And I don't see home-charging as much of an answer the moment, in many places it's hard to keep the central air running when it's hot, how's 'the grid' supposed to handle gazillions of cars constantly charging in addition to current electric demands?
    I could have sworn we did a multi-page thread on this exact topic not too long ago...
    Yup. OP was some guy with the initials "KW".
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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee DeRaud View Post
    I could have sworn we did a multi-page thread on this exact topic not too long ago...
    Yup. OP was some guy with the initials "KW".
    its difficult to answer questions when they are formed as an opinion not based on facts.

    the answer is then assumed the same and to be thrown out, instead of considered.

    the answer is, though, that most people charge at night when there is a much smaller demand on the grid, and evening out that demand curve actually makes the grid more efficient and the cars themselves present opportunity for surge capacity in the home when they are connected, and if you opt in, surge grid capacity.

    as an engineer in the O&g industry and a current plug in and future EV owner, i'm excited about the possibilities.

  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Kev Williams View Post
    Personally-- I don't see this ending well...

    Even with all the hybrid/EV/AF vehicles on the road, I can't remember the last time I went to a gas station that didn't have a half dozen or more cars filling up. Imagine if, right now, the ratio of gas/diesel to electric vehicles was flipped; what are the lines to get charged going to look like? And I don't see home-charging as much of an answer the moment, in many places it's hard to keep the central air running when it's hot, how's 'the grid' supposed to handle gazillions of cars constantly charging in addition to current electric demands?

    just wondering... but honestly, I see some major growing pains in the automotive future...
    The majority of people with EVs will charge at home, not at public charging stations. With gasoline, you have no choice but to fill up at a gas station. People who will have to use public charging stations are those who have to park on the street, travelers, and those who forgot to plug in their vehicle at home. In my area, large companies are putting charging stations in their parking lots. They can automatically contact the employee to move the vehicle when it's charged. Failure to do so will revoke charging privileges.

    In my area, there is an excess of electricity in the daytime because of the amount of installed solar. I suppose you could encounter problems on the grid, but we generally do not have such problems because solar generation is distributed into the places where the electricity is used.

    The "crunch" time for electric power is in the evening when solar is tapering off. Rates go up at 4pm in my area. During the 8am to 4pm time they're practically giving electricity away. You can program you electric vehicle to charge during the time of lowest rates, which generally coincides with greatest availability.

    As others have pointed out, the other time for low rates and low demand is generally overnight, perhaps from 9pm to 7am. Charging your vehicle at night actually helps the power company manage their system.

    Mike
    Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.

  13. #28
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    No doubt there will be growing pains in the transition away from fossil fuels but the fact that every major car manufacturer in the world is investing millions in EV development and many have set dates by which they will stop ICE production, makes me think it will happen. Add to that, the fact that study after study shows EV' s are cheaper to own over as little as five years.

  14. #29
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    Oct 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Henderson View Post
    The majority of people with EVs will charge at home, not at public charging stations. With gasoline, you have no choice but to fill up at a gas station. People who will have to use public charging stations are those who have to park on the street, travelers, and those who forgot to plug in their vehicle at home. In my area, large companies are putting charging stations in their parking lots. They can automatically contact the employee to move the vehicle when it's charged. Failure to do so will revoke charging privileges.

    In my area, there is an excess of electricity in the daytime because of the amount of installed solar. I suppose you could encounter problems on the grid, but we generally do not have such problems because solar generation is distributed into the places where the electricity is used.
    Unfortunately, for those who commute to work during the day there usually isn't a place to charge the car to use some of that solar generated electricity. It seems crazy that California requires all new houses to have solar panels even if that electricity isn't really needed.

    Some areas in Hawaii the power company won't allow solar customers to export power to the grid. The customer's solar inverter can only produce as much power as the customer is using. Electricity is so expensive in Hawaii that solar makes a lot of sense. Some neighborhoods were overloading the local grid with all the excess solar power during the day.

  15. #30
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    Oct 2006
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    I have considered buying a used Nissan Leaf or Ford Focus electric from time to time. One reason I haven't done it is because annual registration would be a significant chunk of my annual operating expenses for an electric car. Registration is based on a percentage of MSRP plus there is a $75 electric vehicle fee. The state wants to push the electric vehicle fee to $250 per year which is more than I pay in gas taxes with my gasoline car!

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