Converting European 3 Phase Power tools to Canada electricity

[Erez Perelman]

What are your thoughts on a rotary converter?
Someone recommended it as a more cost effective and reliable way to get the 3 phase...

[Erez Perelman]

I'm actually shipping from Israel to Canada.
I'm a professional guitar maker and have my tonewood hord and specialized tools that would take a decade to replace...
So I need to figure out how to ship everything and also get the tools with different electrical requirements to work.
I know the tonewoods will be a nightmare legistically to deal with, but I've done it before.
Would appreciate any advice as far as that goes as well albeit its not part of the initial thread topic..

[Jim Becker]

Erez, given your latest information, personally, there's no way I'd ship that big bandsaw. I'd sell it and buy a replacement here in North America. Bandsaws are not unique tools. I'm not sure what you use the other mentioned tool for but it would be a candidate for replacement, too.

You are correct that there may be some "fun" with some of the material that may be in your lumber inventory; specifically species that were obtained before certain regulation kicked in globally. I hope you are able to get that sorted out without too much pain...music instrument makers get caught up in this a lot based on what I've read.

[Malcolm McLeod]

...
I am been seeing VFD's advertised that will go to 120hz. ...

Some VFDs are able to drive outputs up to 400Hz. See Mr. Henderson's caveats on Hp/Torque/RPM. Also, consider the impact of such high RPM on motor bearings - or other components in a given drive train (idler shaft/gears/belts/spindles/tooling).

[Tom Bender]

As a rule I would not overspeed any motor. The windings, bearings, etc may fail at 60/50 design rpm and surely will at 120 hz. It's like putting nitrous in your car, the prognosis is not good.

[Erez Perelman]

I see yoru point Jim, but if I'm already getting a container and dealing with shipping, its not that much overhead to bring the saw with me... As long as it works when i get there

[Jim Becker]

Yes, if you have a whole container, then I doubt bringing the "beasts" will impact your shipping costs negatively. Getting back to the basics, I'd probably try to find a way to replace the motor; even if it stays three phase due to horsepower requirements, a 240v 60 hz three phase motor is going to be a lot easier to power up with simplicity than having to deal with the combination of three phase power source from 240v single phase, 50hz vs 60 hz and a transformer to deal with the 400v requirement of the existing motor(s). Pick your poison!

BTW, look forward to seeing your work here at SMC. There is a dedicated musical instruments forum discussion area as well as other applicable discussion areas.

[Erik Loza]

Late to the conversation but since Hammer does offer the N4400 in 1-phase, Felder theoretically "could" just sell you the appropriate new motor and other electrical parts (though it would probably take forever to get them) but I agree with Jim: What is your time worth? Won't you have other things to focus on? The N4400 is not an expensive bandsaw. If it were me, I would pull off whatever jigs or mods you have, sell that machine locally, then just purchase a new one in single-phase. It would have the appropriate CSA-certified electrical box, too. Just my 2-cents, which is likely worth half that.

Erik

[Doug Garson]

Just a thought, there is a Canadian woodworking forum that several of us here also belong to, might be worth posting your question there also to get their perspective. Can't post a link but easy to find.

[Erez Perelman]

Thanks guys- all the feedback is really good.
The bandsaw is really just a sidekick to my beast dust collector. I know it will be easily replaceable (nevermind the $1000 of specialty blades), but really what I need to get to work at the end is the dust collector that is 3 phase 400V.. I spent months modifying the machine to get it to my needs (I'd love to get into that some other time). So if I find a simple solution for the bandsaw it will hopefully be the same for the dust collector.
I guess I am still confused about the VFD solution since it can provide 3 phase from 1 phase and solve 60Hz -> 50Hz, but it won't boost the Voltage from 220 to 400 V. I am no expert and just looked on amazon and didn't find any VFD That would increase the voltage- or any transformers that would boost it either 220-> 400v...
Can someone give me the setup it would require with VFDs/transformers that would not require any modification on end machine (except basic motor rewiring).

and regarding my work- I make classical and flamenco guitars. I don't think links work here but you can search my name and see it all over

[Warren Lake]

I went with a roto with my first larger 10 HP machine. Had never heard of VFD or even Rotos way back. Years later found out one of the two German cabinetmakers i knew the best had a roto and had rewired his motors in one machine from 575 to 240. Took a look at your photo gallery, you do beautiful work.

Rod or one of a number of smart guys will answer you about the VFD. I think what you said is accurate then you need a transformer, smaller ones are not too expensive. They come up at auctions as well.

[Mike King]

Erez, your issue is well beyond what I've dealt with, but I do have a couple of suggestions for you. First is to ask your questions on the Felder Owners Group (https://groups.io/g/felderownersgroup/topics); there are a number of folk who have dealt with buck transformers and three phase converters, although I don't know about the frequency issue. The second is to call Phase Perfect -- they offer phase converters to manufacture three phase power from single phase and they undoubtedly would be able to say whether their products might provide what you need.

BTW, looked at your work and it is amazing...

Mike

[Mike King]

you might also contact @Jack Forsberg; he offers VFD's and has restored a variety of European old iron machines and he lives in Canada.

[Greg Quenneville]

Once again, let me emphasise that your existing motor may already be dual voltage, 240 or 400 three phase. It depends on the wiring connections on the motor itself. All of the three phase motors I have seen under 5 hp have been dual voltage. There are six terminals in the motor wiring box and the orientation of the bridging strips determines the voltage requirements (called “star” or “ delta” connections)

If your motor can be connected for 240v then all you would need is a 240v single phase input VFD. No voltage step-up transformers.

[Jim Becker]

I think that you'll find that transformers for 240v to 400v or similar, unlike VFDs, are not really something you'll find on places like Amazon. That's an industrial type product.