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Thread: Enduro-var II

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    Enduro-var II

    I ran out of original Enduro-Var satin as I am nearing the end of my office built-ins project. I know, bad planning on my part, but who knew GF was going to reformulate it.

    I picked up a gallon of Enduro-var II Satin

    First impressions:

    EV1 in the can looked like skim milk with an amberish hue, but it was thicker than skim milk; more like cream, with a bit of an oily sheen.
    EV2 in the can is whole milk white, with very little tint to it. To me it looks just like whole milk. It is noticeably thinner than EV1. I didn't measure with a ford cup, but it's a lot thinner. No noticeable oily sheen. Bit stronger odor than EVI. Had to stir it a lot longer to mix in the settled flateners.

    I've been tinting the EV with transtint brown mahogany for the first two coats. The TT never dissolved/dispersed well in EV1; despite my best efforts there were always clumps of dye left in the strainer when I strained it after tinting. I was using about 3 drops of TT to each ounce of EV1. It turned it a very dark brown, like good dark chocolate.

    The TT dissolves even less well in EVII; a lot more clumps on the strainer. And the resulting color is more like light milk chocolate.

    I am now doing new sample boards to see what adjustments I have to make to get similar results to what I was getting with EVI. When brushing EVII on test boards, the lower viscosity is really noticeable; it drips off the brush easily compared to EV1. My sense it that it dries a little slower than EV1, but it's just an impression. It seems to level as well as EVI did. No way to judge durability at this stage.

    So just a heads up to Enduro-var fans; you may have to adjust your finishing schedule with EVII.
    Last edited by Paul F Franklin; 06-03-2021 at 9:17 AM.
    --Certainty is the refuge of a small mind--

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Denver, CO
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    209
    Good info, Paul. I was so disappointed (and kinda freaked out) when I heard GF was replacing EV1 with EV2. I bought 15 gallons of EV1 and a bunch of quarts, different sheens, almost everything I could find. It’s the best finish I’ve ever used.

    I picked up a quart of a EV2 a few weeks ago and have done about a dozen different samples comparing to original EV. On bare wood, over seal-a-cell, over shellac, different species, durability tests, etc. Here are my impressions:

    — EV2 ambers less than EV1 (GF states this). I would say EV2 is in between EV1 and a pure water based poly like High Performance. The difference is less noticeable over an oil sealer than on bare wood. EV1 over an oil sealer looks very, very close to an oil-based topcoat.
    — EV2 is slightly cloudier than EV1 when building up several coats. EV1 has really good clarity.
    — EV1 flows out better on large surfaces than EV2. I rarely get lap marks with EV1 even on large surfaces (when brushing). EV2 left me with some noticeable overlaps. This was even after thinning 12% with GF extender (extremely dry here in Colorado).
    — EV2 often left me with bubbles from brushing. This seems to decrease as the brush becomes fully saturated, but they’ve been very difficult to eliminate completely. No bubbles ever with EV1.

    I will post some photos of my samples tomorrow. Overall I’m highly disappointed in the updated Enduro Var II. The only claimed benefits of the new version are:

    1) improved adhesion over EV1
    2) increased chemical and heat resistance, and
    3) 2-hour dry time instead of 4-hour.

    I’ve never had adhesion issues EV1. I always make sure my seal-a-cell dries a few days or shellac a few hours. I’ve even recoated tables with thick oil-based polyurethane finishes with EV1 and they look amazing and have held up for years. GF are kind of spazzes about EV1’s adhesion issues but none of this has ever been borne out in all my experience and things I’ve read. One time just for kicks I put EV1 over seal-a-cell that had only dried 30 minutes and it adhered fine, cured fine, looks fine, and seems just as durable months later.

    I can only hope GF will either bring back EV1 or reformulate at some point. In the meantime, I will continue to hoard EV1 and hope the unopened cans last a long time.

    I sometimes use Zar’s Oil Modified Urethane and it is quite good. It’s closer to EV1 in ambering and seems plenty durable. Also half the price. Anybody ever use the Zar? I’ve also tried Minwax’s oil modified poly and was not impressed.
    Last edited by Bennett Ostroff; 06-03-2021 at 1:11 AM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    WNY
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    7,645
    Thanks for the detailed report Paul. I knew they had reformulated it but haven't used any yet. Disappointing for sure.

    As for your issues dissolving TT in any WB finish, I've never had an issue, including in EV1. Try pre dispersing the TT in a few ml of water first and then adding that to the finish.

    John

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Western PA
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    Whelp, add me to the list of disgruntled fans of endurovar I. One, I had no idea this was being reformulated. I just found that out two weeks ago when I purchased two gallons of satin and flat. I just opened them up today to brush on a second coat over EV1 on some table legs. The milk white color is a little disconcerting. Like everyone else, I use endurovar because I want to spray a non-oil based finish, but retain the ambering and depth of an oil finish. EV2 looks like high performance, which makes me wonder why the F Iím paying $30-40 more for the same crap. I havenít sprayed it yet, so maybe Iím blowing up for no reason, but this is a huge bummer if they just ruined my favorite finish. Iím going to shoot a few coats through my gun and then take a deep breath before contacting them.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    209
    I feel your pain, Patrick. I've been slogging through a quart of satin EV II and it just sucks compared to EV I. It's a totally different product. The only redeeming thing about it is its compatibility with an oil sealer and/or shellac (although I've never experienced with EV I over either). The best option is probably to do a seal coat of Seal-a-Cell with an optional barrier coat of dewaxed shellac. This will also help to minimize raised grain from straight EV II onto raw wood.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Western PA
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    993
    I actually just returned the other gallon of EVII yesterday. I am stuck with the gallon of flat EVII, since i opened it and used it. Agreed, i already gave a client a sample of EVI a month ago, prior to running out of my stock of EVI. In order to match that as best as i could, i used a base coat of Waterlox--tung oil/resin--to add color and depth. That then sat for 2 weeks to cure prior to spraying EVII. I was a little concerned with topping an oil varnish with waterbourne, but both coats cured very well, and the product looks fine. That is a possible future avenue for using the rest of the gallon of EVII. Base coat with oil varnish, wait forever for it to cure, then topcoat with EVII. After this half gallon of product is used up, i am done with EVII. I think im going to try Osmo and the ceramic coating. This sounds a little gimmicky, but i did a ceramic coating on my car, and it still beads water a year later.

    Additional thoughts on EVII:
    The color is no where comparable to EVI. There is no ambering or added depth to the walnut i finished.
    It appears to be thinner than EVI. It also froths like freaking crazy under pressure in the cup. To the point where my Fuji HVLP setup started to bubble and leak from the cup of my gun.
    The dry time is considerably longer than EVI. This is borderline like an oil varnish. I sprayed a coat and had to wait 6 hours before it was dry to the touch. EVI would dry to the touch in like an hour. I think you would be hard pressed to do multiple coats of EVII in one day. I dont know if it would fully cure in 6-8 hours to lightly sand and spray again. This is in a garage that is semi-conditioned, and it was 80% humidity and about 75į air temp.
    I have no observations on the product's hardness/durability. EVI has proven to be very durable over the years. My wife and i are downright abusive to our walnut coffee table. EVI is also on my dining room table, night stands, and couch end tables.

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