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Thread: Neat backsaw handle.

  1. #16
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    Started playing around with some changes to the original handle design. (shown left)

    The changes include reducing the total length of the grip; plus adding some additional thickness on the inside profile of the grip back to the neck of the handle.

    I plane to reduce to the stock depth of the hardback from 3/4" down to 1/2". That will allow the saw bolts to remain in their current location.

    The depth of the saw plate below the hardback will be 2 1/2 inches..

    The length of saw plate will likely be 10" for the dt, and 12' carcass.

    regards Stewie;


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  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    I know many believe that "tapered" blades were a thing, pointing to the saws in the Seaton chest, but in my view, the vast majority are saws that have had a rough life as almost all saws have. I'm not aware of any engravings or etchings which show the tapered arrangement at least in American literature.
    It is beyond peculiar that you suggest that an English saw might not have been originally tapered because tapered saws do not show up in "American literature". Have you done enough research to know that illustrations of tapered saws show up in English literature? Here is one of many:

    smith key 1816.jpg

    If you have seen illustrations of saws in "American Literature" before 1830, I would be interested in seeing them also.

  3. #18
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    Pete; you might want to read page 57 of Simon Barley's book British Saws & Saw Makers from 1660.

    regards Stewie;
    Last edited by Stewie Simpson; 06-09-2021 at 3:13 PM.

  4. #19
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    I'm familiar with both gents and it's not remotely peculiar. There is no known instance of any US maker at any point in time showing a tapered saw back. I have original catalogs going back to the mid 1800s, and it just doesn't exist. Any suggestion to the contrary needs backed up by examples not derisive comments suggesting lack of research.

    Additionally, in the English literature I have, they show parallel backs as well, at least from the late 19th Century on. Who has a usable example of a 1720 English saw? If the tapered back was such a fantastic and required feature, why was it not carried forward and use in America? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Interestingly, no comment on the points about hang angle in light of those two tremendous variables which impact the angle? Namely deformed spine and loose handle?

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Taran View Post
    I'm familiar with both gents and it's not remotely peculiar. There is no known instance of any US maker at any point in time showing a tapered saw back. I have original catalogs going back to the mid 1800s, and it just doesn't exist. Any suggestion to the contrary needs backed up by examples not derisive comments suggesting lack of research.

    Additionally, in the English literature I have, they show parallel backs as well, at least from the late 19th Century on. Who has a usable example of a 1720 English saw? If the tapered back was such a fantastic and required feature, why was it not carried forward and use in America? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Interestingly, no comment on the points about hang angle in light of those two tremendous variables which impact the angle? Namely deformed spine and loose handle?
    Nobody has suggested that tapered saws were made in America in the late 19th century. However, Pete Taran has suggested that the saws that Seaton bought from Christopher Gabriel of London in 1796, might not have been tapered originally. His evidence is American catalogues of sixty years later. One could use this kind of logic to suggest there were no black and white TVs in the 1950s.

    I gave an explanation of some advantages of a tapered back saw on this forum three years ago. Pete Taran wrote in the same thread an hour later; all he was interested in was Disston.

  6. #21
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    Interestingly, no comment on the points about hang angle in light of those two tremendous variables which impact the angle? Namely deformed spine and loose handle?
    Pete; I havent bothered to argue the point because our views will differ on this topic. Is it worth a long debate. The answer is no.

    regards Stewie;

  7. #22
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    Warren,

    The bait and switch is fantastic and very amusing. I ask again, if the tapered saw blade was the Acme of sawing delight, why is it only seen on very early British saws, and very few at that? I have not seen an example in tool making where a superior feature faded away in favor of one much less satisfactory and one that could be made at the same cost.

    And while you attempt to point out that comparing American products from 60 years later is ridiculous, the idea has merit. Recall that Disston and others labelled their best steel London Spring. They did this to persuade the market that the fledgling US steel market was as good as steel made in England, and to even trick them to think that it was made in England. They also copied many other features of British saws because that was what the market expected and held up as perfection. So, if the fantastic tapered back were real, and the cat's pajamas as you suggest, then why was it not copied and why do we not see it in catalogues of the day? Because they forgot? Or because it was never a thing to start with.

    You might consider some of the deeper aspects of saw history before you pass judgement on those who have.

    But you are right, I'm only interested in Disston. Thank you for the kind reminder, I had forgotten.

  8. #23
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    Brass hardbacks

    Started work on reducing the height of the brass hardbacks from 3/4" to 1/2".

    Not the most enjoyable part of this project.

    Stewie;
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  9. #24
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    brass hardbacks

    1st batch of brass hardbacks have been cut to width, length, and stamped on the hydraulic press.

    regards Stewie;


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  10. #25
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    hardback slots

    Cutting the slot on the router table to 0.020" for the dovetail saw hardbacks.

    regards Stewie;
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  11. #26
    Interesting stuff Stewie. Look forward to seeing the rest of this build.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  12. #27
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    saw plate to dimension

    Saw plates been cut to size. The carcass & Dovetail Saws will both be at 0.020" in saw plate thickness.

    Later during the week I will focus on preparing the stock for the backsaw handles.

    regards Stewie;



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  13. #28
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    backsaw handle stock.

    Queensland Maple dressed down to 23mm thickness for the backsaw handles.

    I plan to make up some hard templates with 2 location holes that will allow me to precisely mark both sides of the handle blank.

    regards Stewie;
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    Last edited by Stewie Simpson; 06-23-2021 at 7:46 AM.

  14. #29
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    New handle design.

    Its been a while since I posted an update on the backsaw builds. I wasnt totally happy with the general shape of the Brookes handle. I had shortened the grip length from original, but the neck area between the grip and the cheeks still concerned me. Rather than make further changes to the drawing I put it aside and am using an earlier open handle design that I had used in the past. Its by Moses Eadon (circa 1800s). In the attachments I have also included a photo of the handle template using steel dowels that allows me to accurately mark out the handle shape on both primary flats. It makes the later removal of waste outside the lines so much easier to complete.

    regards Stewie;
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  15. #30
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    This is the most heated discussion of woodworking saws I’ve witnessed. I’m new around here, but is this normal? You guys really like your saws.

    Great info though…

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