Hand plane features

[Jim Matthews]

Attachment 458231



I have a few tiny patches of tearout that wont go away.
its dark out so I can load a picture tomorrow

I was taught to "relieve" the corners of the cutting iron so that there are not square corners.

A cambered iron will also avoid "tracking" where a sharp edge leaves a distinct mark in the planed surface.

From your excellent photo it also *appears* that the cap iron and blade do not meet at the outside edges.

If you have a fine cigarette paper or feeler gauge, this can be tested for a gap, which can lead to captured shavings and/or uneven performance.

You are far ahead in your development: I was easily 5 years into our hobby before I even grasped the nature of the problem you will soon solve.

Around 4:00 in the following video, Richard illustrates the concepts discussed at length, above.

https://youtu.be/fVfJxDFNinc

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

I was taught to "relieve" the corners of the cutting iron so that there are not square corners.

A cambered iron will also avoid "tracking" where a sharp edge leaves a distinct mark in the planed surface.

From your excellent photo it also *appears* that the cap iron and blade do not meet at the outside edges.

I did put a camber on it - I can see what yo mean but I think the image is slightly distorted. it looks like the bevel of the cap iron is concaved at the edges down to the corners. I am still considering further rounding of the corners though. I have the faintest of track marks if the blade leaves square. The main issue is its a no.4 and I don't have a wide blade to begin with (I kind of wish I went with the 4-1/2). I would rather avoid further narrowing the width of my shavings at smoothing depth. what do you think?

If you have a fine cigarette paper or feeler gauge, this can be tested for a gap, which can lead to captured shavings and/or uneven performance.

the plane works amazingly - and better the more I learn about tuning it. I actually managed to get shavings thin enough to use a barcode app to read through

You are far ahead in your development: I was easily 5 years into our hobby before I even grasped the nature of the problem you will soon solve.

Thank you so much, largely thanks to resources like the creek! this is an old dream of mine - even though I just started collecting tools and building my bench I have been reading and watching anything I could for the last 10+ years

Around 4:00 in the following video, Richard illustrates the concepts discussed at length, above.

https://youtu.be/fVfJxDFNinc

I think I can do the rounding over technique freehand with my Stanley cap iron. not sure if I have the dexterity to manage it with the LN's
Thanks though!

[Derek Cohen]

I did put a camber on it - I can see what yo mean but I think the image is slightly distorted. it looks like the bevel of the cap iron is concaved at the edges down to the corners. I am still considering further rounding of the corners though. I have the faintest of track marks if the blade leaves square. The main issue is its a no.4 and I don't have a wide blade to begin with (I kind of wish I went with the 4-1/2). I would rather avoid further narrowing the width of my shavings at smoothing depth. what do you think?

Assaf, the problem with the track may be that you are not overlapping the runs enough. It is tempting with narrower planes on wider boards to try and run the plane close to, or just over, the previous line. This will have too little depth of cut to remove the track. Try overlapping more, about 50%.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Koepke]

My blades are not purposely cambered. Using my planes with overlapping runs as Derek describes tends to eliminate any tracks.

Here is something from a decade ago about blade cambering > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?158373

jtk

[Nathan Johnson]

My blades are not purposely cambered. Using my planes with overlapping runs as Derek describes tends to eliminate any tracks.

Here is something from a decade ago about blade cambering > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?158373

jtk

Are you easing the corners, if not specifically cambering?

[Jim Koepke]

Are you easing the corners, if not specifically cambering?

No, as much as possible my blades are sharpened square. On water stones they may develop a camber if the stones haven't been flattened. Most of the time now my blades are honed on Arkansas stones. They are better at staying flat to make a square blade.

A squared blade, without camber, works fine for me.

When taking very light shavings it takes very little difference at the edge of the blade to create a cambered effect. The post linked earlier > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?158373 < demonstrates how just a few strokes on a stone can create a diminishing edge to a shaving, remediating tracks. The blade in that post may have been reground to use in the same plane as a scrub plane. If for some reason my current method of avoiding plane blade tracks stops working there are a few extra blades around that can be cambered and put in service.

With a square blade, thin shavings and a little care tracks do not appear on my work following final smoothing.

The cap iron screw was loose on one of my smoothing planes for a while. The lateral adjustment would shift in use. This caused me to learn about using overlapping paths when smoothing. Riding over a track left by a previous stroke with a very light setting will usually remove the high point at the edge of the track but not shave the low area of the previous cut.

Having the lateral adjustment set with the blade out of square can leave tracks that could possibly be adjusted out.

Imagine a right handed worker smoothing a board. Starting on the work piece at the far side working toward the closest side with the lateral set to cut deeper on the far side of the plane. This will leave tracks on each pass even with overlapping passes. Imagine a bit more and how the lateral adjustment to the other side would change this.

jtk

[Rafael Herrera]

wouldn't the second pass leave its own tracks behind? The last pass would leave a track, wouldn't it?

[Tom Trees]

For me honing at just over 50 degrees,
Efficient planing of stock what won't plane well without use of the cap iron, is at least a 2 plane or two iron profile deal, jack and smoother.

No tracks when using either plane, the profile dictates the cut for me, if I have to work the toughest examples I have, then the iron would be honed like Derek's, and the cut be lighter than on a less dense batch where one could camber their smoother iron only a thin hair more.
Not that one would want to be going in-between profiles often, but not that much/any work, if you plan ahead.

The 5 1/2 jack is the same scenario, and the cap is set for a batch of dense material below, that distance might even be enough for the smoother sometimes.
But if needing the jack set that close, then likely the cap iron in the smoother will need to be around half(ish) the distance somewhere.
SAM_3787.jpg Just beyond a medium cut on a closish cap iron setting..JPG

I'm sure David W will have some panel work somewhere on youtube.

[Jim Koepke]

wouldn't the second pass leave its own tracks behind? The last pass would leave a track, wouldn't it?

There seems to be some confusion here.

For smoothing my planes are usually set to take a shaving of ~0.001" give or take a few ten thousandths. This usually doesn't leave a track.

If the plane is leaving tracks start the first pass with the blade slightly beyond the edge of the piece being worked. With the lateral set to take an even shaving a little overlap on the first pass should remove the track without leaving a new one on that side. Repeat this until the edge of the work piece is slightly overlapped by the blade on the close side.

This is only for tracks left at the edge of the blade. A nick in the blade will leave a track that is best removed by sharpening the blade to remove any nicks.

To sum up:

One can camber a blade to eliminate tracks. The cambering can be extremely light for light shavings. For thicker shavings more cambering is needed.

One can overlap passes to remove a track left on the previous pass. (kind of like covering your tracks?)

For some reason that probably isn't a phenomena occurring only in my shop, a square edge, sharp blade and a light shaving seems to work fine at avoiding tracks.

jtk

[Eric Rathhaus]

Warren - how far back do you hone the high angle? 1/16"? I have some older wooden planes with a slight cure on the cap and certainly under 70 degrees at the intersection with the iron. It would easy to add a small section of 80 degrees at the point of contact but then the angle would fall off quickly to under 30 degrees.

[Warren Mickley]

Warren - how far back do you hone the high angle? 1/16"? I have some older wooden planes with a slight cure on the cap and certainly under 70 degrees at the intersection with the iron. It would easy to add a small section of 80 degrees at the point of contact but then the angle would fall off quickly to under 30 degrees.

When I was trying to learn this method 45 years ago, I had one sample which was giving me trouble. I honed a tiny flat at 75 or 80 degrees and that made the difference. You could not really see the flat without a lens; I think it was about 1/100 of an inch high. Now I just have a rounded bevel that ends up about 80 degrees, but there is no flat wall at a given angle. Peter Nicholson, writing in 1812 says the bevel on the cap iron must be rounded and not flat.

I'll say a few words about the camber on the cutting iron. It is nice to have an even radius. If you just round the corners, you can still see the tracks, (though they are less noticeable), and you will really notice it if the iron is even slightly crooked. I think the ideal is for the shaving thickness feathers to nothing at the very edge. If you find that the plane only cuts at the center of the iron, there is too much camber. If you find that the shaving goes all the way to the edges, maybe not enough camber. We make the adjustment when we sharpen.