Page 5 of 5 FirstFirst 12345
Results 61 to 72 of 72

Thread: Convert Jointer Guard from European bridge style to American Porkchop Style

  1. #61
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Western Nebraska
    Posts
    4,215
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy D Jones View Post
    A Euro guard helps train and remind the user to avoid the cutter head as the guard is used, by blocking the user from pressing down on the stock while their hand passes near the cutter head when face jointing.

    A pork chop guard does not do that.

    The Euro guards I have seen and used are also significantly wider (i.e. longer in the direction of cut) than the exposed cutter head between the tables, further helping to keep fingers safely away from the cutter head.

    Also, the thicker the stock being face jointed, the less likely it is to completely shatter over the cutter head, which means that the bigger the potential gap between table and Euro guard, the less likely the gap is to occur.

    The more likely stock to shatter completely is relatively thin, which leaves a much narrower gap between a (properly adjusted) Euro guard and table, through which the hand might contact the cutter head under the Euro guard, in the event of shattering.

    Do you really want to compare the gaping void (your words) between Euro guard and table when surface jointing and the stock shatters, with that of a pork chop that has swung completely out of the way?

    But in the end, no guard is perfect, not even the one between our ears, though both work best in tandem.

    -- Andy - Arlington TX
    Andy, you'll hopefully agree that if a user needs reminded to avoid the cutterhead, he shouldn't be running the machine. See my pics for the gaping void problem. My guard is nearly 4" wide. Thicker stock makes the gap much wider quickly, it's much bigger even with full 8/4 stock. This is just a 1 1/2" thick 2x6 because it was handy.

    The bigger problem is that the proper technique for jointing is down pressure on outfeed table. By jumping over a euro guard, you loose consistent outfeed pressure, so the results are less consistent. A pork chop gets out of the way so your push sticks or whatever don't have to be repositioned. You may notice that my guard is really dusty from hanging on the wall, it just gets left off usually and a power feeder swings over to face joint if I'm doing much of it. If not using the power feeder, proper technique requires some sort of a push stick to move the stock through as the cut completes, you see one way that it can be done in the pic. Those grip pads might also work but I don't 100% trust them.

    Another issue is that the dust collector moves air pretty much in the direction of the red arrow, and I can feel it tugging on my shirt as I push through. That big gap under the euro guard directs the air differently, it's not something I notice happening on the other jointer in my shop which is a porkchop machine.

    Last edited by Steve Rozmiarek; 05-15-2021 at 12:09 PM.

  2. #62
    I cant label technique on a jointer any one way as it changes for different material and what is is. Pork chop usless if im dropping on long stock. Traction I get on a board different was well. There is a rubbermaid with a damp sponge that my hand often hits while im jointing. Ive done tons of heal of palm of hand on the trailing edge and when im smarter I use the one push device I like then if that same board was 12 feet long and traction was fine id be totally on the outfeed. There is not only push down but a balance of down an forward. You can be down on the outfeed and forward on the infeed not pushing down but I find it hard to sit here and say what I do as its more just it goes on its own from doing it lots. Off the machines for a while it comes back quickly. On them lots of hours it all just flows more natural. This is my fav when im being smart enough to use it trailing edge of the board. hand position on those paddle things or gripper things of no interest to me that is not a natural hand position to me. sand paper long since removed as I realized could leave grit remnants that would trash knives. Off cut of 8/4 hounduras mahog with many miles on it


    P1960002.jpg

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Yorkville,IL
    Posts
    259
    I build this guard for my 16" jointer. I went to woodworking trade school in Czech Republic and guard like this was on every jointer in every wood shop.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Jaromir

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    909
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaromir Svoboda View Post
    I build this guard for my 16" jointer. I went to woodworking trade school in Czech Republic and guard like this was on every jointer in every wood shop.
    Looks great. Do you have any detailed shots on how you made it?

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Yorkville,IL
    Posts
    259
    More pictures.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Jaromir

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Arlington, TX
    Posts
    427
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Rozmiarek View Post
    Andy, you'll hopefully agree that if a user needs reminded to avoid the cutterhead, he shouldn't be running the machine. See my pics for the gaping void problem. My guard is nearly 4" wide. Thicker stock makes the gap much wider quickly, it's much bigger even with full 8/4 stock. This is just a 1 1/2" thick 2x6 because it was handy.

    The bigger problem is that the proper technique for jointing is down pressure on outfeed table. By jumping over a euro guard, you loose consistent outfeed pressure, so the results are less consistent. A pork chop gets out of the way so your push sticks or whatever don't have to be repositioned. You may notice that my guard is really dusty from hanging on the wall, it just gets left off usually and a power feeder swings over to face joint if I'm doing much of it. If not using the power feeder, proper technique requires some sort of a push stick to move the stock through as the cut completes, you see one way that it can be done in the pic. Those grip pads might also work but I don't 100% trust them.

    Another issue is that the dust collector moves air pretty much in the direction of the red arrow, and I can feel it tugging on my shirt as I push through. That big gap under the euro guard directs the air differently, it's not something I notice happening on the other jointer in my shop which is a porkchop machine.
    Steve,

    I can't see your pix.

    We can add not wearing loose clothing while operating machinery to the list.
    That's what my canvas shop apron is for.

    If I'm face jointing thick stock, I adjust the fence to suit the width of that stock, minimizing any exposure of the cutterhead through the gap between guard and table. Here is where I wish I had a couple of shorter Euro guards for my Hammer that didn't stick out so far (they are not segmented/hinged like the more expensive lines.) Has anybody purchased a second Hammer guard bar, and cut it into 2 shorter (1/3 & 2/3 length) pieces? I've seen people fashion shorter, wooden guards for them.

    Jim Becker described the proper heel and finger-tip method of transferring the hand safely over the Euro guard from infeed to outfeed table during face-jointing, while maintaining steady pressure and feed. If your hands are not big enough for that, then I can see where it would be a problem. But for me, I am much more comfortable with a Euro guard.

    -- Andy - Arlington TX

  7. #67
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Alberta
    Posts
    1,820
    I was going to build a segmented guard like the one above until I tried out a euro style guard. I welded up a post assembly and made two different guards to slide in from 1/2'' thick plastic irrigation pipe (12'' diameter). this gave my guards the convex shape to go over the cutter head. Using it is straight forward ,the biggest advantage is the cutters are always covered when face jointing as well as the tactile clue as to exactly where the cutter is. My jointer is 16" wide ,and at that width a porkchop style guard is too big and awkward for me.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Western Nebraska
    Posts
    4,215
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy D Jones View Post
    Steve,

    I can't see your pix.

    We can add not wearing loose clothing while operating machinery to the list.
    That's what my canvas shop apron is for.

    If I'm face jointing thick stock, I adjust the fence to suit the width of that stock, minimizing any exposure of the cutterhead through the gap between guard and table. Here is where I wish I had a couple of shorter Euro guards for my Hammer that didn't stick out so far (they are not segmented/hinged like the more expensive lines.) Has anybody purchased a second Hammer guard bar, and cut it into 2 shorter (1/3 & 2/3 length) pieces? I've seen people fashion shorter, wooden guards for them.

    Jim Becker described the proper heel and finger-tip method of transferring the hand safely over the Euro guard from infeed to outfeed table during face-jointing, while maintaining steady pressure and feed. If your hands are not big enough for that, then I can see where it would be a problem. But for me, I am much more comfortable with a Euro guard.

    -- Andy - Arlington TX
    Photos sure are problematic here. Try this.

    Euro guard fault.jpg

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Princeton, NJ
    Posts
    6,800
    Blog Entries
    7
    At long last:

    C3200904-5F5F-42E4-8163-0E2774B69DF4.jpgC3200904-5F5F-42E4-8163-0E2774B69DF4.jpg

    This guard is fantastic, it’s driven by a gas spring and actually holds tight to the fence.
    Bumbling forward into the unknown.

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Arlington, TX
    Posts
    427
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Rozmiarek View Post
    Photos sure are problematic here. Try this.

    Euro guard fault.jpg
    Steve,

    That sure looks to me like a less accessible void than a porkchop guard leaves when the board is in the same position.

    And it is certainly a smallervoid than left by a porkchop guard with the stock entirely past the cutter, but not yet past the porkchop guard, preventing the guard from pivoting to cover the cutter at all.

    I've used both, and prefer the Euro guard, but it is not perfect. Such does not exist.

    -- Andy - Arlington TX

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    909
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Holcombe View Post
    At long last:

    C3200904-5F5F-42E4-8163-0E2774B69DF4.jpgC3200904-5F5F-42E4-8163-0E2774B69DF4.jpg

    This guard is fantastic, it’s driven by a gas spring and actually holds tight to the fence.
    Ah yes, the moment ive waited for! How did you mount the guard to your machine? Did you have an OEM pork chop guard in place originally? I think i will need to tap my machine's base and add a mounting block for the pivot point of the guard.

    It looks sweet, i think im going to do it.

  12. #72
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Princeton, NJ
    Posts
    6,800
    Blog Entries
    7
    It comes with a nice mounting block which I had to remove for this. I’ll probably move the pivot point closer to the infeed side by about 1-2” to get a better position.

    I had a pork chop, this is much better.
    Bumbling forward into the unknown.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •