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Thread: Saw footprint & horsepower thoughts/questions...so I need opinions!!

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    104
    For $100 more I see no reason *not* to get a 5HP upgrade, but at the same time I've never had a problem bogging down my 3HP cabinet saw unless the blade was missing teeth. If I were looking for a new cabinet saw and not considering a SawStop then I'd look awfully close at 12 inch blade models. In that case I'd want a 5HP motor.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Camas, Wa
    Posts
    3,684
    I have a 3hp G01023RL. It is fine. I cut a lot of 4/4 hard maple without issue. I don't cut a lot of 8/4 but the right blade will make a difference. I didn't have a 30A circuit when I bought it but I have several other 5hp now. so I had to run it eventually. You can attach the Saw Stop slider to the Grizzly. Wort thing that can happen is you might have to drill a few holes that match up but I am guessing it is a universal fit. Grizzly used to offer a sliding attachment but I don't see it anymore. It looks like it is still marketed under the Shop Fox name(W1822). I have the JessEm Mast-R-Slide on mine. I love mine but they no longer make it.

  3. #18
    I cannot imagine a 3hp not being enough - especially if you are willing to change blades for deep rips. I use a 1.75hp PCS and I need a thin kerf blade but I can use an all around blade for 3 inch deep rips in softwood. Hardwood will probably require the ripping blade, haven't done deep rips in hardwood yet. Inch to inch and a half are fine with all around. I have zero desire to "upgrade".

    With respect to cost, it is wise to consider what one incident will cost. I had used table saws for literally decades until a dumb decision last year led to a broken bone and six stitches - despite using a sawstop. I would have lost the end of a finger, at least, with a Grizzly. I mentioned that I was still injured deliberately, I think SS oversells a little with their claim of no serious injury but it is factual that they help a lot if you touch the blade. The difference in medical cost of my mistake was easily greater than the difference in cost of the saws. I'm not trying to talk you into anything, just providing a point to consider.

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    852
    OP, i see you mention 8/4, but if you work with 8/4+ very often then i would definitely go 5hp+ and possibly a 12/14" format. I know you are limited in footprint, but there isnt much practical size difference between a 10" saw and a small slider like Rod, or a 12" saw. They tend to be deeper machines, which you will probably have on a smaller machine in the form of outfeed support. However, the width is predicated on the rip fence you choose, and so they often occupy a similar footprint as a 10" saw, but are significantly heftier. As an example, my old unisaw's footprint was very close to the footprint of my Felder KF700 without the outrigger. Possibly 8" shallower than a PM72, and about 12" less than my Martin T17(also minus the outrigger/sliding table). At the end of the day, if those extra 8-12" arent critical to your shop, then i think you can fit a lot more machine than you think. There are a lot of options between the footprint of a 10" cabinet saw and a large format slider.

    As to power, i actually consider 3hp to be pretty light when it comes to 2"+ hardwood. Sharp and clean blades definitely help, but i stalled my 3hp unisaw all the time. Sometimes wood has tension in it from growth or case hardening, and you simply need power to muscle through those forces. Ive had wood clamp firmly down on a riving knife/splitter many times, and more power is actually your ally there. Ive found a saw to be more of a kickback hazard when its underpowered. Same with my 5hp pm72. Tripped the VFD half a dozen times in a year of ownership.

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Cambridge Vermont
    Posts
    1,276
    I have a PM66 with a 3hp Baldor (not that it should make a difference). I've yet to bog it down. That includes cutting 8/4 hard maple at a 45 to make some curved boxes. That was with a full kerf 50 tpi blade. If given a choice for a small upgrade price I would go with 5hp but if it came down to getting a 3hp saw now vs waiting months for the 5hp I don't think I would wait. Is there a reason why you aren't think about a Sawstop? Not that I'm pushing you toward one and not wanting to get into the safety aspect debate but I have yet to hear anyone complain about fit or finish. If a slider is not an option and you're looking at a "lifetime" saw I would put them on my list. Is used out of the question? I bought my PM66 used and spent some time to clean up the internals and replace the bearings in the arbor and motor. Just refreshed it, not a restoration with new paint.

  6. #21
    The vast majority of our sliding table saws ship with 4hp (S6/40%) motors and I've never bogged one down. Not even close, in fact.

    Erik
    Felder USA Territory Representative: Central & South Texas

  7. #22
    I have an old delta unisaw with a 2hp RI motor in it . Cuts anything I run through it . A 3 hp motor would be fine

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Tampa Bay, FL
    Posts
    2,464
    Using the wrong blade, I have actually bogged down a 5HP Sawstop ICS. So it is possible. With the correct rip blade, it powered through like butter.
    - "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
    - The difference between an amateur and professional is that the amateur practices until he gets it right. The professional practices until he can't get it wrong

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Princeton, NJ
    Posts
    6,690
    Blog Entries
    7
    5hp, no question.

    More horsepower provided very little downside outside of the need to use a different size for leads.

    In industrial applications there is a tendency toward more HP even if the application could do with less becuase a larger motor with a lower strain will live longer than a lower Hp under strain closer to its full output.
    Bumbling forward into the unknown.

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Perth, Australia
    Posts
    7,854
    Ryan, my Hammer K3 Winner is 4 hp and cuts through very hard West Australian timber with ease. All up it has a smaller footprint than the contract saw it replaced. The 1350mm long slider can also be locked down to become a cabinet saw with a 31” wide rip. The micro adjustable rip fence may be used high or low.



    This saw meets all my needs. I have no desire to upgrade.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  11. #26
    Update:

    Did a lot of thinking after making a TON of calls. Checked out some stuff and watched a ton of video's and I listened to you guys. One thing stuck in my head though...and that was the thought of cutting of my fingers. I made it through the Army alive, and I prefer to make it through woodworking with all of my digits and this ugly mug intact. Fast forward to today and I was able to see a sawstop in person that is used all the time and I was impressed.

    So long story short, I have tenatively decided on the 36" PCS 3HP. I am going to have to run a new drop out to my tiny garage for it, but I think it will be well worth it. I even told my wife that I would sell one of my service rifle scopes, a mount for it as well as my annealer that I never use to compensate for the cost I will be incurring.

    So time shall tell and we shall see what transpires.


    Oh...and that big 14" Rikon band saw is nice....

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    New Brunswick, Canada
    Posts
    185
    Congratulations! It’s a nice saw with some great features. Enjoy!

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    NW Indiana
    Posts
    2,639
    It seems that every thread on table saws has someone mentioning the K3 but does not mention the price. I just looked up the price on it and was close to $8400! Wow...very nice saws but much more than a very good table saw.

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    New Brunswick, Canada
    Posts
    185
    Hi Larry,
    I just made a similar comment on a different Sawstop thread. I wasn’t sure of the actual price but suspected it was a serious upcharge over the PCS that was being discussed. Thanks for enlightening me. That is a significant amount of money.
    Best regards,
    David

  15. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Toronto Ontario
    Posts
    10,344
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Frank View Post
    It seems that every thread on table saws has someone mentioning the K3 but does not mention the price. I just looked up the price on it and was close to $8400! Wow...very nice saws but much more than a very good table saw.
    That must be for the largest model...........Rod.

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